If roundball is your blood, this is the place to discuss the Flames as they move into the Ritchie McKay era for the 2nd time.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke

By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#594262
It may be because the PA system and pep band are so loud, it drains noise from fans. They don't feel the need to make noise.

Serious question: why does PA system have to always start blaring out noise during every time out ?
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#594270
Dalegarz1 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 11:32 am Attendance is more than just number of people there. I was there for the Lipscomb game (section 116). To be honest, I was a little disappointed in the atmosphere. I would love to see a designated area for students that is close to the court (ala Cameron Indoor, MSU and others). For 6-7k in the Vines Center, it was never what I would call loud.
Spot on. :clapping

The entire fan culture that has developed over 30 years of having an arena that was too big for demand has in general reduced the intensity and energy level of those who attend. Being able to see our basketball team play live is not particularly special, because all you need to do is show up with your student ID or ticket (or the $$ to buy one) and you are in. The venues with the best game day atmosphere are places where a seat at the show is a precious commodity.

Starting next year for students, that hopefully will mean having to do something to EARN your seat. Not a fan of the lottery system. I like the idea of having a test about the current team and the history of the program with those scoring highest getting first shot at a seat. Not talking on line here. You would need to show up in person for the test and it would be proctored like the SATs. It's something you can prepare for if you already don't know the stuff as a result of your fandom, but will require an investment in time and energy. Non students will either need to get season tickets or plan ahead for the games they want to/can see and buy in advance. Any seats still available on game day would likely involve getting in line early at the ticket office.
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By Geraldos Mustache
Posts
#594272
oldflame wrote: January 20th, 2020, 12:24 pm
Dalegarz1 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 11:32 am Attendance is more than just number of people there. I was there for the Lipscomb game (section 116). To be honest, I was a little disappointed in the atmosphere. I would love to see a designated area for students that is close to the court (ala Cameron Indoor, MSU and others). For 6-7k in the Vines Center, it was never what I would call loud.
Spot on. :clapping

The entire fan culture that has developed over 30 years of having an arena that was too big for demand has in general reduced the intensity and energy level of those who attend. Being able to see our basketball team play live is not particularly special, because all you need to do is show up with your student ID or ticket (or the $$ to buy one) and you are in. The venues with the best game day atmosphere are places where a seat at the show is a precious commodity.

Starting next year for students, that hopefully will mean having to do something to EARN your seat. Not a fan of the lottery system. I like the idea of having a test about the current team and the history of the program with those scoring highest getting first shot at a seat. Not talking on line here. You would need to show up in person for the test and it would be proctored like the SATs. It's something you can prepare for if you already don't know the stuff as a result of your fandom, but will require an investment in time and energy. Non students will either need to get season tickets or plan ahead for the games they want to/can see and buy in advance. Any seats still available on game day would likely involve getting in line early at the ticket office.
I love the idea of taking a proctored test about LU basketball to EARN your seat. Super cool.

Does anyone know if there is an officially recognized student organization for LU student fans? I would hope there would be a student club so student fans can organize and show up in mass for games, sit together, dress up, bring signs etc.
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By thepostman
Registration Days Posts
#594277
ballcoach15 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 11:38 am It may be because the PA system and pep band are so loud, it drains noise from fans. They don't feel the need to make noise.

Serious question: why does PA system have to always start blaring out noise during every time out ?
That has absolutely zero to do with it, this is another example of you allowing your biases to get in the way of reality. If that were the case all college basketball arenas all around the country would be quiet as well. The atmosphere at games in the Vines has had this problem for a while now where even when it is full it is pretty quiet. I miss when the students were in the 3 sections behind the benches.

