[blwall1416]

Pastor Jon at Brentwood did an excellent series called Let's Stay Together. It is a four-part series with the fourth sermon dealing specifically about sex. He said he was tired of the church dancing around this subject and it's time for the church to meet it head on. You can listen to the message here:

http://homepage.mac.com/brentwoodchurch/

Click on 11-11-07 Let's Stay Together IV

[Schfourteenteen]

So its okay to teach someone how to kill someone and clean up the mess so that they wont get caught?

I just dont get why you would promote safe sex when its wrong in the first place. And as fumble said, where is the growing STD thing from?

Why should we encourage students do sin against God?

[LUconn]

I have to be honest that I come from an Old Hag perspective here. I guess I am old fashioned but the concept of trying to remove consequences for our sins being promoted by the school seems counterintuitive to the mission of the school.

Yes, I know kids are going to be kids. Yes, I realize that there are kids acting in a stupid fashion out of ignorance. But let's be honest, there are PLENTY of avenues for today's hormonally-charged youngsters to get information. Do we really want to see the school put in a position where we are espousing one thing and then adding with a wink and a nod that we know you are going to break the rules and here is how you can avoid repercussions?

I don't think it could be said any better than this.

[PAmedic]

I just dont get why you would promote safe sex when its wrong in the first place. And as fumble said, where is the growing STD thing from?

there is nothing wrong with safe sex.

I think you meant PRE-MARITAL (safe) sex

but my point is: your perspective will change in another decade or 2 when you have a 15 yr old, an 8 yr old and a new baby.

Hypothetically

[RagingTireFire]

We live in the information age, and the internet is available to all. If a college kid is ignorant on sex today, they are just too lazy to figure it out IMO.

You want kids learning about sex from the Internet?!

[blwall1416]

You want kids learning about sex from the Internet?!

Hmmmmm.....they have that on the Internet now?

[Hold My Own]

Let's not act like LU feels they are above this type of thing, they teach this type of stuff at LCA so I'm sure there is a different reasoning behind it rather than, LU doesnt want to recognize that there are people doing it....I think it's more of a "hopefully by now they have learned different things such as safe sex and more importantly abstinence" if they dont know by now then the countries school systems have failed them

[LUconn]

You want kids learning about sex from the Internet?!

Hmmmmm.....they have that on the Internet now?

I'll google it and let you know what I come up with.

[LUconn]

they teach this type of stuff at LCA

what do they teach at LCA on this subject? I've always wondered that.

[belcherboy]

We live in the information age, and the internet is available to all. If a college kid is ignorant on sex today, they are just too lazy to figure it out IMO.

You want kids learning about sex from the Internet?!

Have you looked it up? It is pretty good. The government has put together some GREAT STD educational sites. The drug companies have done a pretty good job as well. I mean we are talking about "college kids" here, you think they would be able to look up the proper info. Also before criticizing misinformation of the interent, do a quick google search. I think you would be surprised at how good the info is (although I agree there is some bad).

Are you saying the only effective way to teach college kids about STD prevention is in a classroom? Can they only learn by having a banana and condom in their hands?

by the way, I learned about STD's in my health class at Liberty. It was part of the curriculum, although we didn't study prevention. I don't don't think a semester of condoms 101 would be a worthy class IMO. I'm kinda hoping this generation of college students can figure out how to use a condom (especially with the instructions on the box). I could be wrong though! Nothing shocks me anymore.

[Fumblerooskies]

If it were my son or daughter, I wouldn't buy or give them a condom. That sounds selfish, but I would kill them first. I'm not married, nor do I have kids so I've got a WHOLE lot to learn.

ok- THAT prompted a response. I haven't even read anything posted after this- so if someone else jumped on it, I apologize.

HAVE KIDS, THEN SAY THAT.

I would die for my wife and children. If there is ANYTHING I can do to keep them safe- I'll do it- INCLUDING teaching safe-sex practices. And I'm a firm believer that abstinence is the BEST choice, but realistic to understand how kids feel and think.

I could never live with the consequences of my child dying from a mistake due to LACK OF EDUCATION.

I'd bet money FUMBLE agrees with me.

Yeah...what HE SAID!

[Hold My Own]

Also, I dont think he ever intended for it to seem like LU has a STD problem (mostly b/c that would be inaccurate) although I think he meant that STD's are a growing problem (not to be confused with a going problem that comes from the enlarged prostate, I learned that on TV) so it would be ignorant to think nobody at LU has STDs...although like I said before...if they dont know by now then we've failed them as a society and really theres no hope



LUconn, I really dont remember to be honest...I think it was in the same class where we learned about drinking....someone else who's been through the system more recently will need to answer or someone that paid attention...b/c I'm sure it's changed since then and the material is different

[ALUmnus]

LU's misson: Training young champions for Christ. Jesus Christ is THE foundation that this school was built on. Always remember that.

Teaching sex ed in schools is a sham and always has been. The program has been a dismal failure since it started, and has had the exact opposite effect that it intends (although I wouldn't doubt that one of its original intentions was very Kinseyan, make immoral sex the norm). Premarital sex -up, oral sex -up, STD's -up, teen pregnancies -up, abortions -up. Good job, public education, yeah! This is not the school's, government's, or society's job. It is the parents' job. "well what if the parents aren't teaching it...blah blah blah?" Then that's on them. They had the child, they raise the child, it's nobody else's business. When are we going to start dropping off newborns into government-run concentration camps to raise our kids 24/7/365 until they're 18, possibly 21? Not it's job. Leave it with the parents.

To tell a kid not to have sex, but then give him a condom "just in case" is one of the most contradictory and confusing things you can do to a kid. You're sending two opposite messages, and telling them that they're not expected to make the right choice. It's setting them up for failure and relieving yourself of any guilt or responsibility at the same time.

