[LUconn]

I said that an FCS school can't move up and have success without having success first at the FCS level.



South Florida was never a true FCS school. All they did was stay FCS the four years required of the program. They weren't a team that was rooted in FCS football.

Alright now you're just making stuff up.

[SuperJon]

apples and oranges.

Liberty and USF.

[SuperJon]

I said that an FCS school can't move up and have success without having success first at the FCS level.



South Florida was never a true FCS school. All they did was stay FCS the four years required of the program. They weren't a team that was rooted in FCS football.

Alright now you're just making stuff up.

How? I may be off in my four years statement, but what did I make up? They were never a true FCS program.

[SuperJon]

Nope, I was right. They were FCS for four years. They moved to FBS in 2001.

97-00: FCS
01-07: FBS

[paradox]

The most significant point about USF is that everyone said that it couldn't be done and it wouldn't have without the reduction in scholarships. Parity enables opportunity.

If South Florida can come out of nowhere and surpass Florida, Florida State, and Miami, then why can't we surpass a mediocre program like UVA?

[LUconn]

How? I may be off in my four years statement, but what did I make up? They were never a true FCS program.

no not your specifics, that may be true. But if you gave LU more scholarships, a big time conference, a big stadium (which obviously would have had to meet the attendance requirements aka the fanbase is there) I don't see us not competing with other FBS teams because we didn't do well enough in FCS. It has no bearing on the future.

[SuperJon]

Name one true FCS team (meaning they weren't started with a fast-track to FBS) that hasn't had success at FCS and had success at FBS.

[paradox]

Apparently none, because when we name one, you redefine it as not a "pure" 1AA program.

[SuperJon]

That's the only one you can possibly say, and they had a plan in place from the beginning to go FBS after the required four years of FCS. They had Raymond James Stadium already, and a 40,000 member student-body. That's why I don't think you can count them as a true FCS school.


Believe me, I think, if done right, we could be successful in FBS football. I just think we need to be good in FCS football before we consider it.

[LUconn]

Name one true FCS team (meaning they weren't started with a fast-track to FBS) that hasn't had success at FCS and had success at FBS.

I'm assuming that since you asked that, that there isn't one. I honestly don't know who has historically been FCS. But I want you to show me the link that shows that these teams suck because they were no good at FCS. I think they all suck because they don't have a decent supporting conference.





Although Uconn was good for a couple of years at the BCS level and wasn't a good FCS team.

[El Scorcho]

PEOPLE SURE DO GET BORED IN AN OFF WEEK.

[SuperJon]

I'm assuming that since you asked that, that there isn't one. I honestly don't know who has historically been FCS. But I want you to show me the link that shows that these teams suck because they were no good at FCS. I think they all suck because they don't have a decent supporting conference.





Although Uconn was good for a couple of years at the BCS level and wasn't a good FCS team.

The reason they don't get the conference invites is because they're not good and don't have much to offer. For crappy teams to get into a great conference, they have to have something to add. USF gave the Big East the Florida market they lost with Miami. Another example is Samford joining the SoCon. Samford's not good at anything, but they add a bigger market to the conference and can be a travel partner for UTC.

Most schools aren't that lucky. The Buffalo's, Western Kentucky's, directional Michigan schools, etc don't have anything to offer, and that's why they're in the MAC and conferences like that winning a couple games every year.

[paradox]

There are only a handful of schools who have actually made the jump from 1AA to 1A, However, Flordia Atlantic is in contention for a Sun Belt championship with a big win over Minnesota and a tight loss to #2 South Florida. Also, Buffalo is still in the hunt in the MAC. Neither school had success at the 1AA level and both schools currently have espn-2 bowl games within their reach this season.

[SuperJon]

Those are great examples. They are not USF success but they can be regarded as a success.

Now, with that being said, I pose this question: Would you be happy with the equivalent of the Big South Championship and a No-Name Bowl on ESPN2 at the FBS level? Is that "success" in the eyes of Liberty?

[paradox]

It's the begining and a means to an end.

Ironically enough, if we played in the Insignificant.com Bowl before a live national audience, the start of a national fanbase may actually start to form.

[LUconn]

throw in the possibility of an occasional upset and sign me up.

[LUconn]

I'm assuming that since you asked that, that there isn't one. I honestly don't know who has historically been FCS. But I want you to show me the link that shows that these teams suck because they were no good at FCS. I think they all suck because they don't have a decent supporting conference.





Although Uconn was good for a couple of years at the BCS level and wasn't a good FCS team.

The reason they don't get the conference invites is because they're not good and don't have much to offer. For crappy teams to get into a great conference, they have to have something to add. USF gave the Big East the Florida market they lost with Miami. Another example is Samford joining the SoCon. Samford's not good at anything, but they add a bigger market to the conference and can be a travel partner for UTC.

Most schools aren't that lucky. The Buffalo's, Western Kentucky's, directional Michigan schools, etc don't have anything to offer, and that's why they're in the MAC and conferences like that winning a couple games every year.

ok, so now we're getting somewhere. Are you saying that LU has nothing else to offer, so we need to be good in order to be able to offer at least that? I'm thinking, you think that just applies to us. Which is a good point.

[SuperJon]

ok, so now we're getting somewhere. Are you saying that LU has nothing else to offer, so we need to be good in order to be able to offer at least that? I'm thinking, you think that just applies to us. Which is a good point.

You have always said that it's possible with the right conference affiliation, and I can agree with that. To answer your question, I don't think we have the things to offer to a big time conference that would make them want to accept a decent FCS program. We don't have a large market for them to move into (like Tampa or Birmingham).

throw in the possibility of an occasional upset and sign me up.

See, we disagree fundamentally. I'm not a fan of going 6-5 and playing in the middle of December on ESPN2 in a meaningless bowl game.

[paradox]

Since when was getting national exposure on TV meaningless?

What could be more meaningless than winning a conference that doesn't yield a post-season berth?

[SuperJon]

No one said meaningless. I just said it wouldn't be what I considered success.

At this point in time, yes, you're right about the Big South. That's why we're adding Stony Brook, so that we can get a post-season berth. Plus, Coastal proved last year that if you win our conference and have a good OOC schedule (like it's looking like we might have next year) then you can make the playoffs.

[PAmedic]

No one said meaningless. I just said it wouldn't be what I considered success.

See, we disagree fundamentally. I'm not a fan of going 6-5 and playing in the middle of December on ESPN2 in a meaningless bowl game.

uh.....

[SuperJon]

Ok, let me clarify:

TV exposure, by any means, is not meaningless.

However, the bowl game with no prestige means nothing.

We can get the same exact tv exposure in the playoffs of FCS.

Every round of the playoffs is televise. Half of the game in the first round are on ESPN2. The entire second and third round are on ESPN2, and the championship game is on ESPN. Technically speaking, a national title run at the FCS level would have more TV exposure than a No-Name bowl game.

[PAmedic]

wrong.

12000 posts of crap.

loser

[paradox]

How many conservative/moderate evangelicals enjoy college hoops?

For an hour or so, on a Friday afternoon in March of 1994, they were all LU fans.

The fanbase is out there, we just have to deliver the goods.

[SuperJon]

Read the edited.