Regardless, this just reinforces my opinion that our smaller arena will help create a better environment. Typically the student who get to the arena earlier are the more passionate ones and will be the only ones there and won't have to worry about the kids who tend to get upset at students for standing up.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#594278
The University of Illinois bases where the students sit on how much money they are able to raise for charity. The people that raise the most money get courtside seats. The ones that can only raise a few dollars sit in the upper deck and it's pretty competitive among some of them.
I kind of like the idea of a points system. The more LU events you go to, the closer to the court you get. It could be a way to get more student at football games and other events around campus.
By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#594281
Problem with a test: ALL students pay student activity fees. Limiting access when ALL are paying could be a problem.

There is a student flames club, and several other unofficial ones started up by students themselves.

Ballcoach: turn your hearing aids down if you need to. Bottom line is that Athletics is entertainment. People are entertained in different ways. Very few who attend games are the savant of sport that you are. So they need more surface level entertainment, or they become bored. Do you ever talk or look at your phone during breaks in action? It’s the same thing. You’re filling the time between moments of action. For many others, music and games provided by event management do the same.

Points system is interesting, but hopefully not tied to specific seat. Students want to sit with their friends, too.
By ballah09
Registration Days Posts
#594286
Geraldos Mustache wrote: January 20th, 2020, 12:37 pm
oldflame wrote: January 20th, 2020, 12:24 pm
Dalegarz1 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 11:32 am Attendance is more than just number of people there. I was there for the Lipscomb game (section 116). To be honest, I was a little disappointed in the atmosphere. I would love to see a designated area for students that is close to the court (ala Cameron Indoor, MSU and others). For 6-7k in the Vines Center, it was never what I would call loud.
Spot on. :clapping

The entire fan culture that has developed over 30 years of having an arena that was too big for demand has in general reduced the intensity and energy level of those who attend. Being able to see our basketball team play live is not particularly special, because all you need to do is show up with your student ID or ticket (or the $$ to buy one) and you are in. The venues with the best game day atmosphere are places where a seat at the show is a precious commodity.

Starting next year for students, that hopefully will mean having to do something to EARN your seat. Not a fan of the lottery system. I like the idea of having a test about the current team and the history of the program with those scoring highest getting first shot at a seat. Not talking on line here. You would need to show up in person for the test and it would be proctored like the SATs. It's something you can prepare for if you already don't know the stuff as a result of your fandom, but will require an investment in time and energy. Non students will either need to get season tickets or plan ahead for the games they want to/can see and buy in advance. Any seats still available on game day would likely involve getting in line early at the ticket office.
I love the idea of taking a proctored test about LU basketball to EARN your seat. Super cool.

Does anyone know if there is an officially recognized student organization for LU student fans? I would hope there would be a student club so student fans can organize and show up in mass for games, sit together, dress up, bring signs etc.
The Lunatics is back from its hiatus. I don't know if it's officially a club (It should) but SGA is pushing it. We need an official student section.

I think we should do whatever GCU is doing. I do remember someone saying we sent people over there to get tips so hopefully it helps!
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#594288
JK37 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 1:42 pm Problem with a test: ALL students pay student activity fees. Limiting access when ALL are paying could be a problem.

There is a student flames club, and several other unofficial ones started up by students themselves.

Ballcoach: turn your hearing aids down if you need to. Bottom line is that Athletics is entertainment. People are entertained in different ways. Very few who attend games are the savant of sport that you are. So they need more surface level entertainment, or they become bored. Do you ever talk or look at your phone during breaks in action? It’s the same thing. You’re filling the time between moments of action. For many others, music and games provided by event management do the same.

Points system is interesting, but hopefully not tied to specific seat. Students want to sit with their friends, too.
With only (maybe) 2000 or so of 4000 seats allotted to students, one way or another there is going to be a limit placed. "First come, first serve" on game day would be a disaster. Go with a lottery and you have students who couldn't care less getting spots and not showing up, plus you can "bet" there are some hard-core fundies who would consider it satanic.

