[Th3rd]

so my big question is do we know of anyone else who could be a possibility of coming in for the 2010 season.. TTL do you have the scholly thing still so we can see where we stand??

I know we are most likely losing 2 other guys to free up some scholarship room... been speculating on who those 2 are (i know at least 1 that im pretty sure on)

i think with adding JC we could have a lineup of:

Jesse/JC
Evan/JC
Jeremy/Chris
Antwan/Konan/JVP
JVP/Carter

i also think Baird will be redshirting his first year since we are pretty deep at Center/Power Forward... just my opinion though

i could see this team making some major noise in the conference, and if not winning it at least being top 3 next year and most likely winning it in 2 years... deff a bright future

i would like to see where we stand with scholarships and if there is any possibility of adding a solid Wing to our incoming class (i know Bowen is most likely out of the picture, but anyone else we have been talking to?)

[olldflame]

What makes you think Bowen is out of the picture? I know Layer was in Raleigh recruiting not too long ago.

[Th3rd]

What makes you think Bowen is out of the picture? I know Layer was in Raleigh recruiting not too long ago.

just from what i have heard i dont think he is coming this year... possibly 2011 though... just telling you what i have heard though.. i would love to be wrong on that one because i think Bowen adds a great Wing and really makes us a preseason number 1 next year

[olldflame]

So, if Bowen is "possibly 2011", I assume that would mean he would do a year in prep school? Unless he has eligibility issues there doesn't seem to be any great need for that.

[Th3rd]

So, if Bowen is "possibly 2011", I assume that would mean he would do a year in prep school? Unless he has eligibility issues there doesn't seem to be any great need for that.

i dont know what im allowed to say on the issue, but yes that is whats being thrown around right now... the only concern is that with a year of prep we lose him because big teams are going to catch on to him

[ballah09]

i dont think Bowen will go the prep route. he went to QEA to get ready for D1 basketball. last i heard, he wants to play for layer but like i said it was a month or two ago, so things couldve changed.

if he does go the prep route then i think he's holding out for bigger offers

[jcmanson]

So, if Bowen is "possibly 2011", I assume that would mean he would do a year in prep school? Unless he has eligibility issues there doesn't seem to be any great need for that.

i dont know what im allowed to say on the issue, but yes that is whats being thrown around right now... the only concern is that with a year of prep we lose him because big teams are going to catch on to him

I think you're confusing Bowen with another recruit.

[Th3rd]

So, if Bowen is "possibly 2011", I assume that would mean he would do a year in prep school? Unless he has eligibility issues there doesn't seem to be any great need for that.

i dont know what im allowed to say on the issue, but yes that is whats being thrown around right now... the only concern is that with a year of prep we lose him because big teams are going to catch on to him

I think you're confusing Bowen with another recruit.

that could be true as well.... i thought it was Bowen... but like i said if we get Bowen expect us to be preseason number 1 and have a good chance at winning the Big South... he is that good of a Wing

[grm]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

[JK37]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

Stirring the pot still, I see - as if we needed a reminder of where your positions of blind allegiance and uneducated defiance lie.

[SuperJon]

I'll take where we are now all day and every day compared to where we were three years ago.

[grm]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

Stirring the pot still, I see - as if we needed a reminder of where your positions of blind allegiance and uneducated defiance lie.

Blind allegiance? I suppose that's possible. Maybe I'm not objective on certain things.

Uneducated. That's probably not the case.

But why is it defiance? Is there no opportunity for an honest question?

I give the team & Coach Layer an "A" for the season. I just don't see that Jeff Barber has done a good job of advancing the basketball program.

You all know where I stand on my friend, and I know where you all stand. That's the way it is, and that's fine with me. I'm just saying that we have yet to see progress in our BS finishes. Maybe we will next year, and I'll be happy to acknowledge it.

As far as stirring the pot, there's not too much pot to be stirred right at this moment. A few of us are kicking things around, and my brief little questions of what you apparently see as insubordination shouldn't cause much of a stir, I wouldn't think.

[Chris Lang]

I don't have a stance on either side of the issue, but grm's question is certainly a legitimate one.

[JK37]

Too many changes not entirely in his control (though one of which he properly took full control), and therefore too short of a test case. The moves made last offseason to stave off complete implosion deserve strong credit.

Another two years from now under similar circumstances, it is indeed a valid question.

[Schfourteenteen]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

That question is a valid one IMO, but here are my thoughts on the matter.

Attendance is up
The teams have been better these 3 years than the 3 before it
The 2009 team was the best LU team of recent (or further) memory
McKay WAS a good hire for a good price. He beat some good teams, handled the media well, and brought an energy that was needed on the campus.
The last two years saw 11(?) Freshmen

I see an overall improvement(reference RPI rankings) in the program. I can also see the rationale behind the major decisions he's made, and although some things didnt work out as planned, the program is stronger than before and looks to be moving in the right direction.

