[LUconn]

ask the medic how he hacked it. When did they get rid of the emergency service major anyway?

[SuperJon]

I know all about that. How much of that was "didn't want to hack it" as opposed to couldn't?

[LUconn]

eh, who knows. I really just wanted to point and laugh at him.

[SuperJon]

Haha fine with me.

[4everfsu]

LUconn it was easy, God led me there. Guess where I transferred from? Ever hear of BJU? Yep I stayed there for my freshman year. LBC was a breath of fresh air. Let me explain.

While at BJU not only was I an odd ball for carrying the KJV, as they backed the RSVP. But I was an odd ball for wanting to let blacks in the school. In my dorm was 5 people, one soph and four freshmen. I was from Tampa,Fl, one from Al., one from Ga, the other from PA. and the sophmore was from Toronto Canada. The two yankees were againist letting blacks in, us three southerner wanted to let blacks in. And they say southerners are bigots!!
I felt that black churches needed black pastors, teachers,etc. Needless to say I never saw a black student on campus. After supper every night they had a building opened where we could go and pray for missionaries around the world. I would always pick out the USA and found a black christian college in Atlanta Ga and that is who I would pray for.
One of my best friend at LBC was Mac Rivera a young black BB player from Jax Fl. His girlfriend and him was killed on the trestle at Treasure Island. They were not suppose to be up there and was walking across about halfway when a train approached them. Mac could have gotten away but he stayed with her. They were both knocked off the bridge, he was able to make it to the shore but died there. They found her body in the river a day or two later. I believe this happened after I graduated. This is the best I can recall of the story.

As far as music, we could not even listen to the Carpenters back then. We could not listen to any Gospel quartets. We had to get our music cleared by the school before we could listen to it.
Heck I remember the debate they had back then for the song "I will fly away", theologically BJU said we will not fly away. Don't get me started on this one.

When a couple entered a building the guy and girl could not continue to walk together, they had to go their seperate way. I don't think you could even hold hands when walking together.

They even had 1st and 2nd degree seperations for Christian, too long to explain here.

My dream was to go to West Point, God had other plans, so when it comes to discipline, it never bothered me. Like I said God led me to LBC. I can honestly say we had something that the students after us never had. We had a pioneering spirit, plain and simple, no one believed we would succeed but Jerry and us.

[4everfsu]

SJ we will never know if they can hack it. They are not here and probably would not come to try. Like you said reason some don't come to LU is because of the rules, the Liberty way,etc.

[TallyW]

SJ-- You say it's harder to go to a school with no rules? You're out of your mind.

I had NO connection at all to Christian schools and I grew up in the inner city of Baltimore with the worst of the worst going on around me. I LIMITED my choices to Christian schools because I knew myself well enough to know that at a state school I'd grow no closer to Christ. Contrary to your belief, many people attend LU for the discipline and growth it offers. Just about all of my friends at LU were from rough areas and had chosen LU over most state schools for that reason. They weren't perfect and they were attracted to the fact that they would be challenged at LU. The facts are that over 50% of the homes kids come from were broken homes and out of the other 50% it's safe to say that most had little discipline at home. When students think about where they want to be in life they actually consider going somewhere to challenge them long-term. They also are excited to be in a positive atmosphere. This is undisputed.

There is no challenge when you can continue living with the maturity of a 17 year old and manipulate your way through life. Finding ways to get around rules instead of accepting them and living with them is a childish view and in my opinion an unbiblical one. If you don't like the rules, don't sign up. It's pretty simple.


By the way SJ your euphemisms don't help make your point, they make you look like a 12 year old. You can have the discussion without it. When you bring up a good point it's overshadowed by your attempt to sound passionate.

[SuperJon]

Have you been to a school without the rules? I didn't think so. Have you lived away from home and been to school with no mommy or daddy or RA looking out for whenever you go to bed? Didn't think so either. I have. I know from personal experience. That's what makes college though. The mornings where you got maybe 2 or 3 hours of sleep because you were out the night before but still get up and go to school and get your work done. That teaches more discipline and responsibility than Jerry tucking you in bed at 12 every night.

[TallyW]

SJ-- Oh how immature and ignorant we are.

1. Have I been to a school without the rules? Yes. I've taken classes at a total of 4 colleges during the course of my degree.

