[pbow]

I'm not saying this because I have any kind of problem with the kid, but I think it's pretty disgraceful that Dominique Jones gets to dress every game, when we have somebody like Moe Barry (didn't dress one game last year), who i'm not saying would compete for the starting spot, but would at least be able to make some kind of difference if they needed him to come into the game.

Seriously I have nothing against Dominique, i'm just talking about pure basketball talent.

[TIMSCAR20]

Pbow,

Mo Barry was not eligible to play last year. That is why he didn't dress. Dominique is a smart player that when given the opportunity to play he made the most of it even though he may not be as physically gifted as the other guards on the team but I will take a smart player any day of the week as a coach.

[pbow]

Thanks SCAR I was not aware that Mo wasn't eligible last year, but I will be very diappointed this year if Jones gets to dress instead of Mo. I have a hard time believing that his knowledge of the game can overtake some of the other players overall basketball talent.

[TIMSCAR20]

We will find out soon enough. I know there are a ton of guys in the program so who dresses and who doesn't will depend on how it all plays out the next few weeks. I like Mo a lot though. If he were eligible last year he would have not only dressed but probably played.

[jmdickens]

I think pbow is just frustrated at the fact that Jones has been dominated by guys in LaHaye, and it appears he doesn't belong on the bench. Moe is good, and hopefully he is going to get some playing time this season. Remember we need somene to handle the ball, not walk it up the court.

[TIMSCAR20]

LaHaye games are tough on the players sometimes. We went through it back in the old multipurpose days and our players went through it when it was called the Schilling when I coached. Ask Ed Barnhouse (he runs intramurals) about his squad back in the day. All white guys that could flat out ball. They won 4 or 5 intramural championships in a row. They could all dunk and run and shoot well. They were tough. A few of them were on our practice squad but the rules changed to prevent them from doing both and they all defected because they were getting more time and having more fun in pickup games and intramurals. However, there wasn't one player on our team that I would have traded for those guys even though many of them were good enough to play organized college ball. It takes a certain type of player to be at the end of the bench and help a good team in practice situations. Not everyone is willing to sacrifice ego to do that. I think you need Dominique Jones and Mo Barry on the squad regardless of what someone might think of them in a pickup game. Pickup and organized ball are 2 different animals. Plus no one takes into consideration that the student-athletes have already gone through 5 hours or training by the time they reach LaHaye to play with the "normal" students. It is not a fair comparison. Of course the really great players in the program over the years have been able to Hold their Own (HMO you out there?) even in those less ideal situations. Leary, Alston, White, Jackson, Caldwell, Harry Williams, Blair and others have represented well in the LaHaye/Schilling settings.

[Killn'emsoftly]

Scar your totally rightlike always. Obviously I know first hand about this situation... I don't know if Pbow plays ball or not but if he does I guarntee he would wet his pants if given a chance to play for the Flames in the Vines. It's easy to play in the 'new multi-purpose' as a student, no pressure of screwing up and having RD barking at you. The normal students have more to prove against the team than the team has to prove against the normal students in those meaningless games! As for Jmdickens, if I were a small college coach I would recruit the normal students at LU because their are some good players that have come thru the LU and never played in a college game. Everyone came to Liberty hoping to 'make the team'...

[TDDance234]

That was my intent when coming to LU. I played a season at a junior college and in my attempt to walk on to the team, I hurt my back playing in the new LaHaye center. Two herniated discs. Thus dashing my hopes at even attempting to walk on.

To rub salt in my wound, my quadmate my first semester here at LU made the team and quit after two months.

[TIMSCAR20]

Killenem, You know first hand of what I speak. No one knows the pressure of division 1 athletics until they try it. It seems really easy but it is in fact very hard to do even the simplest of tasks sometimes. The amount of information you have to remember while playing can be overwheming for some. The amount of preparation to play 1 game would make most people walk away from it never wanting any parts of it ever again. I have a friend that works at Liberty and he always tells me how his sons shot 90% free throws in high school and wondered why our guys struggle from the line. I tell him that I shot 87% in high school but closer to 65% in college. Same distance but it is way harder to make a free throw in college than a gym with 400 people in high school where you are the man and can do no wrong. College hoops is a whole different thing. The game moves faster, your mind is racing at 1000 miles per hour and usually to get to the line (unless you play for Duke) it takes an assault and Battery of your body which takes its toll as well. I could go on but you get the point.

[TDDance234]

(unless you play for Duke) it takes an assault and Battery of your body which takes its toll as well. I could go on but you get the point.

You're almost as bad as Carolina fans who don't see Hansborough who does the waltz in the lane and is never called for traveling.

