[rogers3]

How did this come about so quietly?

Liberty University decides to end contract with GLTC

[Purple Haize]

We need a People Mover like in Morgantown

[rogers3]

We need a People Mover like in Morgantown

Maybe- but hopefully the city will now recognize the kind of participant LU often is in business and will not get involved in a civic center project with the school- it will end the same way.

[LUconn]

Maybe- but hopefully the city will now recognize the kind of participant LU often is in business and will not get involved in a civic center project with the school- it will end the same way.

What's that supposed to mean? GLTC would not have existed as of 4 years ago if it weren't for LU. You sound as if we have some kind of obligation to keep them afloat.


But how are they going to run without all the GLTC buses?

[Hold My Own]

It can be done


As long as you got Lee and Richard involved this is a walk in the park. I feel like Krammer when the bagel strike ended "Gather up the troops boys, the strikes over! We're going back to work!"

[From the class of 09]

LU Chancellor Jerry Falwell Jr. said GLTC’s rising transit costs prompted the change, which will go into effect in August. Falwell estimated GLTC’s hourly charges have increased 80 percent since 2008, including a 12 percent spike in the last two weeks

[rogers3]

Maybe- but hopefully the city will now recognize the kind of participant LU often is in business and will not get involved in a civic center project with the school- it will end the same way.

What's that supposed to mean? GLTC would not have existed as of 4 years ago if it weren't for LU. You sound as if we have some kind of obligation to keep them afloat. They also doubled the size of a system managed by a team that didn't know how to handle the growth.


But how are they going to run without all the GLTC buses?

Be serious. LU didn't save GLTC. It did put GLTC in a position to buy a bunch of buses that they no longer need, but before they handled LU's transit needs, they ran a modest sized modern fleet of buses just fine. Maybe you don't understand public transit, but a majority of the funding is actually federal.
Obligation to keep them afloat??? No obligation, but maybe a little forewarning to people higher up than the GLTC manager or some back and forth on pricing. That attitude is exactly what will skewer the city if they build a civic center based on a "partnership" with Liberty.

[LUconn]

Be serious. LU didn't save GLTC. It did put GLTC in a position to buy a bunch of buses that they no longer need, but before they handled LU's transit needs, they ran a modest sized modern fleet of buses just fine. Maybe you don't understand public transit, but a majority of the funding is actually federal.
Obligation to keep them afloat??? No obligation, but maybe a little forewarning to people higher up than the GLTC manager or some back and forth on pricing. That attitude is exactly what will skewer the city if they build a civic center based on a "partnership" with Liberty.

Unfortunately the N&A doesn't keep any archive of news and I can't remember the exact situation before LU stepped in. Luckily El Scorcho quoted it in a post in 2007 http://www.flamefans.com/forums/viewtop ... =13&t=6239

GLTC might be on the road back

Lynchburg News & Advance
October 7, 2007

It’s taken some prodding, in the form of budget cuts by Lynchburg City Council and a critical series of stories by The News & Advance, but Greater Lynchburg Transit Co. finally seems to be turning the corner.

Turning the corner in terms of its fleet safety and reliability, its relations with its customers and attitudes of its managers toward the public it serves. And it’s about time.

For years, riders had complained of buses that didn’t show up at stops on time, buses that broke down, buses that had no air-conditioning. The system was hemorrhaging money. Buses were being poorly serviced, if at all. Liberty University had been begging officials to talk about service to the campus and its growing student body. But no one seemed to care.

Well, that began to change in the latter half of 2006, and none too soon.

LU is now paying GLTC $75,000 a month to provide service to its campus, linking the campus itself with area shopping centers and off-campus student residential areas.

sounds like they were running their business just fine.

[PAmedic]

It can be done


As long as you got Lee and Richard involved this is a walk in the park. I feel like Krammer when the bagel strike ended "Gather up the troops boys, the strikes over! We're going back to work!"

In other news, HoMO Transportation Services, LLC is reported to be in the mix for the new contract, complete with environmentally friendly buses.

[TDDance234]

Medic does it again!

It doesn't sound like Liberty's decision was out of the blue... it looks like to me that LU/GLTC's contract was up and we decided that we didn't want to renew. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that how business works?

