[BJWilliams]

Quiz time:
List the hires that Barber has made.

Women's Soccer
Women's Field Hockey
Women's Lacrosse
Women's Swimming
Men's Basketball
Baseball

6 hires, 3 of them to brand new programs

[Purple Haize]

Quiz time:
List the hires that Barber has made.

Women's Soccer
Women's Field Hockey
Women's Lacrosse
Women's Swimming
Men's Basketball

5 hires, 3 of them to brand new programs

I wonder other then the 2 men's basketball hires what major sports logic is talking about

[jcmanson]

Quiz time:
List the hires that Barber has made.

Are we talking just Head Coaches?

Ritchie McKay
Dale Layer
Jim Toman
Jodi Murphy
Regan Denham
Jessica Hain
Jake Shellenberger

[BJWilliams]

Or it is 1-2 people with an axe to grind who cannot seem to move on, trying to force others to get on board with their smearing, drink the kool aid, and turn people against JB. The guy flat out makes great hires, in major sports and those not so major.

We've only had two "major sports" that made coaching changes until Monday since Barber became AD: baseball and men's basketball.

[ToTheLeft]

Quiz time:
List the hires that Barber has made.

Are we talking just Head Coaches?

Ritchie McKay
Dale Layer
Jim Toman
Jodi Murphy
Regan Denham
Jessica Hain
Jake Shellenberger

How many Big South championships here?

[BJWilliams]

Quiz time:
List the hires that Barber has made.

Are we talking just Head Coaches?

Ritchie McKay
Dale Layer
Jim Toman
Jodi Murphy
Regan Denham
Jessica Hain
Jake Shellenberger

How many Big South championships here?

technically these three sports dont compete for Big South championships, though I do see your point.

[IMBach]

What does he need more $$$, more time or less competitive conference?

[NotAJerry]

What does he need more $$$, more time or less competitive conference?

How about enough time to make enough hires to be accurately judged for the job he's done?

[R i]

I like how this thread started.

[IMBach]

What does he need more $$$, more time or less competitive conference?

How about enough time to make enough hires to be accurately judged for the job he's done?

So would that be 5, 10 or 20 years on top of the 6 he has already had?

[NotAJerry]

What does he need more $$$, more time or less competitive conference?

How about enough time to make enough hires to be accurately judged for the job he's done?

So would that be 5, 10 or 20 years on top of the 6 he has already had?

You really don't know the difference between years and hires? They're different words. Maybe Hooked on Phonics or Rosetta Stone could help.

[jcmanson]

You have to look at each individual hire and determine if that hire "bettered" the program. And that's not only measured in championships.

McKay - it's debatable, I'll say no
Layer - still an open book, after last year it looked like yes, currently maybe trending towards no
Toman - still an open book and it's debatable
Murphy -yes
Denham - I don't know?
Hain - yes
Shellenberger - yes

So the report card:

7 hires
3 yes
1 ???
1 debatable no
2 open books

[NotAJerry]

And Layer only is trending downwards due to several injuries and a primadonna transfer this year. Just having Brown healthy would make a huge difference with that roster.

[BJWilliams]

Denham is hard to read because lacrosse was a first year program. They had flashes last year but its hard to really gauge a sport in the first year its offered. I think we will get more of an idea after this spring

[IMBach]

And Layer only is trending downwards due to several injuries and a primadonna transfer this year. Just having Brown healthy would make a huge difference with that roster.

So Lang wrote we have lost 13 of our last fourteen D1 games, six in a row with four at home. When Evan left program who replaced him? Are players developing in program? Is attendance up? Are we building?

[BJWilliams]

I think Checkers is suffering from multiple personality disorder...ToC and IMBach sound a lot like him

[IMBach]

I think Checkers is suffering from multiple personality disorder...ToC and IMBach sound a lot like him

I ask some pertinent questions on program building where posters are discussing hires and I get lumped with whoever. That reaction won't get us over the top.

Good for you if that is how you answer the questions:

So Lang wrote we have lost 13 of our last fourteen D1 games, six in a row with four at home. When Evan left program who replaced him? Are players developing in program? Is attendance up? Are we building?