[TIMSCAR20]

I am actually a huge Duke fan. Grant Hill, Tommy Amaker, Elton Brand, Trajan Langdon are all really good guys who I have had to chance to get to know a little. Coach K used to let us watch practice and take notes and talk with him whenever we had a chance as a staff to drive down to Durham. I am from the north so Idon't get into ACC Rivalries. I just like to watch good ACC ball. I don't really care who wins that much.

[TDDance234]

Sorry SCAR, the Tabacco Road comes out in me every once in awhile.

[TIMSCAR20]

I hear ya TD, I hear ya... I was just using JJ and Duke as an example.

[jmdickens]

yeah, Coach K is good at teaching kids to take dives....I watched him teach it to Shane Battier. Being from NC is great because we get to watch some great hoops. SCAR, I agree about Ed's teams, they were nasty for intramurals. The thing with Jones, it is just hard to see him by the LU team. Every team has a player who doesn't essentially mesh with the rotation players or bench players, but at most division 1 schools, they normally have something to bring to the table. ex: a really good three point shot (Reber)....

[Purple Haize]

I am actually a huge Duke fan. Grant Hill, Tommy Amaker, Elton Brand, Trajan Langdon are all really good guys who I have had to chance to get to know a little. Coach K used to let us watch practice and take notes and talk with him whenever we had a chance as a staff to drive down to Durham. I am from the north so Idon't get into ACC Rivalries. I just like to watch good ACC ball. I don't really care who wins that much.

Figures you'd like THOSE guys!! What about Hurley, Laettner, Parks, Wojo, Collins and Abdelnabby!! (Just pulling your chain!) and of course JJ!!!
For those NOT getting the joke, what do SCAR's players and mine have in common?

[TIMSCAR20]

Well if it is race then you have a couple of errors. Tray is half white I believe and Abdanaby is def not white I believe everyone but Tray, Wojo and Ala have won championships of the 2 subsets mentioned above.

Actually didn't Trajan win one with Brand? And I think Amaker was in the final 4 a couple of times but never won it all.

[jmdickens]

No, they were beat in 99 by Uconn and Rip Hamilton

[Sly Fox]

I've sent this hijacked thread to the proper forum.

[pbow]

I don't know if Pbow plays ball or not but if he does I guarntee he would wet his pants if given a chance to play for the Flames in the Vines. It's easy to play in the 'new multi-purpose' as a student, no pressure of screwing up and having RD barking at you....

I do play basketball and I would love to play DI ball anywhere, i'm honestly not trying to be mean, but Jones does not have the talent to be on a DI basketball team. I have seen numerous people that play in Lahaye torch that kid. I'm not gonna mention it, but I think we all know the reason that Dominique is on the team.

P.S.
I hate Duke!!!

[nickrichard]

Pbow,
I think if you scan all D1 schools at our level, you will find countless fans that believe that certain players are not D1 players. Lord knows, we have had some here. At higher levels, you will find fans that say they have kids on their roster that don't belong "at this level". It is nearly impossible for a coach to find 13 players that are all capable of contributing on a daily basis (at the starting/playing level). Coaches try to put the best 13 scholarship players out there, with the understanding that some are not going to get any PT, but that does not mean they are valuable to the team. I am a firm beleiver in that you are only as good as your practice players make you. If you are not pushed in practice, you are not getting better as a player.

[LUconn]

No, they were beat in 99 by Uconn and Rip Hamilton

One of the greatest nights of my life.

[TIMSCAR20]

Pbow,
I think if you scan all D1 schools at our level, you will find countless fans that believe that certain players are not D1 players. Lord knows, we have had some here. At higher levels, you will find fans that say they have kids on their roster that don't belong "at this level". It is nearly impossible for a coach to find 13 players that are all capable of contributing on a daily basis (at the starting/playing level).

Not totally true but I get your point. They can get 13 quality players at the major level (see UNC virtually every year) but most choose not to because of the headaches it causes by having a potential starter as your 13th guy. Not to be a Duke pusher or anything but Coach K usually puts guys on the end of the bench that I wouldn't recruit to play in the Big South. They are all good students who bring up the aggregate GPA as well as the fact that they aren't out misreprenting them like the LAX team did earlier this year.

[LUconn]

They are all good students who bring up the aggregate GPA

Ding Ding Ding! They also increase the graduation rate to make sure no scholarships are lost.

[PAmedic]

Not totally true but I get your point. They can get 13 quality players at the major level (see UNC virtually every year) but most choose not to because of the headaches it causes by having a potential starter as your 13th guy. Not to be a Duke pusher or anything but Coach K usually puts guys on the end of the bench that I wouldn't recruit to play in the Big South. They are all good students who bring up the aggregate GPA as well as the fact that they aren't out misreprenting them like the LAX team did earlier this year.

wow- had I understood that back in the day maybe I could've walked on to be a benchwarmer

coulda woulda shoulda

[jmdickens]

Check the Stanford Report on graduation rates for Mens basketball. Duke is at 50%, one of the lowest scores