[matshark]

...so therefore it was not a direct judgment.

well i think it was quite direct enough for the guy that got shot...lol

[Ed Dantes]

(post removed)

[ATrain]

...so therefore it was not a direct judgment.

well i think it was quite direct enough for the guy that got shot...lol

I give you an E for EPIC FAIL at that joke

[matshark]

...so therefore it was not a direct judgment.

well i think it was quite direct enough for the guy that got shot...lol

I give you an E for EPIC FAIL at that joke

lol...well good. in our government schools, that means i can still advance to the next grade. after all, they don't give F's these days

[ATrain]

well i think it was quite direct enough for the guy that got shot...lol

I give you an E for EPIC FAIL at that joke

lol...well good. in our government schools, that means i can still advance to the next grade. after all, they don't give F's these days

Yep, you may proceed to the next grade level.

[rueful]

stopped reading halfway through, but wanted to add that Gods wrath is not when he punishes you. Romans 1:18-32. Gods wrath is when he says "You want to be your own God? Go for it, lets see how long before you destroy yourself" and lets you continue in your sin. Its his Love and His Mercy that stop us from sinning, no matter the drastic actions required to get us to.

[matshark]

stopped reading halfway through, but wanted to add that Gods wrath is not when he punishes you. Romans 1:18-32. Gods wrath is when he says "You want to be your own God? Go for it, lets see how long before you destroy yourself" and lets you continue in your sin. Its his Love and His Mercy that stop us from sinning, no matter the drastic actions required to get us to.

i would have to make the observation that allowing them to do that would would seem to be a form of punishment also.

although some people on this board might construe that to say God was being loving and showing mercy in allowing him to be gunned down in church - and then they'd get all huffy about it.

[Barbie's Biggest Fan]

Taking this a different direction... This is why it's so frustrating that the Obama administration may change the Conscious Law. It's one thing for a doctor/healthcare professional to choose to provide an abortion, it's another to be forced to provide one. As a nursing student this really worries me... who's to say that in the future another doctor may be killed who aborted against his will?

[RagingTireFire]

I expected a few things out of this thread when I clicked on it. I expected to read matshark being his usual Dirty Harry meets Randall Terry self, I expected reasonable people to be jumping all over him and I expected A-train to be making a half-hearted attempt at defending him.

What I didn't expect to read was an in-depth debate regarding the finer theological points of murder. Good job, people. You make me sick.

[Ed Dantes]

I can't stand it when people try to intellectually argue that when an abortion doctor gets murdered, it's God's wrath...
...but when a crazed gunman breaks into a school and shoots 30 innocent students, some of whom were Christians, well, the Lord works in mysterious ways.

Bad things happen to bad people. Bad things also happen to good people. Why do these things happen? I don't know. I'm not God.

What do I know? I know that in these circumstances, the responsible Christian in me is supposed to not point fingers, and just love those afflicted. Tiller left behind a family and I don't know their spiritual standing. I think the best thing for them is to say, 'What happened was a tragedy. How can we help you?'

Seriously. If you were doing a fist pump when Tiller was murdered, then you are what's wrong with Christianity in America. You are why so many people are turned off to the love of God, because from you they see God not as a loving diety, but a vengeful one, ready to throw a lightning bolt when someone gets out of line. You are the Malcolm X to the reasonable person's Martin Luther King. Do us all a favor and shut up. Or become Scientologists.

[Ed Dantes]

Taking this a different direction... This is why it's so frustrating that the Obama administration may change the Conscious Law. It's one thing for a doctor/healthcare professional to choose to provide an abortion, it's another to be forced to provide one. As a nursing student this really worries me... who's to say that in the future another doctor may be killed who aborted against his will?

Probably slim, because while the news coverage makes it out to seem like these things happen all the time (one reporter called it the latest in a string), they don't.

- It's been 11 years since the last killing of an abortion doctor / employee.
- The last arson took place in December of 2007, and there have been only six since 2004 (It should also be noted that arsons set by business owners in general to collect insurance money are not all that infrequent.)
- There has not been any anthrax threats since 2002
- Abortion opponents used to throw a type of acid onto the docs; this hasn't happened since 1998.