[thepostman]

I think Checkers is suffering from multiple personality disorder...ToC and IMBach sound a lot like him

Please stop. I realize you disagree with their view point (as do I for the most part), but stop bringing checkers up every chance you get. Its highly annoying and not at all constructive.

[Chris Lang]

Bach brings up solid points, questions that certainly are fair game to ask.

At the end of last season, there was clear dischord in the locker room on the team, re: Gordon. Sanders admitted as much (in a vague, PC sort of way) during an interview with me before the Europe trip. He was a good offensive player but not a great team player, or at least he didn't seem to mesh well with everyone at the end of the year.

The John Brown injury was a huge one because there is no one with his skill set on the roster. He could score around the basket with regularity, and that's what this current team is missing. Vander Pol and Burrus are still too hit or miss, though Burrus has been more hit than miss this year. Without a consistent post presence, Liberty relies almost exclusively on jump shooters. When Minaya and JC Sanders combine to go 6-for-25 or something like that from the floor, Liberty has no chance.

Ogukwe wasn't going to be a difference maker on the offensive end, but he would have provided 20 solid minutes a game of post defense, something Liberty has close to none of yet. Vander Pol is too foul prone right now. It's something he'll learn from and get better from, but with the lack of options in the post, the Flames don't have the luxury for him to go through growing pains. He has to be good and consistent on a nightly basis, and he's just not there yet. There's talent there, but not enough consistency.

JC Sanders is not much better defensively than he was last season, as evidenced by the substitution patterns at the end of games, when it's almost a straight offense-defense sub between Phillips and Sanders. Phillips, by the way, seems to be able to get to the basket and a little and score, and I'm not sure why he doesn't do more of that. Is that on him or on the coaches?

I think the players are developing, but there isn't an immediate-impact freshman like Seth Curry, Evan Gordon or Jesse Sanders in the program. Is attendance up? Absolutely not. The program has lost all semblance of buzz. No one in this community talks about Liberty basketball. That's the biggest casualty from the Curry transfer. He gave locals a reason to want to go to the games. I can't tell you the last time I've heard from anyone about Liberty basketball. Is this Layer's fault? No. He's trying to build a program, one that was extremely fractured after the Curry/McKay debacle. He needs to be more concerned with substance than sizzle, and he is. The Flames desperately needed to get off to a hot start to try to build some buzz, but instead, because of the injuries, they've spiraled. It's not an excuse. It's a reality. Liberty isn't good enough defensively to win basketball games against Division I teams right now. That can change, and perhaps this is the sort of team that gets it together in late January/early February and goes on a run. But a lot of things have to break right for that to happen.

[BJWilliams]

To answer your question I think Brown was supposed to be the guy to take up the slack from Evan's departure but we know what happened to him (on a personal note, knee injuries are not fun...having had two of them myself). Speaks has certainly taken up some but losing Sommy and Gielo just before the season certainly hurt (no pun intended) things. I'm interested to see how he does in his first game action (is he still on track to play against Richmond?)

Lang is also right in both his points (about not having a freshman making an immediate impact and on there not being a lot of buzz and talk about basketball round town) and

[Purple Haize]

So what you are saying is that its difficult to just replace someone with another of your 13 scholarship players? And that injuries can be more devastating to a team if it happens at certain positions. Hmmm. Who knew.

Now back to the topic. THIS will be JBs defining hire. Part of the reason hoops doesn't have a lot of buzz is because we are a football school now. That is where our time and resources have gone. If we do well in hoops, that's just icing on the cake at the moment.

[grm]

"The program has lost all semblance of buzz. No one in this community talks about Liberty basketball." C. Lang

Through the years that I have read Chris Lang, I have seen him as his own man. Period.

It makes those statements very meaningful, & I like that he said it was not Coach's fault.
There's a lot of work to be done, and that's that!
Forge ahead, accepting the current reality of the matter (at least if Chris is correct in his assessments).... & by that I don't mean accept it in the long term, but accept where we are right this moment, and then, if we'll try to be half-way constructive in our comments, it should take some of the edge off the irritable bowel syndrome that is oppressing us.

[truthorconsequences]

Someone is responsible for the lack of talent in mbb? I would say are resources are at the top of BSC. I guess it is the Spin Doctor, we can blame McKay, Curry and Dunton.

Very big hire for JB.

