[badger74]

The coach took over a very down program. He has them playing much better football already but it takes three years to recruit and improve with better players. When Alvarez took over at Wisconsin he had three straight losing seasons and two of them were 1-10. But you could see improvement and by the fourth year we went to the Rose Bowl and won it. Look for the areas that are getting better and wait for him to fill the holes that are just too weak right now to do much with. Also they will be hitting the weights more and getting stronger and tougher each year. That's what good coaches have the players doing and believing in. Games are won in the off-season workouts and how hard the guys work to get better.

[Sly Fox]

Sometimes it takes a third party to keep things in perspective. Gracias, badger.

[SuperJon]

I agree with everything you said. However, when you've put the time, money, and effort into the games like some of us this year, it's insanely hard when you lose games by 7, 1, and 3 points. Coach Rocco is still the only coach I want of this team and I'm behind him 100%, it's just hard to sit through this stuff every week.

[thepostman]

I hope more then anything that all the different things i have said about this weeks game as far as conservative play calling and that kind of thing doesn't translate to most people that I am Rocco bashing....I think he has this program going in the right direction....he is learning as well and he will grow and get better as a coach and playcaller...he is a class act and someone we can all be proud to represent our school...he knows what he is doing, and I have complete faith things will be much different around here in a couple of years, its just too bad i won't be around to see it.....well graduation is a bit better then being here, but still.....

[PAmedic]

good post BADGER: GO PENN STATE!

and POSTMAN, you'll never leave. Just like the rest of us, you think you're driving past the guardshack for the last time, and 20 years later- you're still driving past it, but with the wife and kids !

[TIMSCAR20]

Guys I have not been able to go back to the game thread yet but I have talked with some of you guys about yesterday at the postgame flamefans tailgate. I have to say that Gardner-Webb really found a weakness in our secondary but I don't think we tried to go nickel and Dime packages until it was too late. They already had the rythm by the time we tried to match up. We stayed with 4 linebackers on the field when they were 4 wide and they picked the zone apart. Give credit to the Bulldogs passing game because they protected the QB and he made great decisions. If I were the D coordinator (and it is way too easy to second guess this stuff after the fact) I would have dropped 9 and rushed 2. I would have made them have to try to run the ball again. They went 4 wide spread for vitually the whole second half to try to get the linebackers (who are our best defensive players) on pass coverage vs wide outs. It was a chess match that we kept losing. Quite honestly when we went dime man at the end (7 dbs) it was still a mismatch because the front 3 or 4 (linebacker rushing) couldn't get anywhere near the QB. I think we knew what they were doing, we just didn't have any answers for it really.

[auntieann]

Scar, could not have said it better, that is what my family and I said, you took the words that I was thinking. thanks for the insight.

[HarrisburgFlame]

Right on the money SCAR. I see this more as a personnel issue than a coaching issue. First of all the people around me at the game are screaming "blitz more". Well we did bring 6 and 7 guys on occasion and couldn't get to the QB. In that situation you are asking guys to play one on one and cover in space with no help. Heck they were having a hard enough time breaking on the ball playing zone. When we go man up it scares me to death. if we were getting to the QB and knocking him down - forcing early throws - keep bringing heat. Bottom line - we couldn't get any pressure on the kid.

When we played zone - rushed 4 mostly - couldn't get the LB'ers underneath the hooks and curls. At times we rushed 3 and dropped 8 and still couldn't get underneath the curl and the DBs weren't breaking on the ball playing the soft zone. Honestly, I question how good these corners are in coverage. we played a bunch of cover 2 and that should be good against the hooks and curls. You got two guys deep - rushing four - you can have the corners sink break on anything to the flats - drop three in the hooks. GWU did a nice job of getting their WRs to settle in the windows in the zone. To SCAR's point - our nickel and dime packages are probably ineffective due to the fact we aren't very deep at DB. You have your best DB's out there on every snap and beyond the starters we really don't have quality DBs to bring in when we go nickel and dime.

This loss really hurts but I don't think this team is going to tank this year. We'll see the real measure of this program going into 2007 and 2008 once Rocco gets a few more quality kids (hopefully) into the program. One more point, punting the ball on our last drive was the right move. You don't get the first down there and give a hot QB the short field you are practically giving them the game right there. You play the percentages - kick them in the hole and hope they force a bad throw, or we get a stop and get the ball back. just didn't work out that way.

