[Sly Fox]

I am curious to hear thoughts on where some of you stand on some of the proposed immigration reform concepts. Do you follow the hard line GOP stance or are you among the growing number of Evangelicals who are rethinking their position?

Full Disclosure: I helped prepare my pastor for Senate testimony on the Gang of Eight Bill yesterday and I admit my position has changed rather significantly toward reform in recent years. Although I will admit I do have to question myself any time that I am on the same side of an issue as my former Illinois congressman Durbin.

[4everfsu]

I am against granting amnesty to any illegal immigrants regardless of which ever bills come out.
I am for shutting down the borders, better then what has been done in the past.

[Purple Haize]

I think we need to change the paradigm of the discussion. Reject a comprehensive bill and start talking about a Step By Step approach. This is a multi-faceted problem and should be dealt with as such. Deal with Border Security first. Don't discuss, debate bargain etc. until that is addressed. Keep the status quo. Then move onto the next step, Visas, Guest Worker whatever. Then just deal with that the same way as the first. It would take longer but would have a more beneficial outcome. Which means it won't happen. Ha

[ALUmnus]

Stop the influx immediately. Then...

If you've been here illegally, we're not going to send you home, that's clear. So I find it justifiable to let them stay and work. But I don't think they should be granted citizenship or be eligible for any social welfare or benefits. Stay and work, there's your opportunity and the sky's the limit. But you can't vote and we won't pay your way. Get some type of official identification/status and make a good life for your family. If you find yourself in need, churches, charities, and communities will take care of you.

There are thousands lined up to do this the right way. Speed up their process.

[jbock13]

In my opinion it's sort of a phony argument since both parties seem to enjoy the status quo right now of illegals freely coming to our land.

The border needs to be closed, but that will never occur so that's just that.

[Purple Haize]

Stop the influx immediately. Then...

If you've been here illegally, we're not going to send you home, that's clear. So I find it justifiable to let them stay and work. But I don't think they should be granted citizenship or be eligible for any social welfare or benefits. Stay and work, there's your opportunity and the sky's the limit. But you can't vote and we won't pay your way. Get some type of official identification/status and make a good life for your family. If you find yourself in need, churches, charities, and communities will take care of you.

There are thousands lined up to do this the right way. Speed up their process.

If they pay taxes shouldn't they be allowed the benefits? Or are you saying that is part of 'The Deal'. You can stay, work earn money and pay taxes, just don't expect any of the benefits? Obviously they will benefit some but more to the point Unemployment, Social Security, etc?

[NotAJerry]

There are thousands lined up to do this the right way. Speed up their process.

This can't be said often enough. There are plenty of options that want to help integrate people into our society correctly, let them do that.

[NotAJerry]

My position is that the only way a true shut down would happen is if we fine/prosecute the companies that openly advertise for illegals to come and work for them and provide them with the transportation to get here. Those same businesses then call ICE anytime some of those workers start asking for basic human rights in their working conditions. The problem isn't the workers coming in.

With that said, shutting down the borders would be stupid. If folks are willing to come in and work in the fields as an honest means of getting by, which most people already in the country won't, then we should be encouraging them to come and do those jobs. Additionally, we need a complete revamp on our asinine citizenship requirements that force those trying to naturalize to be far more informed about the US than the vast majority of those born here. If someone is willing to come in, work hard, pay taxes, and doesn't have any red flag regarding their associations then let them come in and work.

[Purple Haize]

My position is that the only way a true shut down would happen is if we fine/prosecute the companies that openly advertise for illegals to come and work for them and provide them with the transportation to get here. Those same businesses then call ICE anytime some of those workers start asking for basic human rights in their working conditions. The problem isn't the workers coming in.

With that said, shutting down the borders would be stupid. If folks are willing to come in and work in the fields as an honest means of getting by, which most people already in the country won't, then we should be encouraging them to come and do those jobs. Additionally, we need a complete revamp on our asinine citizenship requirements that force those trying to naturalize to be far more informed about the US than the vast majority of those born here. If someone is willing to come in, work hard, pay taxes, and doesn't have any red flag regarding their associations then let them come in and work.

