Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke
jcmanson wrote:Not what I am hearing. I am amazed at what we call patience...the program has finished 6th, 2nd, 5th & 10th in the Big South under Layer...this is his recruiting now...no one else to blame. There is no "buzz" in any direction about the program and Jerry Jr has given them all the tools needed.Rooster Cogburn wrote:The players are fully on board with DaleIs that a fact, Jack?
ludlpstudent wrote:How many players on the roster actually would be considered D1 talent? I would say 3 maybe 4. The only certain one being Thomas Gielo.There are 351 D1 basketball programs with 13 scholarships each. That's 4,563 scholarship players and they range from super talented one and done NBA players putting in their mandatory year at Kentucky to the guy at the end of the bench at Presbyterian. If you say that one of those athletes is not a D1 caliber player, then the question is, who should have that scholarship instead of him and why doesn't he? If we only have 3 or 4 on our roster, that means there are 9 or 10 better players out there somewhere who should be playing D1 basketball and are not, and while we may not be exactly worldbeaters right now, we are far from the worst team in D1, so if we only have a few, there are other teams who have even fewer. That's a whole lot of supposedly better ball players you have to find somewhere to fill the scholarships of those players you say are not worthy. Where are they? If you know some, you might want to tell us about them.
olldflame wrote:Just because you have a D1 scholarship does not mean you are a D1 talent. Just because you don't have a D1 scholarship does not mean you don't have D1 talent. We have 3 or 4 kids on our roster who are not D1 talents.ludlpstudent wrote:How many players on the roster actually would be considered D1 talent? I would say 3 maybe 4. The only certain one being Thomas Gielo.There are 351 D1 basketball programs with 13 scholarships each. That's 4,563 scholarship players and they range from super talented one and done NBA players putting in their mandatory year at Kentucky to the guy at the end of the bench at Presbyterian. If you say that one of those athletes is not a D1 caliber player, then the question is, who should have that scholarship instead of him and why doesn't he? If we only have 3 or 4 on our roster, that means there are 9 or 10 better players out there somewhere who should be playing D1 basketball and are not, and while we may not be exactly worldbeaters right now, we are far from the worst team in D1, so if we only have a few, there are other teams who have even fewer. That's a whole lot of supposedly better ball players you have to find somewhere to fill the scholarships of those players you say are not worthy. Where are they? If you know some, you might want to tell us about them.
BuryYourDuke wrote:And we have a winnerolldflame wrote:I guess my point in the earlier post is that if LU has several scholarship players who aren't of D1 caliber, a lot of other teams do too, which apparently means there aren't enough players around with D1 talent to fill 13 scholarships at 351 schools.Not really. It just means that people misidentify talent out of high school. There are lots and lots of D2 and D3 players who have D1 talent, but for a host of reasons were overlooked. In reverse, plenty of players, well on up the ranks of D1 ball, are not D1 talents. They were just wrongly identified as such. Those who can evaluate talent well, and then recruit well based off those evaluations, get D1 level players at their school.
olldflame wrote:I really don't buy that there are that many players with D1 ability playing college ball at lower levels. If there were you would see more movement upward when a player has some success there. You see a lot of those failed D1 players transferring and moving down, but they are being replaced by recruits, not D2 players moving up.Because they don't want to sit out a year. Players move down all the time but is it worth it for a coach to take a kid who played 1 year at Mt Olive and then sit out a year before he suits up? Or would they rather pull a JUCO kid who can play right away?
jinxy wrote:Roberts is on scholarship, you agreed on donley. I never thought ogukwe was more than a 4th or 5th big guy.Sommy Ogukwe started his first 2 games in a Liberty uniform, and in his Freshman year, although his minutes were cut back because of offensive limitations, he blocked a shot every 10 minutes of PT. Kid had crazy hops and excellent timing as a shot blocker. I honestly believe he would be a starter now if he had not been hurt. He has (or at least had) more physical talent than Coronado or JVP.
Purple Haize wrote:Players have to sit a year when they transfer between D1 teams too, but coaches are lined up to take them even though they are not all superstars by any means. Several hundred do it every year and the number keeps going up. I think in some cases talented D2/NAIA players are enjoying being a star/BMOC and don't want to take the risk to try making it at the D1 level. In that case I would say they may be a D1 TALENT, but they are not a D1 PLAYER. On the other side, there are some possibly less talented players sitting on the end of the bench in D1 who could transfer down without sitting and possibly be a starter if not a star, but choose not to because they want to compete for a chance to play at the highest level. I would suggest that some of these guys may not have D1 TALENT, but they are D1 PLAYERS.olldflame wrote:I really don't buy that there are that many players with D1 ability playing college ball at lower levels. If there were you would see more movement upward when a player has some success there. You see a lot of those failed D1 players transferring and moving down, but they are being replaced by recruits, not D2 players moving up.Because they don't want to sit out a year. Players move down all the time but is it worth it for a coach to take a kid who played 1 year at Mt Olive and then sit out a year before he suits up? Or would they rather pull a JUCO kid who can play right away?