At Duke, you have to pass an exam like I talked about just to QUALIFY to camp out in line for spots. We obviously aren't at that level yet.
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#594290
ballah09 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 1:59 pm
Geraldos Mustache wrote: January 20th, 2020, 12:37 pm
oldflame wrote: January 20th, 2020, 12:24 pm

Spot on. :clapping

The entire fan culture that has developed over 30 years of having an arena that was too big for demand has in general reduced the intensity and energy level of those who attend. Being able to see our basketball team play live is not particularly special, because all you need to do is show up with your student ID or ticket (or the $$ to buy one) and you are in. The venues with the best game day atmosphere are places where a seat at the show is a precious commodity.

Starting next year for students, that hopefully will mean having to do something to EARN your seat. Not a fan of the lottery system. I like the idea of having a test about the current team and the history of the program with those scoring highest getting first shot at a seat. Not talking on line here. You would need to show up in person for the test and it would be proctored like the SATs. It's something you can prepare for if you already don't know the stuff as a result of your fandom, but will require an investment in time and energy. Non students will either need to get season tickets or plan ahead for the games they want to/can see and buy in advance. Any seats still available on game day would likely involve getting in line early at the ticket office.
I love the idea of taking a proctored test about LU basketball to EARN your seat. Super cool.

Does anyone know if there is an officially recognized student organization for LU student fans? I would hope there would be a student club so student fans can organize and show up in mass for games, sit together, dress up, bring signs etc.
The Lunatics is back from its hiatus. I don't know if it's officially a club (It should) but SGA is pushing it. We need an official student section.

I think we should do whatever GCU is doing. I do remember someone saying we sent people over there to get tips so hopefully it helps!
Yeah, we sent Steven Gonzalez to work undercover for GCU's AC department for a few years. He brought back lots of tips. 8)
By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#594295
I hope I am wrong on this, but limiting tickets to both students and adults could do more harm than good, for the fan base. Deny someone entrance, they may never show up again. Several years ago, I was denied entrance to a sold out high school tournament game, (and I had a pass). I have yet to return to a basketball game at that high school.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#594298
If we are averaging close to a sellout in the new building it could incentive people to buy season tickets. not only so they won't miss out on getting seats but those seats might be worth more on the secondary market if they can't make it to a game. For schools that have huge demand for season tickets they sometimes require donations to the school before you can even buy the tickets.

This isnt an apples or oranges comparison but Nebraska football has such a high demand for football season tickets that they have some sort of points system that encourages people to buy season tickets to other teams (basketball, baseball, softball, volleyball) which is why Nebraska baseball has huge attendance despite them playing in very cold weather.
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By Dalegarz1
Posts
#594302
I hope that it does reach the stage where available tickets are at a premium. It will result in the most serious fans being in the arena. Right now it reminds me of when the Dean dome was characterized as a wine and cheese crowd. Although the Vine Center is more like a mac and cheese crowd.
By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#594307
I seem to recall when VT joined ACC, they sold a lot of basketball season tickets. Many people brought season tickets just to make sure they had ticket when Duke and UNC came to town. Seats remained empty most games. They "sold out" to the high rollers. VT has a better team now, thus it's probably not as noticeable.
I think LU will sell a lot of season tickets for new arena, more than they sell now.
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#594311
ballcoach15 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 4:01 pm I hope I am wrong on this, but limiting tickets to both students and adults could do more harm than good, for the fan base. Deny someone entrance, they may never show up again. Several years ago, I was denied entrance to a sold out high school tournament game, (and I had a pass). I have yet to return to a basketball game at that high school.
This is your lucky day, as your hope has been realized. You are wrong. 8)

You were no doubt "denied" entrance to that HS game years ago when you had a pass, because the game was sold out. My guess is the Fire Marshall had something to do with it. Somehow I don't think anyone is losing sleep because you haven't been back.