2. Have I lived away from home with...? Yes. In fact, upon graduating High School I moved on my own 1500 miles away to Dallas, TX and got an apartment, a full time job, bought my own groceries, paid my own electric, bought my own car... all within 3 weeks of graduating High School. I was also the first person in my family for several generations to graduate high school and attend college. With my Masters degree, I'm more educated than just about anyone around me. I've never had a problem with doing things on my own. Hence the point I make. It's more difficult to live under authority.

3. Staying up and out late at night teaches you nothing but how to be stupid and irresponsible. You seem to think that no one can relate to long nights and early mornings. Ask how many of the guys on this board have children and have stayed up to handle a sick and crying baby. Then they have to turn around and get to work early in the morning. Please don't attempt to lecture us on your grand total of 1.5 years of college experience at 4 different colleges. Again, you come off looking petty.

In addition, you're proving the point. You've lived with no rules before and when you come to LU you can't submit to the ones that you signed your name to. You brag about skirting them and getting around any policy you don't like. SJ... that's easier than dealing with it. Being a man is owning up to what you sign your name to. To me I read your constant euphamisms and bragging about sleeping in instead of attending church regularly... I can only assume you have very few people in life who you do submit to.

Great leaders are first great followers.

[SuperJon]

I actually never remember signing anything in pen, period. Bringing up the kid point has nothing to do with what I was talking about when I said staying out late. You didn't have those kids while in college so you didn't learn until you were out of college. Me and you will never see eye to eye on this. We have different backgrounds and come from different places.

[4everfsu]

SJ, let see, I could have changed my major at LBC but I would had stay another year and a half, and I went to college to get a four year degree so between my junior and senior year if I wanted to graduate with the founding class I had to take 12 hours that summer.
I had to attend both summer sessions full time, meaning six hours per session. I remember going to work one after noon at 4 pm, getting off at 5 am the next day and having to be at class at 7:30 and out around 1 pm. And then back to work at 4 pm.
I didnt need anyone to tuck me in bed but I had a goal and was not going to fool around or waste my time or life at LBC. At this time I was living off campus, so I had no one monitoring per se if I lived on the island or motel.
We had people there who loved to say I am cramming four years into five but I didn't want to waste a year at school when I could apply myself with just a little effort. It is harder for someone to attend a school that has discipline then one that doesn't. Proof of that is that some of your contacts don't want to experience the Liberty way. Why? Because of our rules. A Christian's life is one of discipline. so why should not LU be a school with rules?

[SuperJon]

I didnt need anyone to tuck me in bed but I had a goal and was not going to fool around or waste my time or life at LBC. At this time I was living off campus, so I had no one monitoring per se if I lived on the island or motel.

That's my entire point right there. You probably learned more that summer dedicating yourself to school and work like that than you did the other semesters. You had to balance things and figure a way to make them work. Right now, with the curfew, LU balances your social life for you. They don't let you make the mistakes of staying out too late one night. I just think it teaches you more when you have to balance school, work, and a social life all at the same time. That prepares you for the "real world" more than a dress code or a curfew or anything like that. It gets you ready for something that you're actually going to have to deal with after graduation.

[4everfsu]

SJ I had already learned before that summer. What do you think I had done the previous semesters, I worked full time and went to school full time. I had no grants or loan during my four years. I was too dumb to look into them, I was raised you worked for everything in life.
You need curfews for discipline, why do you think pro teams have them during their training camps. I dont remember reading about athletes getting in trouble during the daytime it is at night when they get in trouble. Most kids today are undisciplined so a curfew is needed. Most kids cannot get by with a couple hours of sleep and pass their course so they need to be in bed getting their sleep.
Tell me what good things can be accomplished after midnight other then you working a third shift job.
I would say most students who are out late at night are more intersted in partying then in studying and getting prepared for life.

[A.G.]

Some students choose LU just because of the rules. I have a buddy that was a pretty good partier in high school, but chose LU over schools such as JMU or Tech simply because he knew that he would get into a bad rut at the secular schools, that he did not have the self-discipline to regulate his behavior.

[SuperJon]

Tell me what good things can be accomplished after midnight other then you working a third shift job.
I would say most students who are out late at night are more intersted in partying then in studying and getting prepared for life.

