[bluejacket]

I remember a mr glen beck weeping and having his team gather around his bed to pray about the oppression before he "preached" at convo. For him to claim that huckabee (a former baptist preacher) only invokes God's name for political reasons... Uh huh.

Glenn Beck is, to put it kindly, unstable and ignorant about many things. But there is more than a nugget of truth in what he is saying about Mike Huckabee.

[alabama24]

I don't know enough to comment. Why do you say that?

[bluejacket]

Glenn Beck and Mike Huckabee have been openly feuding for years. But Huckabee is a liar, vindictive, and thin skinned and has used his Christianity to deflect criticism and gain votes. There are plenty of examples.

[BJWilliams]

I think his point in asking is he expects you to provide concrete, unbiased examples backing those assertions

[bluejacket]

I'll give two perspectives. One from the left (http://www.salon.com/2007/11/13/huckabee_5/) and one from the right (http://spectator.org/articles/44620/tale-two-candidates). Again, there are many more examples.

[Purple Haize]

Why? He is no less qualified than 4 years ago He's got more campaign experience. And he's got access to the money it is going to take to win

He is less qualified because he lost in the 2012 general election. If he had only lost in primaries in 2008 and then skipped 2012, it would have far less damage (ex. Hillary Clinton). Running for president three times consecutively after failing the first two times will be insurmountable. People on both sides will attack him as the new William Jennings Bryan.

At this point, Romney's campaign experience is a negative. Sure there are some sound bites that he can point to and claim "I was right about X in 2012." But because he was the party's nominee in 2012, there is also tons of audio and video for strategists to pick apart and use to destroy him. Did he change anything substantial in tactics or strategy between 2008 and 2012? Nope. He spent 8 years using the same tactics and strategy in order to win one nomination.

The money "strength" is still up in the air. If Jeb Bush and Romney run in the primaries (as of right now, I believe both will), there will be a deep struggle over the same core constituency and donors in the primaries.

There is a long list of people who lost elections coming back and winning the next time. It's called gaining experience. I already stated he needs to change his campaign strategy/style and hopefully he learned that last time. I think a huge thing that happened was the movie that came out about him. The reviews basically were 'If THIS guy had run he'd have won'. He was also a lot more forceful in his criticism of the President post election than during the election.
Donors appear to want Romny in because he is calling to ask them to hold off on their support of another candidate....and they are.

[Purple Haize]

No more establishment candidates -hasn't worked the past two elections. Need someone in there with a spine. The last election should have been a lay-up for the GOP. I think I saw Lindsay Graham throwing his name in the hat yesterday and it just completely amazed me.

They have every right to run, just like the long shots. Make your case, raise your money. Support the winner.

[JK37]

Run, finish second to Bush, be his veep.

[Purple Haize]

Run, finish second to Bush, be his veep.

Bush will have issues with his illegal immigration stance. It's a big point where he and Mitt differ.

[ATrain]

I will never vote for Hukabee, ever.

I'll have to review Florida's economic performance and the efficiency of its state government under Jeb Bush before I would consider voting for him.

[Purple Haize]

I will never vote for Hukabee, ever.

I'll have to review Florida's economic performance and the efficiency of its state government under Jeb Bush before I would consider voting for him.

Just vote for Romney.

[ATrain]

I will never vote for Hukabee, ever.

I'll have to review Florida's economic performance and the efficiency of its state government under Jeb Bush before I would consider voting for him.

Just vote for Romney.

When I followed your lead in voting for someone for Poster of the Year, I subsequently got reminded I should've voted for my potentate. Maybe I'll just vote for you for President...

In all seriousness, I think Romney would do well...but is third time really the charm?

[bluejacket]

There is a long list of people who lost elections coming back and winning the next time. It's called gaining experience. I already stated he needs to change his campaign strategy/style and hopefully he learned that last time. I think a huge thing that happened was the movie that came out about him. The reviews basically were 'If THIS guy had run he'd have won'. He was also a lot more forceful in his criticism of the President post election than during the election.
Donors appear to want Romny in because he is calling to ask them to hold off on their support of another candidate....and they are.

Following the passage of the 12th Amendment, there are two examples of presidential candidates losing in the general election and then winning the next election. Andrew Jackson (very narrowly lost in 1824, won in 1828) and William H. Harrison (lost in 1836, won in 1840). Nixon won the nomination in 1960 and lost to Kennedy, then won the nomination and presidency in 1968. If he chooses to run, Romney would be attempting something unprecedented in presidential election history.

Mitt validated my opinion of Romney. Theodore White wrote in 1968 that George Romney was, "...leaving behind the impression of an honest and decent man simply not cut out to be president." I think the same thing about Mitt Romney.

[Purple Haize]

Did I confine my list to President?

[Purple Haize]

I will never vote for Hukabee, ever.

I'll have to review Florida's economic performance and the efficiency of its state government under Jeb Bush before I would consider voting for him.

Just vote for Romney.

When I followed your lead in voting for someone for Poster of the Year, I subsequently got reminded I should've voted for my potentate. Maybe I'll just vote for you for President...

In all seriousness, I think Romney would do well...but is third time really the charm?

I'm very proud you learned your lesson
However, since I'm not on the ballot you should follow your Potentates lead.
Is he any less qualified now than 4 years ago? If we discounted everyone in every profession who lost, everyone would be unemployed

[bluejacket]

Did I confine my list to President?

