This is the location for conversations that don't fall anywhere else on FlameFans. Whether its politics, culture, the latest techno stuff or just the best places to travel on the web ... this is your forum.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke

The Bible is filled with stories of Him doing great things by people who did not live the greatest of lives. That is what God has done since the beginning of time and will continue to do so. Liberty was founded on a solid foundation and that is the reason why great things continue to be done in God's name.

We are to strive to always become better and that has not happened at the very top at LU for a very long time.

With that said, there is enough smoke coming out of the board room to know that there is fire that needs to be put out. Jr was a symptom, not the cause. He was given too much power and fell into the traps a lot of people fall into that have too much unchecked power. If the board had learned their lesson then they wouldn't be giving Prevo the same kind of unchecked power Jr had, but here we are.
Racenut wrote: April 10th, 2021, 1:36 pm 'Complete C-Suite overhaul", calling leadership a "joke" and saying that LU doesn't have a serious "faculty or curriculum" are phrases that have been tossed around by a few here, not by you I might add. These things offend me and do a disservice to all that has been done well. No one would advocate standing still, but give me a break, where has such a work on this scale been done before in Christ's name anywhere in the world,? Not many, if any.
Hi there. I’m the guy calling for a complete C-Suite overhaul and I stand by it. Doubly so in light of everything that has gone down the last year. Anyone from the Family, related to the Family or in position due to the Families largess needs to go. Yesterday. Ok maybe not yesterday but a nice slow roll would be acceptable. They’ve obviously taken the University as far as they can. Junior himself has stated many times this was not something he wanted or felt prepared for. Now as the veil is pulled back and we see the level of nepotism and incompetence major change at the top levels need to happen. That change can take LU to greater heights Heights that were only dreamed about.
User avatar
By Honest Abe
For what it's worth, the culture of the university is why I urged my son to consider LU after Jerry Jr. was gone. I never had any doubts about the culture of the campus, the students, the faculty. The mountain is a special place. It's a life changing place in so many ways. I believe that has always been the case. Maybe my experience is not the same as others, but I've never been in anywhere else so filled with people, young and old, who were passionate about the Kingdom of Christ. Who understood that the gospel meant more than a ticket to heaven or their personal salvation, but a grace-filled invitation to live within the rule and reign of Jesus starting now: to live differently and for a different purpose. Yes, there are people there who don't get that, or who are simply playing the game because that's where mom & dad will pay for them to go to school. Yes, there are people who see through too much of a Fox news lens. But it's not like other places. The culture on the ground is not perfect, but it's pretty special.
However, I did say that I urged my oldest to consider LU AFTER Jerry Jr. was gone. The leadership culture definitely needs revival. That didn't start with Jr. I was around in the Godwin years. There was a culture that didn't exactly reflect the idea of the imago dei in it's employees. I'd like to see some public recognition that the board structure and expectations needs an overhaul. I think the board needs to be filled with people who have a rich experience with good Christian higher education, either as faculty, administration, or students. Who places people on the board, anyhow? And how long are terms. New voices are a must to change the culture.
flameshaw, stokesjokes, Kricket and 4 others liked this
Getting back to the culture of Liberty, I thought Russell Moore's latest newsletter had some great nuggets in it about the generation we're trying to reach.

We now see young evangelicals walking away from evangelicalism not because they do not believe what the church teaches, but because they believe the church itself does not believe what the church teaches. The presenting issue in this secularization is not scientism and hedonism but disillusionment and cynicism.
The politicization of American religion is a key driver of people away from religious affiliation. Some would point to the fact that most of those leaving would identify politically as somewhere from moderate to progressive, to suggest that such people are better off outside the church in the first place. Let’s just assume for the sake of argument that such is true, which comes first here—the demand to line up politically in order to follow Jesus or the decision to reject the politics of those making such demands? Moreover, it seems to me that the controversy is not actually even over the specific political planks or ideas or personalities as the fact that many have come to believe that the religion itself is a vehicle for the politics and the cultural grievances—and not the other way around.
If evangelicalism is politics, people can get their politics somewhere else—and fight and fornicate and get drunk too, if they want. A religion that calls people away from Western modernity will have to say, with credibility, “Take up your cross and follow me,” not “Come with us, and we’ll own the libs.” One can do the latter on YouTube and one needn’t even give up a Sunday morning.
Almost every survey of disaffiliating people has also emphasized the scandals within the church—most notably the sexual abuse cover-ups and predatory behavior.
When it comes to the culture of Liberty, two things jump out to me:

1) If we want to reach the next generation, we cannot be Republican U or Turning Point Light. We have to actually focus on the Gospel first and foremost. The current Board of Trustees has no desire to do that at all.

2) If we want to reach the next generation, we have to be transparent and above reproach when it comes to scandals. We cannot have an ounce of a coverup in the Jerry/Becki sexual abuse allegations nor the predatory/culture of fear within the administration. Again, the current Board of Trustees is content playing the Fundamentalist Scandal Playbook and staying quiet to cover everything up.

These things are not seen by students who are more focused on living their life or alumni who aren't paying attention past a sports score. However, as people who legitimately care about the school, these are the things that matter if we want to have true influence in the lives of the next generation.
stokesjokes, thepostman, JK37 and 1 others liked this
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
As far as your first point goes, when the school was rebranded as "Liberty" the mission broadened. Carl Henry was the driving force. Art DeMoss had the capital and marketing expertise. They came from the liberal epicenter of the mainline left. There were no other real options for non-left leaning evangelicals. So, they came down here and joined forces with Big Jerry. Jerry was an inspirational leader who had strong mainline evangelical appeal along with a less judgmental approach toward fundies. He had the skills to build a coalition. And he delivered. As the saying goes, the more things change, the more they stay the same. This institution has a very clear dual mission. Don't expect a left turn.

With your second point, Junior and his wife seem to have been involved with things that run a little deeper than simple sins and mistakes. Malignant self-absorption is one way to describe it. Don't know if Junior was codependent or the driving force. Self-deception and deceiving others seem to go hand-in-hand. Obviously, if there is a factual basis that anyone enabled this, then they would need to swiftly follow him out the door.
flameshaw, Just John liked this[…],q_a[…] Elijah Strong […] Cal Klesmit 6[…]