[PAmedic]

glad I procrastinated on my Flames Club donation this year

seriously? How can you say that? Either you're a supporter or you're not. Put your money where your mouth is.

yes. Seriously.

My donation is normally directed to the wrestling team, specifically. Had I sent it, the money would not have gone where I wished.

I'm sure I'm not alone in directing contributions that way.

[jcmanson]

glad I procrastinated on my Flames Club donation this year

seriously? How can you say that? Either you're a supporter or you're not. Put your money where your mouth is.

yes. Seriously.

My donation is normally directed to the wrestling team, specifically. Had I sent it, the money would not have gone where I wished.

I'm sure I'm not alone in directing contributions that way.

Oh ok. Nevermind then.

Although you could put that money towards the general fund.

[Sly Fox]

Keep in mind Medic's connections to the team. I completely understand his feelings based on his circumstances.

[fan00]

just for the record:
I'm a woman. I was a (decent) high school athlete and had athletic scholarship opportunities at the Div 1 level.
I hate this. I am beyond disappointed. And I don't care about Title IX-I am pretty certain this was never its intention.

[ballah09]

All they really had to do is add Diving to swimming and promote Crew and Gymnastics from club to scholarship. Crew and Gynmastics already have facilities. So it's not like they would be starting from scratch. Fencing or Rifle shouldnt cost that much to start

I agree though with all the the money they claimed they earned (close to half a billion) and how successful the alumni has been recently, I don't see how they wouldn't have the money.

Anyway I hope all wrestlers find a new home!

[jbock13]

BYD, keep preaching bud. You're 100 percent correct about title XI.

For the record, many high schools and other universities are dropping wrestling in america due to this same title XI. On a side note, it would be nice if the clowns at Outside The Lines on ESPN can stop promoting things that ruin sports.

[Cider Jim]

My donation is normally directed to the wrestling team.

Feel free to donate to the LU Quiz Bowl team, the "varsity sport of the mind."

[ballah09]

this is from title 9 proponents

Liberty reclassifies wrestling
Liberty University reinstituted its DI men's wrestling program in 2006. This was a move that bucked the trend of dropping men's intercollegiate wrestling. And they produced a successful program in that time. But the university announced this week that it would be dropping the team from the roster of intercollegiate sports and reclassifying men's wrestling as a club sport. In order to comply with Title IX. Or so they say. Liberty has added three women's sports since 2009 but says that even those additions are not enough to achieve proportionality. True, perhaps. But we don't even need to go look at their Department of Education Equity in Athletics data--because they are already in compliance. They don't have to achieve proportionality right now because they are adhering to prong two. Adding three sports in three years demonstrates a history of expanding opportunities for women. The only reason they might be seeking proportionality is if they intend on dropping a women's program. Once a women's sport is cut, then proportionality becomes the only option. Or they might want to add a different men's sport in the future. The wrestling community and the Title IX community are often seen as adversaries, and Liberty saying that they cut wrestling because of Title IX is not helping things. Liberty already is in compliance (regarding participation). So if I was a wrestler, I would start questioning Liberty's rationale.

http://title-ix.blogspot.com/

[4everfsu]

Well I think that wrestling on LU mountain is dead for good, never to be resurrected again. I cannot see a coach wanting to step in and build up a program with a university that has a track record of not supporting the sport. Sad for the current coaches, players and fans.

[jbock13]

The blogger is misinformed. Prong 2 is essentially not going to cut it anymore.

I have heard the same thing too. I was listening to Jason Lewis's radio show one night and he was talking about all the schools (universities and high schools) who were dropping wrestling due to title 9. He also talked about how the department of justice was essencially eliminating prong 2 and the impact it had. It was something that mattered to him, as he was born and raised in iowa, where we all know wrestling is big.

[bravo269er]

This is just a travesty. I love wrestling, and it bothers me to no end to see programs getting gutted all across the country. And GOOD programs are getting shutdown not just bad ones. This really stings, because I thought LU had fully committed to the sport. It just sucks.

[bravo269er]

Your right about that. Last year Chuck Liddell, Matt Hughes, and Uriah Faber ran a few fundraisers for wrestling programs in California, and Illinois to keep them from shutting down. All three were collegiate wrestlers.

I had a brief career as a wrestler, but i'll always have fond memories of the toughness, and grit that it took to be a wrestler. I learned alot about myself on those mats, and its a shame more people can't do the same.

[FlamesBeBallin]

http://www.themat.com/section.php?secti ... leID=23415

Jeff Barber interview with themat.com

[prototype]

This is not Barber's fault, Jerry Jr's, Liberty's fault - this isn't even the NCAA's fault. It's another way government has continued to mettle in every aspect of our lives. Adding more women sports is a joke. We are always trying to please everyone and make everyone equal. It's COA, Title IX, it's Minority Owned, it's the NAACP - man, just let people make decisions that make sense and let everyone earn their place in life becuase they deserve it. If a business, in this case a school, wants to have 4 sports, then so be it. If they don't want to offer any women sports, then so be it - if people don't like it, then they won't enroll. I doubt adding women's handball is going to make all the female students at Liberty feel more equal...

This is a sad day for Liberty, Coach Castro, staff and wrestlers. Another way the government can on one hand say it's doing everything to create jobs for people and then on the other hand - find ways to eliminate jobs by creating stupid laws.