[IMBach]

Bach brings up solid points, questions that certainly are fair game to ask.

At the end of last season, there was clear dischord in the locker room on the team, re: Gordon. Sanders admitted as much (in a vague, PC sort of way) during an interview with me before the Europe trip. He was a good offensive player but not a great team player, or at least he didn't seem to mesh well with everyone at the end of the year.

The John Brown injury was a huge one because there is no one with his skill set on the roster. He could score around the basket with regularity, and that's what this current team is missing. Vander Pol and Burrus are still too hit or miss, though Burrus has been more hit than miss this year. Without a consistent post presence, Liberty relies almost exclusively on jump shooters. When Minaya and JC Sanders combine to go 6-for-25 or something like that from the floor, Liberty has no chance.

Ogukwe wasn't going to be a difference maker on the offensive end, but he would have provided 20 solid minutes a game of post defense, something Liberty has close to none of yet. Vander Pol is too foul prone right now. It's something he'll learn from and get better from, but with the lack of options in the post, the Flames don't have the luxury for him to go through growing pains. He has to be good and consistent on a nightly basis, and he's just not there yet. There's talent there, but not enough consistency.

JC Sanders is not much better defensively than he was last season, as evidenced by the substitution patterns at the end of games, when it's almost a straight offense-defense sub between Phillips and Sanders. Phillips, by the way, seems to be able to get to the basket and a little and score, and I'm not sure why he doesn't do more of that. Is that on him or on the coaches?

I think the players are developing, but there isn't an immediate-impact freshman like Seth Curry, Evan Gordon or Jesse Sanders in the program. Is attendance up? Absolutely not. The program has lost all semblance of buzz. No one in this community talks about Liberty basketball. That's the biggest casualty from the Curry transfer. He gave locals a reason to want to go to the games. I can't tell you the last time I've heard from anyone about Liberty basketball. Is this Layer's fault? No. He's trying to build a program, one that was extremely fractured after the Curry/McKay debacle. He needs to be more concerned with substance than sizzle, and he is. The Flames desperately needed to get off to a hot start to try to build some buzz, but instead, because of the injuries, they've spiraled. It's not an excuse. It's a reality. Liberty isn't good enough defensively to win basketball games against Division I teams right now. That can change, and perhaps this is the sort of team that gets it together in late January/early February and goes on a run. But a lot of things have to break right for that to happen.

I appreciate your effort to put a perspective on my questions. Maybe a JB, JS, DM, AB and TS line up would be competive in BSC. Do you feel the Curry/Mckay debacle has impact three years later? Hope they can find some answers cause it was ugly vs UNCW.

[logic]

You have to look at each individual hire and determine if that hire "bettered" the program. And that's not only measured in championships.

McKay - it's debatable, I'll say no
Layer - still an open book, after last year it looked like yes, currently maybe trending towards no
Toman - still an open book and it's debatable
Murphy -yes
Denham - I don't know?
Hain - yes
Shellenberger - yes

So the report card:

7 hires
3 yes
1 ???
1 debatable no
2 open books

Yes let's get back on track here. I don't know anything about the three new sports, so maybe someone close to those could fill us in. With the big three, I think Layer and Toman were great hires. BBall was second in the conference in Layer's second season, and let's be honest - it is hard to build great depth in three years to be able to deal with what BBall is facing now. BBall will be good and we showed flashes of it last year. Toman set a program record for wins and has sent a boatload of guys to the pros. As college ball is similar to a farm system for the bigs a baseball coach is graded on not only wins at this level, but how many pro bound players as well. In these two critical areas he has succeeded. Also, we wouldnt be building a new baseball stadium if there wasn't a level of success and excitement about the program. Chalk that up as a win for Toman as well. The guy came from South Carolina. If you don't think he was a good hire here, read his bio and what he accomplished in the SEC.

Speaking of bios, I wonder if any of you even read the bios of these coaches? Many have come from big-time levels and have done a lot prior to coming to Liberty. That in itself is a testament to JB and JLFJR and the kind of program they are building here. Any time you can hire a proven SEC assistant from a top program and he comes in and in 3 years sets your program record for wins AND creates demand for a new facility it was a great hire. Not sure how anyone could disagree with that logic.