[rogers3]

sounds like they were running their business just fine.

Until you've looked at their budget and fleet replacement policy, don't bother referencing this article. The issue with reliability had nothing to do with how they ran their business, other than a poor choice of replacement buses they purchased in 2002. Transit buses are purchased and are budgeted for replacement over a specified number of years. GLTC had purchased a make of bus that had seemed to meet their needs for capacity, were more efficient, and fit into their replacement plan as long term investments versus, say, the cutaways that LU is using on some apartment routes, which for budget purposes are shorter term investments. The buses were a dismal failure, becoming almost unusable after 4 years (but slated for replacement several years in the future). That is where customer issues arose- it had little to do with being managed poorly or a lack of need. Just because Scorchy said that it was about to go under, doesn't mean it is so. Here is an a state report from 2006, supposedly when GLTC was going to fold w/o LU's help. Over 1,000,000 riders at that point. I'm as big an LU fan as anyone here, and have more history than probably 99% of FF, but the attitude that Lynchburg would die without LU is pretty obnoxious- one of the reasons some locals hate the school.

[LUconn]

If they're fine without LU, why the hard feelings on the ending of the contract?

[lynchburgwildcats]

Didn't the city have to bail them out with money the other year ago? I have to wonder how much it will hurt them to lose 75K a month

[rogers3]

If they're fine without LU, why the hard feelings on the ending of the contract?

Having done plenty of business over the years, I've become familiar with how hard it can be to rebound after investing heavily to provide a service for the school; lots of investment to make things work well for the relationship, then suddenly, LU has become "an expert" in your field and no longer needs you. It didn't help GLTC that they are not managed well and couldn't keep control of their costs. Mike Carroll, the manager at GLTC, always cited fuel as the causation of budgetary issues, but having a small fleet myself, I know that fuel prices haven't fluctuated so dramatically over the last two years to cause the shortfalls that GLTC has been experiencing.

So now GLTC has a fleet of buses to handle 2,000,000 passengers, Liberty has walked, and they will likely only need a fleet for 1,000,000. Maybe LU will buy some of that fleet- 40'ers and 35'ers and utilize them in their own service. Either way, as a taxpayer, I feel a like the rug has been pulled out from under the city. They should have had a contract for the life of those buses- 10-12 years. Caveat venditor!

[Hold My Own]

Rogers, I like reading your posts on here because quite often they bring a different perspective than everyone else...and you tend to look at the logic and business side of things. However, how on earth are you downplaying the relationship between GLTC and LU as if we're just a drop in the bucket to them. You're smarter than that, I know you are. GLTC has been increasing the rate for quite a while now and Liberty has given them plenty of warning shots and it got to the point where LU was given a deadline to decide...and we did. All of this can be tracked through public meeting minutes and news articles the last 6 months or maybe longer (BJ, I just gave you something to keep you busy for a few days).

Bottom line is the relationship with GLTC has been a good one...but LU came into GLTC's life a little to late to save them. They were already about to have to restructure, so they tried to have the golden goose save the farm. GLTC will have their hands full the next few years.

[PAmedic]

^^^ says the brains behind this V V V operation

In other news, HoMO Transportation Services, LLC is reported to be in the mix for the new contract, complete with environmentally friendly buses.

[Hold My Own]

Also, if the city was so worried about "the rug being pulled out from them" then the solution is quite simple....put penalties in the contract!

Set up something similar to the Lynchburg Hillcats agreement. If you leave within 10 years you owe a penalty of _____ amount. As a fellow tax payer it concerns me a lot more that our elected officials would put themselves in a position to have "rug pulled out from under you" if that indeed is your opinion.

Maybe you have fallen into the same spell that the 03 district is under: thinking the City HAS to accept anything that is presented by LU....we all know that's not the case but we seem to conveniently forget it at times when we want to make LU look like the bad guys that strong armed the city. At the very beginning the City could have walked away from the table like they have done 100 times before....but apparently this was a good business decision for them at the time and seems to be (at least to them) a good business decision to walk away. Even with being left double the fleet needed as a result.

