[RagingTireFire]

Good vodka is tasteless in and of itself.

There's no such thing as tasteless. (Insert joke here). Absolut-ly everything has a taste to it.

[Sly Fox]

That's perhaps your best post ever, BJ. That is a very mature way of approaching this subject. If you feel a conviction about drinking then consuming any invokes a rebellious spirit inside you. Scriptures are very clear about rebellion.

[blwall1416]

If someone really does some soul-searching about this issue (or any issue, for that matter), and in the end says, "I don't think (insert issue here) is okay for me to do, personally"... I have NO problem with that.

I just don't like when people say, "You can't do that. That's wrong." You ask them why, and they say, "Because my pastor says so"... or "That's just the way I was raised." They never really searched anything on their own... just listened to what someone else said & took it for face value.

[Sly Fox]

And that is why this discussion has merit here.

[blwall1416]

And that is why this discussion has merit here.

Indeed. And I am glad this has remained civil & informative.

[BJWilliams]

I may not be the sharpest guy out there, but I will admit that I owe my parents a lot for teaching me to be able to make decisions and solve problems on my own. Even as someone who was very sheltered, I learned a lot about observing people, especially in middle school, and learned for myself a lot about what is good in life and what is not good.

[FlameDad]

There has never been, nor will there ever be, a truly intelligent discussion about alcohol among Christians.

How would you characterize this thread?

Seems fairly intelligent to me....

[Hold My Own]

Good vodka is tasteless in and of itself.

There's no such thing as tasteless. (Insert joke here). Absolut-ly everything has a taste to it.

I agree Absolut-ly will have taste and even a higher priced top shelf meat like Goose will but keep searching and thats when you'll find the Ultimate

[scuzdriver]

I loved it all as a younger person. Yes even at LU. I decided before I got married that I loved it too much, which couldn't end up well. So I quit. Haven't drank for at least 18 yrs. I can honestly say that I don't miss it at all. Also, I didn't want that to be a stumbling block for not only others, but mainly my kids. They are always watching. I don't tell them it's wrong, I just want them to know that life is just as good without it.

[Ed Dantes]

Sorry if I'm saying things that have already been posted...

I really don't have a problem with drinking. It's hard to say that anyone who takes a drink is sinning when Jesus drank. But I also believe that moderation is the biggest key -- if you get hammered, that's an issue.

I do believe doing it within the constraints of the law is necessary (don't do it until you're over 21, don't drink and drive even if you're not drunk). At Liberty, where it is banned, don't drink on or off-campus.

There's one other thing, though -- you can do all the above and still be in the wrong for drinking if you are with a fellow Christian who may stumble in his own testimony because of your actions. He might have an issue with alcohol (because he's trying to stay on the wagon -- or even the opposite, he's a Holy Roller who thinks that grape juice is pushing it).

The Bible talks about a controversy surrounding food offered to idols. Paul writes that he doesn't have a problem eating the food offered to idols, but he would be sinning if he encouraged other believers who thought it was sin to eat that food.

So there.

[belcherboy]

I loved it all as a younger person. Yes even at LU. I decided before I got married that I loved it too much, which couldn't end up well. So I quit. Haven't drank for at least 18 yrs. I can honestly say that I don't miss it at all. Also, I didn't want that to be a stumbling block for not only others, but mainly my kids. They are always watching. I don't tell them it's wrong, I just want them to know that life is just as good without it.

That is well put. I remember when I came home one summer from Liberty, my friends and I were 19 years old. We all decided to go up the Canada (I live in Detroit) to go to the casino. The legal age to be considered an adult in Canada is 19. You can drink, gamble, etc. My dad is a minister, and I kept many of these type trips from his knowledge. When we walked into the casino, within the first 10 minutes, a friend of mine stuck a $20 bill in the dollar slot machine. On the second pull, he hit for $1700. When I got home, I just had to tell my dad. He listened to the whole story and then asked, "What kind of affect do you think that will have on him?" I told him that he took the money, and gambled no more. He bought us dinner. I basically said he was really cool about it. He then told me, "You never know what winning that money may do to him or those other guys around him." 10+ years later that guy hasn't had a problem with gambling (I'll bet he hasn't been to a casino more than once or twice since), but you never know what affect it could have on him or those around him.