How many D2 D3 or NAIA games have you seen? There are plenty of players who could play up a level. There are D2 conferences, especially on the Women's side that are more talented than the BSC.
thepostman wrote:I know that we need to find someone else to lead this team and program because as nice of a guy as Dale is, his team isn't getting the job done. It just sucks that we can't have an honest discussion about it on here without 1 or 2 posters pushing their ridiculous agenda for their pal.What really is ridiculous is how a number of FF refuse to live in the reality of what has happened to this program! Honest discussion? Only if it supports the agenda of the status quo...mean while LU Athletics are not served with an open discussion of what is truly best! So please don't label our opinion as not being serious because some on here can not be serious about what is best & how to get there.
I think most agree that some serious soul searching will need to be done even if we do make a decent run in the tourney.
Lburglifer wrote:I put this in bold because everything you have ever posted from your multiple accounts have been to serve one agenda. Most people don't have any kind of agenda other that to see Liberty win but even if we all had our own agendas for the "status quo" as you put it, how can you get upset when you have done the same exact thing for years since your boy didn't get his contract renewed? The answer to that question is you can't. You have your agenda and show up only when you feel like your agenda will have some merit. The problem with that is everybody sees right though it.thepostman wrote:I know that we need to find someone else to lead this team and program because as nice of a guy as Dale is, his team isn't getting the job done. It just sucks that we can't have an honest discussion about it on here without 1 or 2 posters pushing their ridiculous agenda for their pal.What really is ridiculous is how a number of FF refuse to live in the reality of what has happened to this program! Honest discussion? Only if it supports the agenda of the status quo...mean while LU Athletics are not served with an open discussion of what is truly best! So please don't label our opinion as not being serious because some on here can not be serious about what is best & how to get there.
I think most agree that some serious soul searching will need to be done even if we do make a decent run in the tourney.
thepostman wrote:
I
I know you won't actually read this because of its length, oh well.
that's what......thepostman wrote:First of all you must have me mistaken for someone else and you are entitled to your opinions. What I see is my right. Recently I started to look at the stats/records after lunch with a friend. Since 2000 LU MBB has been top 3 in the BSC 6 times and 4 of those came in the five years of one coach. He said that to me and It certainly was the case. My friends opinions are way stronger than mine regarding athletic leadership. Maybe this team finds it's legs but I don't see where the production is going to come from.Lburglifer wrote:I put this in bold because everything you have ever posted from your multiple accounts have been to serve one agenda. Most people don't have any kind of agenda other that to see Liberty win but even if we all had our own agendas for the "status quo" as you put it, how can you get upset when you have done the same exact thing for years since your boy didn't get his contract renewed? The answer to that question is you can't. You have your agenda and show up only when you feel like your agenda will have some merit. The problem with that is everybody sees right though it.thepostman wrote:I know that we need to find someone else to lead this team and program because as nice of a guy as Dale is, his team isn't getting the job done. It just sucks that we can't have an honest discussion about it on here without 1 or 2 posters pushing their ridiculous agenda for their pal.What really is ridiculous is how a number of FF refuse to live in the reality of what has happened to this program! Honest discussion? Only if it supports the agenda of the status quo...mean while LU Athletics are not served with an open discussion of what is truly best! So please don't label our opinion as not being serious because some on here can not be serious about what is best & how to get there.
I think most agree that some serious soul searching will need to be done even if we do make a decent run in the tourney.
I have said it before and I will say it again. I am not a fan of Jeff Barber, I think he has made a string of bad decisions. I also love Dale Layer, but I know he probably isn't the man for this job. I have said those 2 things several times on this board and so have many others in their own words. You gloss over that and simply quote a post from Scar that was positive and make it seem like he and the rest of the board offer blind allegiance to Jeff Barber and Dale Layer. You are so wrong it isn't even funny.
The thing is you don't have real solutions to give so you just like to point out the flaws in everything because your feelings were hurt years ago and you still haven't gotten over it.
It is kind of sad, but please do not try to paint this board as a place of people that simply blindly follow JB. It not only shows your lack of reading comprehension but it also has gotten old.
Every year during either a slump or a whatever the case my be you come on here and I always say I am not going to respond, but I always do.
So good job.
I know you won't actually read this because of its length, oh well.
Purple Haize wrote:Golly. I wonder who your friend isyou caught that too, huh?
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