[BJWilliams]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

For what its worth I dont think when Mr Barber came in that we were going to start blowing people away, winning the conference every year and going 23-2 (or some unbelievably gaudy number like that) and it seems to me like that is what you were expecting grm. Considering the amount of turnover we have had even in the last three years (two different coaches and some very good guys transferring out), to see what this team did this year was very noteworthy. Now if we are at this same level three or four more years from now, THEN Id say we have a problem but right now I wouldnt go trying to throw JB under the bus just because we havent turned into the second coming of Winthrop since or championship in 2004.

[vthokies20]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

That question is a valid one IMO, but here are my thoughts on the matter.

Attendance is up
The teams have been better these 3 years than the 3 before it NOT
The 2009 team was the best LU team of recent (or further) memory NOT
McKay WAS a good hire for a good price. He beat some good teams, handled the media well, and brought an energy that was needed on the campus. NOT
The last two years saw 11(?) Freshmen

I see an overall improvement(reference RPI rankings) in the program. I can also see the rationale behind the major decisions he's made, and although some things didnt work out as planned, the program is stronger than before and looks to be moving in the right direction.

Dunton went 2,1,2,3 in 4 of his five years when the conference was a lot tougher. His last team would have been arguably the best ever. Of course some on here must characterize 4,3,6 finishes under JB as improvement to do otherwise would admit a wrong direction.

[olldflame]

Hi checkers. We missed you.

The last 3 years our record was 54-44. The previous 3 years we were 34-55. First round wins in BSC tourney in 08 and 09 and our first ever win in a post season tournament in 09. Prior to that we were one and done in the BSC tourney 3 years in a row.

This year our 10-8 record had us tied for 5th. There have been other years when the same record would have had us in 4th, or even 3rd. It just happened the conference had 3 teams with really poor records this year, and there was more balance 2-6 than in some seasons.

[SuperJon]

It's about more than just wins and losses. It always is.

[BJWilliams]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

That question is a valid one IMO, but here are my thoughts on the matter.

Attendance is up
The teams have been better these 3 years than the 3 before it NOT
The 2009 team was the best LU team of recent (or further) memory NOT
McKay WAS a good hire for a good price. He beat some good teams, handled the media well, and brought an energy that was needed on the campus. NOT
The last two years saw 11(?) Freshmen

I see an overall improvement(reference RPI rankings) in the program. I can also see the rationale behind the major decisions he's made, and although some things didnt work out as planned, the program is stronger than before and looks to be moving in the right direction.

Dunton went 2,1,2,3 in 4 of his five years when the conference was a lot tougher. His last team would have been arguably the best ever. Of course some on here must characterize 4,3,6 finishes under JB as improvement to do otherwise would admit a wrong direction.

JOn's right...its more than just wins and losses,...although for some (who apparently like being regularly shown the door) that it simply comes down to blind hatred

[ToTheLeft]

We finished in a tie for 5th (6th seed) & most figure it was a successful year, and, in the broad picture, I do not disagree.

It seems that many or most figure if we finished 3rd next year, that would be a success.

In the News & Advance, on March 1, 2007, Jeff Barber was quoted, "I just didn't feel like the program was in the shape it should have been after five years." I wonder how he sees the shape of the program after his first three years?

That question is a valid one IMO, but here are my thoughts on the matter.

Attendance is up
The teams have been better these 3 years than the 3 before it NOT
The 2009 team was the best LU team of recent (or further) memory NOT
McKay WAS a good hire for a good price. He beat some good teams, handled the media well, and brought an energy that was needed on the campus. NOT
The last two years saw 11(?) Freshmen

I see an overall improvement(reference RPI rankings) in the program. I can also see the rationale behind the major decisions he's made, and although some things didnt work out as planned, the program is stronger than before and looks to be moving in the right direction.

Dunton went 2,1,2,3 in 4 of his five years when the conference was a lot tougher. His last team would have been arguably the best ever. Of course some on here must characterize 4,3,6 finishes under JB as improvement to do otherwise would admit a wrong direction.

The conference was a lot tougher is fluff that makes your argument weak. Randy's numbers speak for themselves. He brought us a ring, and good Big South seasons. Don't fluff it up with unneeded junk.

And really, no one brought up Barber in this thread. We were talking about this season, and we finished above .500 in the conference. Barber doesn't coach the basketball team, and while he did hire McKay, which was a blessing and a curse, you can't compare apples to oranges. Give Dale 5 years, and see if he doesn't match Randy's numbers. I think he will. And that will still have nothing to do with Jeff Barber.

2,1,2,3 is fine and all, but to give Dale a 6 for a year he finished 5th with a winning record is kinda cherry picking stats. And it's better than the year you left out of Randy's stats, which should be included for fairness sake.