I think the same could be said with drinking. It didn't get control of my life, but I have two friends who have 2-3 DUI's each and it has seriously affected their lives. They began this addiction with me drinking along side, and I have to live with the fact that I have a piece of the beginning of a destructive habit in their lives. Would they have done it without me? I'm pretty darn sure they would have. I just have to live with the fact that I helped that process in their lives. I believe it is important to look at whose lives we could be affecting when making choices like drinking/smoking/etc. Children often changes adults thinking on that .

[blwall1416]

How many of us get upset when we see our friends down a value-sized Big Mac meal from McDonald's? I'm guessing not that many. The fact is, constant eating of this type of food has been proven to be very destructive to one's body. Not so much if consumed every once in a while, but consistent eating causes bodily damage.

Same can be said with alcohol. In moderation....not bad. Overdoing it, consistently....very bad, complete with bodily consequences.

To me, this issue boils down to quantity.

[JDUB]

i don't see any positive reason to drink alcohol.
however, i don't necessarily think there is anything wrong with it. i think in moderation its no worse than anything else. i think too much caffeine is bad for you, so is too much alcohol, and too much of anything else. moderation is important.

but like i said, i can't see anything positive in alcohol. A lot of people look down on it, and for me that is enough reason to not do it.

[blwall1416]

A lot of people look down on it, and for me that is enough reason to not do it.

True. And I think a lot of people look down on it because they know someone who consumed too much & embarrassed themselves and/or those around them.

[bigsmooth]

i see nothing wrong with knocking down a few pops every now and then. getting drunk on the other hand is wrong. so if someone who knows me does not want to be around me because of that, it is certainly your right, but have the guts to tell me. i also respect anyone who does not drink. i personally do not think that having a cold one with dinner makes me less of a christian. i know some christians feel differently and that's ok too....man im thirsty

[adam42381]

Could someone tell me what would be so terribly wrong if my wife and I got completely drunk at home by ourselves? What could happen that makes it a sin? The fact that we might have sex and it could last an extraordinarily long time? I just don't get what the problem would be in that situation.

[SuperJon]

The problem would be that you're drunk, not what could happen.

[4everfsu]

Well lets say a man and woman get drunk at home, what else can happen, spousal abuse, murder, etc. I know a girl who got pregnant by her own father and she was a teenager. In your case what you do as a husband and wife is between you and God. But under the influence of alcohol anything can happen.

[RagingTireFire]

There has never been, nor will there ever be, a truly intelligent discussion about alcohol among Christians.

How would you characterize this thread?

Seems fairly intelligent to me....

I rest my case.

[adam42381]

Alcohol tends to bring out the true personality of the person drinking it. I'm not the type to beat my wife or even kill her so I'm pretty sure I'm okay in that regard. Just saying that it's wrong because I would be drunk doesn't answer my question. What is it about being drunk that makes it wrong. I can't really make a fool out of myself at home. Let's go a step further and say that I'm home alone and get a pretty good buzz going. I just don't see the harm. Sure, it can lead to alcoholism, yada yada yada, but if it's a one time thing, then what? I'm asking this from a truly curious perspective.

[RagingTireFire]

Alcohol tends to bring out the true personality of the person drinking it.

Exhibit B to my above post. This statement is patently ridiculous.

[adam42381]

Alcohol tends to bring out the true personality of the person drinking it.

Exhibit B to my above post. This statement is patently ridiculous.

How is it ridiculous? If you are typically an angry person, you're probably an angry drunk. Funny people are still funny. Sad people get sadder. I always try to think through things normally in life and that's why I've never had a one night stand or hooked up with somebody when I've been been drinking (back in the days before I met my wife). I always considered the consequences of what I was doing even when I was drinking. I think alcohol just opens people up more than usual.

[RagingTireFire]

That's a glib generalization.

[adam42381]

That's a glib generalization.

Tom, is that you?

[jmdickens]

After the LSAT was over, I was able to have this discussion with UVA students taking the test....ofcourse it was over some drinks