Further, the conscience clause isn't forcing anyone to perform the abortion surgery -- it's really aimed at doctors and pharmacists who write / fill prescriptions for "morning after pills". In the unlikely event that someone snaps and wants to kill an abortionist, I'd wager that he'd find the nearest Planned Parenthood, not Walgreens.

By the way, on Monday, a military recruiter was killed. It is tragic. Attacks on military recruitment offices are far more common these days (yet you don't see the media painting everyone anti-war as an unhinged mob).

[LUconn]

- There has not been any anthrax threats since 2002

Was there any before 2002? That was the in thing to do that year.

[Ed Dantes]

- There has not been any anthrax threats since 2002

Was there any before 2002? That was the in thing to do that year.

Yes. There was 12 in '98, 35 in 1999, and 30 in 2000, 554 in 2001, and 23 in 2002. None since then.
It should be mentioned that the 554 letters in 2001 have been attributed to one man, who has since been arrested and sentenced to 30+ years in prison.

[LUconn]

- There has not been any anthrax threats since 2002

Was there any before 2002? That was the in thing to do that year.

Yes. There was 12 in '98, 35 in 1999, and 30 in 2000, 554 in 2001, and 23 in 2002. None since then.
It should be mentioned that the 554 letters in 2001 have been attributed to one man, who has since been arrested and sentenced to 30+ years in prison.

I bet he was ticked when Al Qaeda stole his anthrax thunder that summer.

[Ed Dantes]

Was there any before 2002? That was the in thing to do that year.

Yes. There was 12 in '98, 35 in 1999, and 30 in 2000, 554 in 2001, and 23 in 2002. None since then.
It should be mentioned that the 554 letters in 2001 have been attributed to one man, who has since been arrested and sentenced to 30+ years in prison.

I bet he was ticked when Al Qaeda stole his anthrax thunder that summer.

I was under the impression that he mailed these out after it became en vogue to do so. I got these stats from the National Abortion Federation.

[LUconn]

I can't believe such an organization exists. I think they misspelled 'choice'.

[ALUmnus]

[LUconn]

try again. What happened to your owl avatar? Did you try to make that elephant your new one?

[kel varson]

Let's say euthanasia of adults over 70 was legalized. It is now legal to kill adults over 70 for basically any reason. No one really takes that new law seriously with the exception of a few people.

Now most reasonable people would believe killing an human being just because he is over 70 is murder but the law say is it is legal so do we obey the law or try and stop the murderer(s)?

Just trying to understand the logic here. I don't think it is logical to call Tiller a mass murderer, but than say the guy that killed him committed murder of the first degree?

Give another example (not including killings of abortion doctors) where the court has ruled the killing of a mass murder as first degree murder. Would a Jew have been a murderer for killing Hitler?

[4everfsu]

So someone responsible for 60k dead babies is not a mass murderer?

[LUconn]

so why didn't you guys kill him yourselves?

[kel varson]

I am not condoning the killing but just saying the logic doesn't make sense if you believe abortion is murder.

[Th3rd]

i posted the same thing in the thread in the chapel board and ill post it here

i think this kind of applies, maybe not to the abortion doctor but to God's judgement on people, i agree with what is said in this video

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[matshark]

Seriously. If you were doing a fist pump when Tiller was murdered, then you are what's wrong with Christianity in America.

Wow...now im doing a fist pump? Do you see any fist pumps in my posts? Nope. I said I didn't condone it, but that I didn't feel bad for him either. *checking post...* Yep. ZERO fist pumps there.

Ed Dantes for "Poster most likely to make up statements attributed to other posters."

Oh, and one more thing... I'm pretty sure that Malcom X was a Muslim, and MLK Jr. was a Baptist. Not really relevant to the topic at hand.

[matshark]

What I didn't expect to read was an in-depth debate regarding the finer theological points of murder. Good job, people. You make me sick.

In-depth debate regarding the finer theological points of murder? I don't think there's any debate regarding murder. Simply whether this man's death was judgement for his actions.

If you want to talk about the finer theological points of murder, lets talk Judges 3:15-23 (Ehud). That ought to be enough to keep you occupied for a little while anyways.