[Flamesfanva]

Listened to the Joey Pantaleo interview....a class act guy.

Agree with you Proto.

[JLFJR]

Someone asked for my take on this. Here it is.

I am heartbroken about the impact this decision will have on the team members and so many others. Last night, my family ate dinner at Cracker Barrel. At the next table was a family that had moved back to Lynchburg in 2006 because wrestling was reinstated as a sport. The 17 year old son had planned to wrestle at Liberty. Athletics hired a nationally respected consultant and looked at all the options Liberty had available to it to meet the Title IX requirements. After studying the issue for many months, they concluded that the elimination of wrestling was the only option that made sense for Liberty. My father was forced to drop the wrestling program in the 1990s because of a lack of finances after it had been very successful at Liberty for many years (sorry to blow your theory 4everfsu). When finances improved, Dad was reluctant to reinstate wrestling because of Title IX issues but it was reinstated in 2006 after many who advocated for its return promised to raise a certain amount per year to support the program. They never were able to meet their fundraising goals but LU kept its commitment to wrestling until the federal government's Title IX regulations made it impossible to continue. LU has already invested millions to start three new women's sports to offset the return of wrestling in 2006 and would have to continue to add more and more new women's sports in the future if wrestling continued as a NCAA sport. This is because of a national trend of more women than men attending college. LU's ratio of women to men has grown from 50-50 to 52-48 in the last few years and projections show it will soon be 54-46. Over the last year, I asked the VP of Enrollment Management to try and recruit more men to prevent something like this from happening. At first, they thought it would be easy but soon reported back to me that they were unable to change the percentages without turning away many highly qualified women. We even explored the idea of finding private funding to replace all the government loans and grants that our students receive. Grove City College tried that but finally gave up because they simply could not find enough private investors but we also learned that, even if we could find $500 million or so per year in private funding, it would not exempt us from Title IX.

Athletics recommended the termination of wrestling instead of soccer, track or baseball partly because wrestling is not part of the Big South or any other conference. It is true that LU is doing well financially but that does not mean that we should throw out good business practices. Continuing to add more and more women's programs is very costly. Scholarships, locker rooms, new facilities are always part of that equation and the numbers add up fast. Plus, our board feels that about 20 NCAA sports is the right number for Liberty. There are some schools that have more but we do do not feel that going higher makes sense for Liberty.

This is what happens when the federal government sticks its nose in the business of private organizations. No matter how good the government's intentions might be, the end result of almost every government program is disastrous for the people it was intended to help.

[SuperJon]

[PAmedic]

Someone asked for my take on this. Here it is.

I am heartbroken about the impact this decision will have on the team members and so many others...

Athletics hired a nationally respected consultant and looked at all the options Liberty had available to it to meet the Title IX requirements. After studying the issue for many months, they concluded that the elimination of wrestling was the only option that made sense for Liberty.

My father was forced to drop the wrestling program in the 1990s because of a lack of finances after it had been very successful at Liberty for many years (sorry to blow your theory 4everfsu). When finances improved, Dad was reluctant to reinstate wrestling because of Title IX issues but it was reinstated in 2006 after many who advocated for its return promised to raise a certain amount per year to support the program. They never were able to meet their fundraising goals but LU kept its commitment to wrestling until the federal government's Title IX regulations made it impossible to continue.

LU has already invested millions to start three new women's sports to offset the return of wrestling in 2006 and would have to continue to add more and more new women's sports in the future if wrestling continued as a NCAA sport.

We even explored the idea of finding private funding to replace all the government loans and grants that our students receive. Grove City College tried that but finally gave up because they simply could not find enough private investors but we also learned that, even if we could find $500 million or so per year in private funding, it would not exempt us from Title IX...

I was the one who asked for your input- thank you for taking the time to reply.

Obviously there is a great deal of emotion in many of our responses to this situation, but you answered several questions I had- namely, what consideration was given to the many lives being affected here, what other options were examined, the potential impact of private funding and the possibility of the program being saved if said funding could be obtained.

sounds like we've hit the wall on this one. Very very sorry to hear it. And I agree with 4EVERFSU that, after this disaster, the likelyhood of ever again finding a staff on par with this one is slim at best.

Thank you again for your thoughts, Chancellor.

[ATrain]

Article this morning in the N&A:

http://www2.newsadvance.com/sports/2011 ... ar-940046/

[bigsmooth]

so when will someone fight the government on this is my question. How costly would it be? i am not a legal expert so im simply curious.

[prototype]

I would love for Liberty Law to take this on. This is a bogus law and is hurting us. Talking away the ability for schools to field teams is just taking away the opportunity for young men and women to get a college education. Just exempt football and we would be fine. Are there that many women who want to play football anyways?

[olldflame]

I would love for Liberty Law to take this on. This is a bogus law and is hurting us. Talking away the ability for schools to field teams is just taking away the opportunity for young man and women to get a college education. Just exempt football and we would be fine. Are there that many women who want to play football anyways?

Legitimately, almost none. Exempting football would pretty much solve the whole problem, but it makes too much sense.

[Schfourteenteen]

That means that every men’s program in the athletics department will have participation cuts at some point.

[prototype]

Come on Staver!!! Let's do this...

[flamesfan30]

this also sounds like it would be a hindrance to stepping up to FBS for football, if we are already having trouble complying how will we be able to add the schollies to go from 63 to 85?