LU has progressed a lot since I went to school there, even while I was there. But the progression seems to be limited to education, structure, financials. When it comes to socially and spiritually, the school has and continues to sink. How low are we going to set out standards? It's funny how it's fun and acceptable to bash private and homeschool educated kids for being sheltered and ignorant, but people don't see how the public educated kids have been subconsiously indoctrinated with this kind of politically-correct bull. And then they try to bring it to Liberty and change the school to meet their state-run ideals. I know a lot of the liberal kids seem to pop out when topics like this come up, but I really hope it's the minority.

Parents for the most part, not all, send their kids to LU because it's different, because they don't do stuff like this. If anything like this starts, you're going to see some of the deep pockets close, and a lot of families send their kids elsewhere.

"Listen here, young Champion for Christ, don't sin. But if you do, because we can't expect you to live up to God's standards, here's how you can do it without having to deal with any of the consequences. Just don't tell us, because then we'll be forced to discipline you. And don't worry about it, Christ is full of forgiveness. Go ahead and have your fun, everyone else is doing it."

[kel varson]

We live in the information age, and the internet is available to all. If a college kid is ignorant on sex today, they are just too lazy to figure it out IMO.

You want kids learning about sex from the Internet?!

I thought the same thing. And wouldn't those websites be blocked at LU. I can just see an LU student googling something along those lines. I wonder what would come up....

[SuperJon]

Teach them how to be safe, but don't give them the physical tools. It's a lot easier to say no when you know how to be safe but don't have the things around to be safe and know the consequence of doing things in an unsafe way. When you've got the materials needed, it's a lot harder to say no.

[belcherboy]

If it were my son or daughter, I wouldn't buy or give them a condom. That sounds selfish, but I would kill them first. I'm not married, nor do I have kids so I've got a WHOLE lot to learn.

ok- THAT prompted a response. I haven't even read anything posted after this- so if someone else jumped on it, I apologize.

HAVE KIDS, THEN SAY THAT.

I would die for my wife and children. If there is ANYTHING I can do to keep them safe- I'll do it- INCLUDING teaching safe-sex practices. And I'm a firm believer that abstinence is the BEST choice, but realistic to understand how kids feel and think.

I could never live with the consequences of my child dying from a mistake due to LACK OF EDUCATION.

I'd bet money FUMBLE agrees with me.

Just to get this straight. If youR daughter said that she was going to have sex with her boyfriend tonight, you would then make sure she had a condom? I guess I won't understand that as a parent, she would have to kill me to get to that boy.

You claim that kids "die" from "LACK OF EDUCATION". How many kids "die" each year from STD's? I would be more worried about them driving home at night and killed by a drunk driver than dying from an STD. Let's be honest, it isn't about life and death. Quality of life, for sure, but I don't think it is life and death. Maybe I underestimate the AIDS virus too much.

I'm sorry if I offended you, but I am not a parent and perhaps those who have no children should not talk about this subject.

[BJWilliams]

I personally have this stance: Me personally, Im waiting. I do not want to waste one of the greatest gifts God bestowed upon mankind for a few moments of passion. I want the first, last and only person I ever have intercourse with to be my wife, and we will not have intercourse before that time. As I reitereated in another topic...was I sheltered? Yes. Does this mean Im a mindless drone? Heck no. My parents taught me what was right and what was wrong, but they also made sure to live it out in front of us. My parents have been faithful to each other for over thirty years (from the time they met in college to this present day). I want to be just like them in that regard. Now are they perfect? No. But my parents are the kind of people that they make their message very clear with regard to things like this, AND they make sure to live it out themselves so as not to send a mixed message to myself or my three sisters. We are at an age (all four of us) where we should be making decisions for ourselves (well with the exception of my older sister but she is mentally handicapped at this point and it may be a while before she is able to do that sort of thing for herself), but they made sure that they showed us what was right and what was wrong so that when we had to make the decisions for ourselves. we could.

[LUconn]

please. stop saying intercourse.

[blwall1416]

please. stop saying intercourse.

Note to LUconn: Do NOT move to "that city of which we do not speak", Pennsylvania.

[LUconn]

I'll pretend that he's talking about conversational intercourse. The baseball of intercourses.

[blwall1416]

I'll pretend that he's talking about conversational intercourse. The baseball of intercourses.

Maybe even, the women's basketball of intercourses, perhaps....

[belcherboy]

I talk to my high school boys about this all the time (those who play basketball for me). Basically if they ask me a question about sex/relationships, I'll answer it as best I can. The one opinion I share with them is that sex isn't the most destructive thing you can do outside of marriage in a relationship. Parents, and others often push kids to have exclusive relationships in high school. Basically telling them to have a mature, adult relationship, but NO SEX. What ends up happening is that these kids end up becoming emotionally bonded to the point that when a breakup happens (it is virtually inevitable for high school kids), it is like a divorce. The vast majority never had sex (to my knowledge). They end up depressed, hating each other, bitter, and carry deep wounds for a long time. There has got to be something wrong with it. IMO it would be less damaging if they just hooked up one night for sex, and never went out again, than to get into this "deep/mature" relationship in which they are both unable to handle. I'm definitely not advocating it, but wondering what your guys opinions are. Especially you with older kids.

What do you think?

[BJWilliams]

please. stop saying intercourse.

well you get my point Im at least assuming.

[belcherboy]

please. stop saying intercourse.

Note to LUconn: Do NOT move to "that city of which we do not speak", Pennsylvania.

I love that place. I went to watch my sister play softball out in California when Liberty played a big tourney out there. We stayed in a city called Placenta (or at least that is what I called it). They played the tournament at Cal State Fullerton.

[RubberMallet]

i had intercourse last night...