[Purple Haize]

Having had a "symposium" with officials of all levels recently, a list of irrefutable truisms emerged:

1. Basketball is not a socialist activity, nor a zero sum game. It is entirely possible for one team to commit a great deal more fouls than the other. It follows, that it is entirely possible for one team to outshoot another team by a great deal from the FT line. Just because the foul count is 10 - 2 does not mean one team is being cheated.

2. Officials make mistakes and blow calls. It is the only job where you are supposed to be perfect the first time you step on the floor, and improve from there. Which leads to:

3. The higher the level, the greater the scrutiny from supervisors. You will not see a supervisor or "rater" at the Sandusky v Dunbar Middle School Game (Added police security yes.) You will see one at most D1 games. These officials will also break down the video of the games and grade themselves. There is one at just about every LU women's home game.

4. There is no rule against going over the back. Going over the back is NOT a foul.

5. There is no rule against reaching in.

6. Just because it LOOKS like traveling does not mean it IS traveling.

7. Different coaches "work" officials different ways. By the time you reach D1, you have a good idea how to handle it and when you are being "worked".

8. Vertical stripes are NOT sliming.

9. I make polyester look GOOD

[fsn32]

I agree with every point except #9

[givemethemic]

Haize great points, don't know if I could have said it better... Where are you at tomorrow night?

[bigsmooth]

no way on #9 haize

[PAmedic]

we had a thread a while back, may have even been on the old board- where GMTM was arguing in agreement of points #4 and #5.

Basically the same concept- THEY ARE NOT FOULS.

the question then begs: why then are they called so often? or is it just stupid fans screaming that they SHOULD be called, when in fact- there is no offense being committed?

[SuperJon]

Haize or GMTM, this is something I've always wondered so maybe you can tell me. How many coaches have actually had officiating experience? Some of the best advice I've ever gotten was when a coach told me that if I want to coach baseball then I need to umpire some in college, that way I know what's going on from their perspective and don't look like an idiot arguing a call. I was just wondering how many coaches have actually officiated before.

[LUconn]

Arent those just terms that are used when a foul is committed while going "over the back" or "reaching in". That's like saying a square doesn't exist, it's really just a rectangle with equal sides.

[WinthropEagleFan]

Arent those just terms that are used when a foul is committed while going "over the back" or "reaching in". That's like saying a square doesn't exist, it's really just a rectangle with equal sides.

Exactly...It's a foul if you end up creating contact and gaining an advantage while you are going over the back or reaching in. If you go up for a rebound and reach over the guy without pushing him, there shouldn't be a foul called. Same goes for making a clean steal.

[Purple Haize]

SJ - Very few if any have officiating experience. There are a FEW who ACTUALLY pay attention during the rules clinic and a few that actually try to understand what it is that each official is looking for. THOSE are the ones you have to watch out for because if they start jumping down your neck you KNOW you probably missed it. Of course some know that and you have to be careful not to second guess. Conversely, there are not that many officials that have ever coached. Besides myself, I can't think of more than a 1/2 dozen former coaches in any of my conferences I work. A better question would be "How many coaches have ever read the rule book"?
WEF and LU It is a "language of art" issue. You will never hear a ref say "White 32 Reaching In/Over the back". You can reach as long as you don't hold. You can jump over someones back as long as you don't push. The most common "complaint" is when a taller player "cherry picks" over the top of a shorter player. (Or in SCAR's case a ground bound player!) Coaches/fans see the player CLEARLY reach OVER THE BACK of the person boxing out and yell in unison "That's over the back!!!". Sometimes it is so difficult to keep the sarcasm in check!!!

GMTTypo- I was at VES tourney tonite. Had a real nail biter it was 28 - 5 at half, but they made a run and closed the gap to a respectable 81 - 11 final score Tomorrown I have the Bees and Oak Hill

[kel varson]

Someone should address the jump stop issue. To me that looks like a walk. Its a great play but I think its a walk. Reminds me of the triple jump.

[LUconn]

Someone should address the jump stop issue. To me that looks like a walk. Its a great play but I think its a walk. Reminds me of the triple jump.

I hate this too, but I beleive as long as they land on both feet at the same time, they're ok.

[kel varson]

The problem is not that they are landing on both feet but they are jumping with the ball in hand. They land and then jump again to take a shot. It just doesn't make sense. Again its a offensive skill move, but I just don't see how it is legal. I'm not even sure I'm against it.

[Purple Haize]

Good question:

The concern with a jump stop is the pivot foot. If a player lands on both feet at the same time that player can than use either foot as their pivot foot. If one foot comes down first THAT is their pivot foot. A jump stop simply is jumping in the air to come to a stop. What the crux of the problem is when the player lifts their pivot foot. THIS IS LEGAL. A player may lift their pivot foot in the air, it is not a travel. It is only a travel when/if the foot touches the ground again. If you think it through it makes sense. Otherwise, everytime someone jumped in the air for a shot it would be a travel
I hope this helps.

[LUconn]

Correct me if I'm mistaken but here's something that is always called wrong. I don't see how so many can consistantly mess this up:

When diving after a loose ball, if you have the ball and you're sliding, this is not a travel. Your next move can only be a TO or you can pass to a teammate. Any rolling over or trying to do anything but pass it is a travel. I've seen the sliding called a travel so many times I wind up yelling at the TV every few games I watch.

[Purple Haize]

Yes, that is one that is often missed. However, alot of times you see the person sliding and turning at the same time, which is traveling. Also, recently a better job is being done in calling fouls on those types of plays. Too many times one player gets there and another one diving for it takes their legs out etc. Clearly a fould, but one that has been missed a lot in the past