The discussion here is not about denying entrance to people who are entitled to it. It's about determining who is entitled when capacity is limited in as fair a way as possible, to assure the best home court advantage possible. If you want to revert to saying the solution is to have enough room so nobody ever has to be "denied", you are entitled to that opinion, but the past 30 years has pretty clearly demonstrated that is not the way to have an electric game atmosphere game in and game out. Time to try something different.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#594312
ballcoach15 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 4:01 pm I hope I am wrong on this, but limiting tickets to both students and adults could do more harm than good, for the fan base. Deny someone entrance, they may never show up again. Several years ago, I was denied entrance to a sold out high school tournament game, (and I had a pass). I have yet to return to a basketball game at that high school.
You are wrong
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By Geraldos Mustache
Posts
#594356
oldflame wrote: January 20th, 2020, 6:28 pm
ballcoach15 wrote: January 20th, 2020, 4:01 pm I hope I am wrong on this, but limiting tickets to both students and adults could do more harm than good, for the fan base. Deny someone entrance, they may never show up again. Several years ago, I was denied entrance to a sold out high school tournament game, (and I had a pass). I have yet to return to a basketball game at that high school.
This is your lucky day, as your hope has been realized. You are wrong. 8)

You were no doubt "denied" entrance to that HS game years ago when you had a pass, because the game was sold out. My guess is the Fire Marshall had something to do with it. Somehow I don't think anyone is losing sleep because you haven't been back.

The discussion here is not about denying entrance to people who are entitled to it. It's about determining who is entitled when capacity is limited in as fair a way as possible, to assure the best home court advantage possible. If you want to revert to saying the solution is to have enough room so nobody ever has to be "denied", you are entitled to that opinion, but the past 30 years has pretty clearly demonstrated that is not the way to have an electric game atmosphere game in and game out. Time to try something different.
Post of the Week.
Well done OldFlame.
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By adam42381
Registration Days Posts
#594357
ballcoach15 wrote: January 21st, 2020, 10:20 am I'll just be glad when LU softball starts having sellouts, like some SEC schools do now.
They got pretty close a couple years ago. Record attendance of 954 vs UVA (capacity is 1,000).

https://www.liberty.edu/media/1911/soft ... lassic.pdf

That said, it’s definitely hard to get fans out consistently in the cold (unless you’re in Michigan for some reason). Most of the top attendance numbers are from southern and southwestern schools.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/SB_Record ... ndance.pdf
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By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#594388
adam42381 wrote: January 21st, 2020, 11:04 am
ballcoach15 wrote: January 21st, 2020, 10:20 am I'll just be glad when LU softball starts having sellouts, like some SEC schools do now.
They got pretty close a couple years ago. Record attendance of 954 vs UVA (capacity is 1,000).

https://www.liberty.edu/media/1911/soft ... lassic.pdf

That said, it’s definitely hard to get fans out consistently in the cold (unless you’re in Michigan for some reason). Most of the top attendance numbers are from southern and southwestern schools.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/SB_Record ... ndance.pdf
Win.
User avatar
By Geraldos Mustache
Posts
#596176
Ill flame wrote:With one home game left in the regular season the average attendance is up to 4,276 through 13 games.
The new stadium will seat 4000. That means we would have had several sold out games with people competing for seats to watch LU basketball. That is an amazing thing. Very good move to go with a smaller stadium and create demand for seats. This is going to be awesome. Just need to keep winning!
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#596188
Geraldos Mustache wrote: February 21st, 2020, 12:32 am
Ill flame wrote:With one home game left in the regular season the average attendance is up to 4,276 through 13 games.
The new stadium will seat 4000. That means we would have had several sold out games with people competing for seats to watch LU basketball. That is an amazing thing. Very good move to go with a smaller stadium and create demand for seats. This is going to be awesome. Just need to keep winning!
My main concern with next year is that the move will correspond with a major rebuilding year on the court. I'm cautiously optimistic that the new and returning players will step up and continue the positive trend, but to expect the level of success we have had the last 2 years after losing Caleb, Scottie, Georgie and Myo would be unrealistic. I have no doubt that Ritchie will do a great job of "managing expectations" with the players. The fan base is another matter.
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