Most people prefer securing the border not closing it. Will people still enter illegally? Sure. But in much smaller numbers then they are now.

[ALUmnus]

Stop the influx immediately. Then...

If you've been here illegally, we're not going to send you home, that's clear. So I find it justifiable to let them stay and work. But I don't think they should be granted citizenship or be eligible for any social welfare or benefits. Stay and work, there's your opportunity and the sky's the limit. But you can't vote and we won't pay your way. Get some type of official identification/status and make a good life for your family. If you find yourself in need, churches, charities, and communities will take care of you.

There are thousands lined up to do this the right way. Speed up their process.

If they pay taxes shouldn't they be allowed the benefits? Or are you saying that is part of 'The Deal'. You can stay, work earn money and pay taxes, just don't expect any of the benefits? Obviously they will benefit some but more to the point Unemployment, Social Security, etc?

Taxes are used for many things. They would still get free education for their children, free public attorney, treatment at hospitals, police & fire, etc. But if you came here illegally, sorry but you lose citizenship and all the rights that come with it, and you don't get to put your hand in the cookie jar or social welfare benefits. Current legal immigrants and foreigners pay taxes, it's just part of living here.

The whole thing is so much more complicated, though. There would so many unforeseen consequences to the current reform proposals. And with the history and incompetence of this Congress, the number and severety of those unforeseen consequences has a much higher baseline.

[Purple Haize]

I was thinking that they would be treated somewhat similar to people who are citizens of one country and work in another. Very interesting thought you have.

[jbock13]

I think by shutting down the border, they mean closing it to where it's difficult for illegals to get over. At least that's my interpretation of it.

It's one of the few areas where I disagree with Ron Paul.

[Purple Haize]

I think by shutting down the border, they mean closing it to where it's difficult for illegals to get over. At least that's my interpretation of it.

It's one of the few areas where I disagree with Ron Paul.

I say secure it. I'm a fan of the 'fence'. To me that's securing not closing the border.

[alabama24]

Here are some of my thoughts:

1. The US has a right and obligation to know who is in the country.
2. We have a need for more workers than our naturalized population allows for.
3. The government's policies (and lack of enforcement) has created a "wink and a nod" encouragement of illegal immigration.
4. People who have "followed the rules" deserve the first shot at citizenship.
5. There should be a process that fairly considers illegal immigrants for citizenship.
6. The process should not be "automatic," and should take into consideration those who obeyed the rules.
7. Companies which willfully break the employment rules should be hammered.
8. The border should be secured by all means necessary. There will obviously be people who slip in… but it should be a light sprinkle and not a fire hose.

[jbock13]

I think by shutting down the border, they mean closing it to where it's difficult for illegals to get over. At least that's my interpretation of it.

It's one of the few areas where I disagree with Ron Paul.

I say secure it. I'm a fan of the 'fence'. To me that's securing not closing the border.

You say tomato, I say tomato. It's the same thing as what I mean.

[Humble_Opinion]

Here are some of my thoughts:

1. The US has a right and obligation to know who is in the country.
2. We have a need for more workers than our naturalized population allows for.
3. The government's policies (and lack of enforcement) has created a "wink and a nod" encouragement of illegal immigration.
4. People who have "followed the rules" deserve the first shot at citizenship.
5. There should be a process that fairly considers illegal immigrants for citizenship.
6. The process should not be "automatic," and should take into consideration those who obeyed the rules.
7. Companies which willfully break the employment rules should be hammered.
8. The border should be secured by all means necessary. There will obviously be people who slip in… but it should be a light sprinkle and not a fire hose.

I agree with most of these points, except for #2. We have more than enough able-bodied people to work construction, tend to the fields, and all of the other occupations the illegals tend to pursue. The issue is that these folks have no motivation to get out and take any job that comes to them. The American Dream has become an entitlement program... not a pursuit, which in my opinion is a very dangerous thing. Every good characteristic about a society is only a generation away from being extinguished forever. I fear we are close to that point.