I am still excited about the direction of the program. If nothing else, we are getting the tailgate thing down!

[backintheday]

I agree, HarrisburgFlame, that the inability to defend the pass in the second half was probably more of a personnel issue than a coaching issue. The problem to me is that we were neither able to defend the pass in the secondary or get a solid rush on the quarterback. That seems to indicate weakness in both areas. This was the first game that I was able to see personally and I guess I was surprised at the defense's ineffectiveness in the second half since they seemed to play well against Towson and W&M.

I also agree that we need to be patient and I still think that the future is bright. Hopefully the fans won't bail out too quickly. By the way, someone needs to tell the fans on the press box side of the field that they are not at the TRBC Sunday morning service. Way too quiet! I go to a Penn State game each year and was there for the Northwestern game a few weeks ago. EVERYBODY, including the 74 year old Grama's are screaming! Now I know Williams Stadium isn't Beaver Stadium but maybe PA Medic needs be there to check some pulses!

[TIMSCAR20]

BITD,

you are right about the "Baptist" side of the stadium. I feel like Smoothie, and me were the only guys that were cheering at times. I know that wasn't the case but it felt that way. Personally I am just glad they are coming out. After we get them to be regulars, then we will teach them how to cheer. Baby steps.

[HarrisburgFlame]

One other point - since I seem to be a roll here :>)

I think losing Jason Horn is playing a bigger role in this than we have acknowledged. I think his absence is contributing to the lack of pressure up front. We aren't very deep yet on both sides of the ball so anytime you lose a starter who is a significant contributor it's going to hurt.

[SuperJon]

I noticed that the W&M game. It was amazing how much now having one player has hurt us.

[TIMSCAR20]

Great point HBF. I know we are close to something really special with this team and I think a lack of depth has hurt us esp on Saturday. No Horn and not too many db's that we felt could guard mtm and press. Horn is very very valuable in terms of generating a pass rush.

[PAmedic]

I don't know if anyone else posted this- but it bears repeating: a lot of good things are happening to LUFB right now- if you doubt that, read the following, then think about LAST year!

Fanning The Flames

• The Liberty-Gardner-Webb game had 12,054 fans in attendance, marking the sixth-largest crowd in school history and the third largest in Big South Conference history.

• Liberty now holds nine of the Top 10 single game attendance figures in Big South Conference history, including the top eight tallies.

• Liberty currently ranks 14th in the nation in home attendance based upon stadium capacity as the Flames are filling their stadium at 99.28 percent over the first four home games of the year (47,656 fans in total). The Flames are averaging 11,914 fans per game at Williams Stadium this year

• Liberty also ranks 15th nationally in total home attendance and 27th in average per home game (11,914).

• The Gardner-Webb-Liberty game was the 15th highest attended game this week national in NCAA I-AA football.

• For the fifth time this season, the Flames held an opponent scoreless over the first 30 minutes of the game as Gardner-Webb scored all 27 of its points in the second half.

• The Flames entered the Gardner-Webb game having allowed just 31 total second half points over the first six games, but the Bulldogs nearly doubled the number by scoring 27 second half points.

• For the third-straight game and the fifth time this season, the Flames controlled the clock as Liberty finished with a 4:52 time of possession advantage which marked its second-highest TOP edge of the year. Liberty currently leads the Big South Conference as the Flames are holding an average 30:56 time of possession advantage.

• The Flames finished the Gardner-Webb game with a season high in penalty yards as Liberty was whistled for six penalties for 100 yards. The Flames finished the first four games of the year averaging 5.3 penalties per game for 37.0 average yards. However, Liberty has averaged 8.0 infractions per contests over the last three games for an average 91.3 yards per game.

• For the third time this year, the Flames finished a game without a turnover. The Flames currently lead the Big South Conference as Liberty has committed just five turnovers during the first seven games of the year. The next best team in the conference is VMI who has committed 11 turnovers in eight games.

• In a tale of two halves, the Flames finished the first half with a 225 total offensive yard advantage (271 yards to 46 yards), but Gardner-Webb controlled the second half with a 223 total offensive yard advantage (313 yards to 90 yards).