I know nobody subscribes to the newspaper any more so I figured I'd find the article for you:

http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2011/o ... r-1379775/

[Hold My Own]

^^^ says the brains behind this V V V operation

In other news, HoMO Transportation Services, LLC is reported to be in the mix for the new contract, complete with environmentally friendly buses.

Ha! This was the first time I saw this, glad you quoted yourself. Although I will correct you with one thing....someone of your stature would consider this a comfortable home.

[PAmedic]

keep laughing. thats your family in 10 yrs

[rogers3]

things. However, how on earth are you downplaying the relationship between GLTC and LU as if we're just a drop in the bucket to them. You're smarter than that, I know you are. GLTC has been increasing the rate for quite a while now and Liberty has given them plenty of warning shots and it got to the point where LU was given a deadline to decide...and we did. All of this can be tracked through public meeting minutes and news articles the last 6 months or maybe longer (BJ, I just gave you something to keep you busy for a few days). Bottom line is the relationship with GLTC has been a good one...but LU came into GLTC's life a little to late to save them. They were already about to have to restructure, so they tried to have the golden goose save the farm. GLTC will have their hands full the next few years.

Well... to say that I downplayed the relationship is pretty much a misread, unless you, like some others, think that GLTC would have ceased to exist. They wouldn't have. Now on to the interactions that led to this, most casual observers will have some bad feelings about the city's interaction with LU on the bus issue, for the reason that has been pointed out on plenty of other threads- LU does a poor job with PR. Maybe, if they let a bit more of the story out, the mismanagement by Carroll and the unwillingness by the board (and city management) to do anything about it would be more obvious. I think that LU could have worked out something with GLTC but I doubt that the powers that be cared enough about the ramifications to pursue things further. Obviously, the city management is pretty daft, based on the latest budget announcement.

By the way, I did mention that the contract should have been for a longer term. GLTC should have tied the contract to the lifespan of the vehicles. I think that Carroll bit off more than he could chew- maybe underestimated the costs and underbid the service. Well, since you are in the know, has LU made an offer on the larger buses in the fleet?

[rogers3]

As a fellow tax payer it concerns me a lot more that our elected officials would put themselves in a position to have "rug pulled out from under you" if that indeed is your opinion.

I agree wholeheartedly with you on that point. That is why I have encouraged city councilors not to pursue this civic center issue. They don't know what they are doing! Business is business- whether it is LU or the Braves, when you enter into a business dealing, you better be as shrewd as your counterpart- and most of the decision makers within the city government are not. There is an incredible lack of foresight by most members of council as well as within the city management. I think that had GLTC had different management, we wouldn't be discussing this right now, but even after Lee fired some shots over the bow, the GLTC board and the city did nothing. Before its all over, we'll have the rug pulled out from under us several more times under Joan Foster's watch. To make matters worse, Cesor Johnson is my councilman.

[JDUB]

Sounds like Rogers wants to throw out the Council and elect some more competent businesspeople! You should write a letter to the editor about the city's incompetence and how it will cost the taxpayer.

[Hold My Own]

Rogers, I wouldnt have a stress in this world after I took a trip around that peaceful traffic circle

In regards to the Civic Center, there's nothing wrong with having one as long as the safeguards are predetermined and accounted for. I hate to keep going back to it but City Stadium is a perfect example of how something like this can work. The city and Lynchburg Baseball Corp entered an agreement that had penalties in place if LBC was to ever leave and the Corp has made every payment on time and even exceeded the minimum due on several occasions. This would be very comparable to what we'd be looking at with the Civic Center....as long as you have that one anchor you can still be able to weather the storms of slow bookings for outside events.


But I do not have the faith in our current elected officials to have the creativity to think outside the box or adopt a creative plan that may have been created by the university. Just my opinion but it is based on history and we all know it tends to repeat itself

[Purple Haize]

Could we build a Civic Center that will rival JPJ or Roankoe Civic Center? THAT is where I am skeptical.

[rogers3]

But I do not have the faith in our current elected officials to have the creativity to think outside the box or adopt a creative plan that may have been created by the university. Just my opinion but it is based on history and we all know it tends to repeat itself

Well, at least the bridge worked!

As you have pointed out, the LBC arrangement at the stadium has worked. No doubt- collaboration and partnership are positives for all sides.