Dale Layer has a winning record against the Big South Conference as the head coach at LU, and that's all I can ask for in his first year after losing his best scorer, best athlete, and one of his best prospects in the offseason.

Where that leaves Jeff Barber is not for Jesse Sanders and the boys on the floor, led by Dale, to decide. If you want to wish failure on a program in hopes of seeing Barber fail, don't do it with men's basketball. I love that team and this school and I don't wanna see them fail, and to be honest, I'm sure even Coach Dunton himself would like to see the program succeed, and you guys do as well. Don't take out on one program the issues you have with a man who merely cuts a check for it, and doesn't decide it's fate in any way beyond that.

Simple point: Don't compare Randy Dunton to Jeff Barber as basketball coaches. We all know who the better basketball coach is amongst them. Let Dale Layer have a record that speaks for itself, and Jeff Barber have one that speaks for itself. Don't wish failure on a coach that loves this school and the kids in the program just because you want to see the guy who signs his paycheck fall from grace.

[LUconn]

Barber is not the Basketball Director. He is the Athletic Director. He's retained who he's needed to. He's raising money like crazy. He is a Dell Curry decision away from this conversation being insanity.

[Schfourteenteen]

Dunton went 2,1,2,3 in 4 of his five years when the conference was a lot tougher. His last team would have been arguably the best ever. Of course some on here must characterize 4,3,6 finishes under JB as improvement to do otherwise would admit a wrong direction.

2006 (the 4-23 year) was the only year in which the Big South was considerably better - Ranked 19th of 32(now 33). Every other year from 04-10 has the conference between 25th and 29th. In fact, the numbers are remarkably similar.

04 - 28th
05 - 26th
07 - 29th

08 - 27th
09 - 25th
10 - 27th

** EDITED for statistical accuracy.

[BJWilliams]

The conference was a lot tougher is fluff that makes your argument weak. Randy's numbers speak for themselves. He brought us a ring, and good Big South seasons. Don't fluff it up with unneeded junk.

And really, no one brought up Barber in this thread. We were talking about this season, and we finished above .500 in the conference. Barber doesn't coach the basketball team, and while he did hire McKay, which was a blessing and a curse, you can't compare apples to oranges. Give Dale 5 years, and see if he doesn't match Randy's numbers. I think he will. And that will still have nothing to do with Jeff Barber.

2,1,2,3 is fine and all, but to give Dale a 6 for a year he finished 5th with a winning record is kinda cherry picking stats. And it's better than the year you left out of Randy's stats, which should be included for fairness sake.

Dale Layer has a winning record against the Big South Conference as the head coach at LU, and that's all I can ask for in his first year after losing his best scorer, best athlete, and one of his best prospects in the offseason.

Where that leaves Jeff Barber is not for Jesse Sanders and the boys on the floor, led by Dale, to decide. If you want to wish failure on a program in hopes of seeing Barber fail, don't do it with men's basketball. I love that team and this school and I don't wanna see them fail, and to be honest, I'm sure even Coach Dunton himself would like to see the program succeed, and you guys do as well. Don't take out on one program the issues you have with a man who merely cuts a check for it, and doesn't decide it's fate in any way beyond that.

Simple point: Don't compare Randy Dunton to Jeff Barber as basketball coaches. We all know who the better basketball coach is amongst them. Let Dale Layer have a record that speaks for itself, and Jeff Barber have one that speaks for itself. Don't wish failure on a coach that loves this school and the kids in the program just because you want to see the guy who signs his paycheck fall from grace.

Like I said just above your post TTL, for some it simply comes down to blind hatred. checkers was acting this way when RM was hired, and he'll continue to act like a petulent little child until JB isnt our AD anymore and then he will crow about feeling vindicated when really all it comes down to is his bitter hatred and simple desire to see him fail.

[vthokies20]

Dunton went 2,1,2,3 in 4 of his five years when the conference was a lot tougher. His last team would have been arguably the best ever. Of course some on here must characterize 4,3,6 finishes under JB as improvement to do otherwise would admit a wrong direction.

2007 was the only year in which the Big South was considerably better - Ranked 19th of 32(now 33). Every other year from 04-10 has the conference between 25th and 29th. In fact, the numbers are remarkably similar.

04 - 28th
05 - 29th
06 - 25th

08 - 25th
09 - 28th
10 - 28th

Exactly 3rd place is the 19th ranked conference in America, losing to the 22nd ranked team in America on the last possession on their floor, going 7-2 in last nine conference games and having the most talented roster in program history line up.

Blind, those of who supported RD are childish, no we are watching as a program positioned to win its 2nd NCAA bid in 5 years was prevented the opportunity from which a number of community members recognize as an inexperienced ego. Do you not see the lack of community attendance in spite of the largest promotional expenditures in department history. Super Jon and other must demonize a good man to justify their blind loyalty. On to season 4 with our 4-3-6 seeds. No question RD had and would have done better.