Since you have only discussed presidential politics and this thread is about presidential politics, yes.

[alabama24]

I will never vote for Hukabee, ever.

I'll have to review Florida's economic performance and the efficiency of its state government under Jeb Bush before I would consider voting for him.

I don't know about huckabee, but I won't ever vote for Romney in the primary.

[Purple Haize]

Did I confine my list to President?

Since you have only discussed presidential politics and this thread is about presidential politics, yes.

I re read my post. I didn't limit it to Presidential elections. But either way, so what?

[bluejacket]

I re read my post. I didn't limit it to Presidential elections. But either way, so what?

Romney is not gaining experience by running this many times in a row. It's not making it easier for him to win; it is making it more difficult for him to win. If Romney runs, it will be very difficult (almost impossible) to make it out of the Republican primaries. If he miraculously wins the nomination, he will never win the general election.

[Purple Haize]

I re read my post. I didn't limit it to Presidential elections. But either way, so what?

If Romney runs, it will be very difficult (almost impossible) to make it out of the Republican primaries. If he miraculously wins the nomination, he will never win the general election.

Why do you say that? I think he will have a more difficult time beating Bush, Cruz, and maybe Paul than he did in beating Bachman, Newt and Perry last time. But other than Jeb no one can raise the money he can. As for the General, if he goes up against Hillary again, other than Jeb he's the only one who can compete in the money world. And it will be easier to move the casual voter by saying 'vote for the guy who got it right last time '

[bluejacket]

Why do you say that? I think he will have a more difficult time beating Bush, Cruz, and maybe Paul than he did in beating Bachman, Newt and Perry last time. But other than Jeb no one can raise the money he can. As for the General, if he goes up against Hillary again, other than Jeb he's the only one who can compete in the money world. And it will be easier to move the casual voter by saying 'vote for the guy who got it right last time '

I agree that Bush, Cruz, and Paul (among other possible candidates) are more adept politicians than Bachmann and Perry. Romney will struggle with them.

My point: what happens when a disastrous campaigner leader no longer has the massive financial pool to cover his mistakes? Mitt Romney wasted hundreds of millions of dollars on horrible consultants and over payed for advertising airtime in 2012. Jeb Bush is probably going to take at least 1/3 of Romney's core 2012 donors. What happens when a candidate has to deal with a huge amount of attacks from Democrats and Republicans that are rooted in the many mistaken predictions/statements that he has made during the last 8 years? Romney said some things that were correct and prescient, but there are plenty of other examples where he was wrong. More importantly, Romney has consistently shown in two election cycles that he cannot establish an effective message or organize a counter offensive against his opponents' attacks. In my opinion, it is a recipe for failure.

[Purple Haize]

Why do you say that? I think he will have a more difficult time beating Bush, Cruz, and maybe Paul than he did in beating Bachman, Newt and Perry last time. But other than Jeb no one can raise the money he can. As for the General, if he goes up against Hillary again, other than Jeb he's the only one who can compete in the money world. And it will be easier to move the casual voter by saying 'vote for the guy who got it right last time '

I agree that Bush, Cruz, and Paul (among other possible candidates) are more adept politicians than Bachmann and Perry. Romney will struggle with them.

My point: what happens when a disastrous campaigner leader no longer has the massive financial pool to cover his mistakes? Mitt Romney wasted hundreds of millions of dollars on horrible consultants and over payed for advertising airtime in 2012. Jeb Bush is probably going to take at least 1/3 of Romney's core 2012 donors. What happens when a candidate has to deal with a huge amount of attacks from Democrats and Republicans that are rooted in the many mistaken predictions/statements that he has made during the last 8 years? Romney said some things that were correct and prescient, but there are plenty of other examples where he was wrong. More importantly, Romney has consistently shown in two election cycles that he cannot establish an effective message or organize a counter offensive against his opponents' attacks. In my opinion, it is a recipe for failure.

It's a valid point. And one he will have to contend with if he gets in. Jeb won't take a lot of Mitts donors because they run in 2 different worlds. Mitts money comes from Wall Street Jebs from Energy and Oil. As for consultants etc, I would be surprised if they used the same method this time around. I'm interested to read his speech in San Diego tonight. That will be a huge bell weather as to his intentions and strategy

[bluejacket]

I surely hope that they are not using the same consultants. Two consulting firms received a combined total of $152 million for their poor efforts in 2012. http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... ing-firms/

The battle for donors between Bush and Romney is well underway. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /21801211/ and http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politic ... -1.2077183

[Purple Haize]

I surely hope that they are not using the same consultants. Two consulting firms received a combined total of $152 million for their poor efforts in 2012. http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... ing-firms/

The battle for donors between Bush and Romney is well underway. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /21801211/ and http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politic ... -1.2077183

Oh it's underway, that's what started this whole shebang. Romney called his donors and asked them not to commit to Jeb yet. If Mitt doesn't run, my second choice would surprise people but I'm not sold yet on any of them.

[jack_sparrow81]

I could see the final nomination coming down between Cruz and Romney (just like Romney/Santorum in 2012). Jeb won't stand a chance, especially with the conservative media already starting the bash session. How is he going to justify is stance on Common Core? Conservatives like myself are going to no longer give in to our moral views on elections. If the American people vote in Hilary or another lib, let them continue to lie in the bed they've made. With that being said, I wold love to see Jindal be the main guy.