On the topic of Border Security. The border has to be secured first and foremost. Once that has been done to the satisfaction of the states that currently sit on the border, then we can discuss further reforms to guest worker programs, etc. I'd also like to see a 'check' to federal power in this case so that they can no longer use immigration as another weapon to play politics with. Whether this means allowing states to play a role in enforcing the border laws or some other idea, it's an item that must be solved. The child loophole needs to be closed/reformed as well. At this point the temporary programs can be put into place, and the businesses who hired these folks should be the ones that carry out the process. It would be hard to track, because so many of these illegals were paid in cash, but I think a reasonable amount of back taxes should be paid before the former illegal aliens are permitted to become full citizens.

[bluedevilflame]

The fact of the matter is this matter should have been taken up years ago. Our government knew the growing problem of border security and the influx of illegal immigrants in our country but they sat back and allowed the status quo to go on for far too long. Now we have millions of illegal immigrants in our country with no means to return to their countries, we have local law enforcement and federal agencies that simply don't have the manpower nor the funding to round up individuals to be deported on a large scale, and the biggest issue of all to me, children of illegals that are citizens of this country. In theory, I don't like giving amnesty to those that came here illegally, but really what are we going to do? They are here now, they work, a lot now have children that are full blood citizens, I can't see anyway around not granting amnesty at this point. Let's talk about securing borders and changing the visa system and so forth starting now, not in the past, it's too late for that now.

[ATrain]

I say we should just annex Mexico. That would allow greater resources to fight the drug cartels, gives us access to their oil reserves, a smaller southern border which should be easier to secure, and remove one of our main competitors for manufacturing industries.

[Purple Haize]

I say we should just annex Mexico. That would allow greater resources to fight the drug cartels, gives us access to their oil reserves, a smaller southern border which should be easier to secure, and remove one of our main competitors for manufacturing industries.

Sorta like an E Germany/W Germany thing!

[bluedevilflame]

I say we should just annex Mexico. That would allow greater resources to fight the drug cartels, gives us access to their oil reserves, a smaller southern border which should be easier to secure, and remove one of our main competitors for manufacturing industries.

Conference realignment for countries.... I say we take Canada while we're at it!

[Purple Haize]

I say we should just annex Mexico. That would allow greater resources to fight the drug cartels, gives us access to their oil reserves, a smaller southern border which should be easier to secure, and remove one of our main competitors for manufacturing industries.

Conference realignment for countries.... I say we take Canada while we're at it!

We offered Canada but they are dragging their feet. They don't know if they are up for the added expense and warm weather. Mexico is trying to go 'Population Only' with no land. I think we want then in all the way.

[bluedevilflame]

I say we should just annex Mexico. That would allow greater resources to fight the drug cartels, gives us access to their oil reserves, a smaller southern border which should be easier to secure, and remove one of our main competitors for manufacturing industries.

Conference realignment for countries.... I say we take Canada while we're at it!

We offered Canada but they are dragging their feet. They don't know if they are up for the added expense and warm weather. Mexico is trying to go 'Population Only' with no land. I think we want then in all the way.

Plus if Canada would make the jump, they would be a good way to bridge the gap between the lower 48 and Alaska

[Purple Haize]

Well right now, Alaska is in our conference but way outside our foot print. Their revenue though is awesome. Doing what we can to get Canada would help with travel costs and rivalries. I know the Trans Siberian Conference boards are buzzing with Alaska jumping to their conference but I don't see it. They get much better global exposure if they stay where they are at. Plus, if we add Canada it makes them happy.

[flamehunter]

I don't get the whole Hawaii thing. The travel is ridiculous and their TV market share is way down the list. They should be relegated to the Islands conference with the likes of the Philippines and Taiwan. I'd like to see us take Japan in their place.

[Purple Haize]

I don't get the whole Hawaii thing. The travel is ridiculous and their TV market share is way down the list. They should be relegated to the Islands conference with the likes of the Philippines and Taiwan. I'd like to see us take Japan in their place.

On the Vegemite Sandwich Blog, @colinhey Tweeted that Australia and New Zealand were pushing Singapore and the Philippines hard to make a move on Guam and Hawaii. They are expecting both Taiwan and possibly Samoa to look elsewhere