That's typical stereotyping right there. I have never drank a drop of alcohol in my life (take that back, I took communion at a Lutheran church once) and I stay out late all of the time. I have a 3.25 GPA. People automatically assume that kids in college want to party all of the time and that's it. Most of the time people are just hanging out, watching a movie, playing video games, or just goofing off enjoying being young. I'm going to quote something that maybe you should take into consideration before you start lumping in sweeping generalizations like that crap you just said:

This is a fair request, and I promise I will not judge any person only as a teenager.
You will constantly remind yourself that some of my generation judges people by their race,
their belief, or the color of their skin, and that this is no more right
than saying all teenagers are drunken dope-addicts or glue-sniffers.

[4everfsu]

SJ
I have a saying for you.
If your telephone rings, answer it!

With your GPA you should be able to figure it out.

[SuperJon]

Man I love Liberty.

[4everfsu]

[Libertine]

Mmmm, glue. I have some fond memories of sitting around with the fellas in D13 at 3:30 in the morning passing around a bottle of airplane epoxy. Good stuff. Good stuff. I've heard a phone ringing ever since.

[A.G.]

Guess we know now what's hiding in the wooly mustache!

[Purple Haize]

SJ- Why is everyone picking on you dude?? Is it your typing? Maybe you should change your name to SuperManger or something
You are absolutely correct that Liberty's rules turn several, not all, but several people off to the school. I am not sure why that is even being argued. Yes we are having an enrollment boom, but can those SJ detractors say that it is BECAUSE of the rules? I am not even sure you can say in spite of the rules. University and College enrollment is booming everywhere. Add to that all the other factors and you can see that the reasons MOST PEOPLE come here is NOT because of the rules. Sure there is a good chunk of students who feel that they NEED the rules to keep them on the straight and narrow, which is evidenced by a lot of the posters here. As for my experience, I know I turned down sholarship offers from schools whose rules I could not or did not want to follow. I am POSITIVE the same happens at LU. Does this make these people "less"?
As for being out on your own, most people coming to college are experiencing leaving home for the first time and all hell can (and most often does) break loose. It speaks well of those who know what they can or can not handle. The NORM is for people in this stage of life to learn from their mistakes.
Why is everyone getting midevil on this topic? Yes, the rules were "harsher" back "in the day". So? Why is this becoming a combative topic? When my wife went to LBC/LU, she had her AIR SUPPLY tape confiscated by her coach. I mean c'mon AIR SUPPLY PEOPLE. I applaud SJ for knowing what he needs to do to get a good degree and keep his life on track. I applaud those of you that made it through the "dark days" of the "Liberty Way". And I applaud those who chose NOT to go to LU b/c of the rules.
Now let's return to our regularly scheduled thread

[SuperJon]

Oh lord of Sport Management, teach me to become like you.

[whmatthews]

Sweet Lord. Well I posted this thread about a Christian kid at NC State who I thought would be a good pick up for LU since he was dedicated to the Lord and ministry, but I didn't figure it would turn into such a grand debate about the Liberty Way. It could be possible that he has never even heard of Liberty University and that nobody had ever heard of him so LU didn't even try to recruit him. I think SJ and the old timers are both right to an extent. This is my senior year at Liberty and I've heard very little about the way it used to be, but just by reading posts on FlameFans, I feel like I know the whole history of "the way it was." Going to a school without rules does to an extent teach you some responsibility but at the same rate it's not doing anything for a person's well-being. I interned at Senator Elizabeth Dole's Eastern Office in Greenville NC and one of my former teachers at the local community college here is now in charge of the East Carolinian (student newspaper) and showed me a report in his publication that 1 out of 4 students at East Carolina have an STD. And going to class with only two to three hours of sleep isn't irregular even at a school like ours. Atleast on guys dorms, kids stay up all night playing Halo or Texas Hold 'Em. The difference is that they aren't hung over. Well, some of them are... some that I know. (Beer in Mountain Dew bottles).

Well... anyway... let's all get along.

[SuperJon]

Vodka in Sobe or Aquafina bottles is even more present than the beer in Mtn Dew bottles.

[whmatthews]

Indeed it its... Beer tastes like pee-pee. Or atleast smells like it.