• Despite allowing 27 points, its second-highest total of the year, the Flames still rank sixth in the nation in scoring defense as Liberty is allowing 13.14 points per game.

• For the fifth-straight conference game, the Flames dropped a Big South Conference contest by six or fewer points. The Liberty-Gardner-Webb series has also been close as the past 11 games have been decided by an average of 5.7 points per game.

• Zach Terrell posted his second-best rushing performance of his career by rushing for 175 yards and two touchdowns, averaging 6.0 yards per career. This also marked the second-straight time that Terrell has rushed for more than 100 yards against Gardner-Webb and the second-consecutive week with two touchdowns.

• Zach Terrell became the 14th player in Big South Conference history to surpass the 1,000 career rushing mark in the Gardner-Webb game as Terrell currently has 1,019 career rushing yards to his credit.

• Wynton Jackson finished the game with four catches for 57 yards, helping him surpass the 1,000 career receiving mark as the junior now has 1,034 career receiving yards.

• Manny Rojas moved into sole possession of second place on the Big South’s all-time career tackle list as he finished the Gardner-Webb game with six tackles. Rojas now has 314 career tackles to his credit.

• Ryan Greiser led the Flames in tackles with a career high 12 tackles, including nine solo stops. The 12 tackles and nine solo tackles mark a single game season high for a Liberty defender and Greiser is the second defender to finish a game with double figure tackles.

• The last Liberty defensive back to finish with double-figure tackles was C.J. Moore who recorded 15 tackles against Coastal Carolina in a triple overtime game on October 22, 2005.

[HarrisburgFlame]

Medic:

Thanks for the dose of reality. I sure hope the recruits feel the excitment when they visit. Keep packing the stadium.

Let's pack Vines this winter. Anyone up for a FlameFans Basketball Tailgate in late January?

[givemethemic]

The students don't come back from the break untill the 22nd (We love getting out in the middle of May this year!!!!) A good date, might be Jan 27th the men play VMI at home and the Women play Radford at home the same day as well

[PAmedic]

• Ryan Greiser led the Flames in tackles with a career high 12 tackles, including nine solo stops. The 12 tackles and nine solo tackles mark a single game season high for a Liberty defender and Greiser is the second defender to finish a game with double figure tackles.

[HarrisburgFlame]

I was thinking about you Saturday PAMedic. #24 was all over the field getting in on tackles. I feel good about this weekend. Not sure why but I think we are going to give those CCU guys on heck of a game. We've been so close - time for us to catch a break.

[LUconn]

• Ryan Greiser led the Flames in tackles with a career high 12 tackles, including nine solo stops. The 12 tackles and nine solo tackles mark a single game season high for a Liberty defender and Greiser is the second defender to finish a game with double figure tackles.

This is good and bad. A lot of those tackles were after the catch on that same route that was killing us. I'd rather him not have to make that tackle because one of our LBs defended the pass.

[PAmedic]

killjoy

[TDDance234]

Still brings up a good point.

Horn draws two guys on defense and with him out, frees up an extra blocker to protect their QB.
Which ultimately, opens more lanes and reaches the second and third levels which would lead
to the high tackle totals for our safeties and 'backs.

[LU'sbestmanager]

Medic:

Thanks for the dose of reality. I sure hope the recruits feel the excitment when they visit. Keep packing the stadium.

Let's pack Vines this winter. Anyone up for a FlameFans Basketball Tailgate in late January?

i am. and i hope we do pack it out. it would be crazy to see 8 or 9 thousand at our first game next week

[TIMSCAR20]

Crazy and Highly unlikely. It would be great but there is work to be done yet I think before we see a packed house.

[Purple Haize]

Medic:

Thanks for the dose of reality. I sure hope the recruits feel the excitment when they visit. Keep packing the stadium.

Let's pack Vines this winter. Anyone up for a FlameFans Basketball Tailgate in late January?

i am. and i hope we do pack it out. it would be crazy to see 8 or 9 thousand at our first game next week

Might wanna check the schedule there skippy. Not sure the first game is next week.

[jcmanson]

He's talking about the first exhibition game after the western carolina game on the 4th