Anything and everything about Liberty Flames football. Your comments on games, recruiting and the direction of the program as we move into new era.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke, Class of 20Something

By Chris Lang
Registration Days Posts
#527025
Looking at this from the Big South angle ... I'm not sure there's any upside to the league just throwing LU to the curb. This is different than the Coastal situation. LU has been vocal about its hopes of going FBS since 2012. Coastal came out of the blue and moved all of its sports in a flash. If you look at the remaining schools in the Big South, no inside knowledge, but I still think there's a very real possibility Presbyterian realizes it's out of its depth in Division I and moves back to DII. The league only has nine members to begin with if Liberty is out, and if PC goes, then you're getting into dangerous numbers territory for all-sports purposes. And the chances of adding schools are limited thanks to the deal with the A-Sun. There's probably more upside for the Big South to hang onto LU as long as possible.

As for moving into an FBS conference, the independent status will help in showing that LU is capable of competing at that level. But I still don't think the Sun Belt will ever have any interest, and unless there's a lot of movement between CUSA and the AAC, I'm not sure where the openings will be there.

I will admittedly eat a lot of crow since I was one of the fiercest proponents of the idea that the NCAA would never cave to the independent rule.
By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#527028
Good post above LUnpretty. Probably best one I have read in this thread.


I hope the "planners" at LU are looking at increasing parking lots as they expand stadium. I don't think we can handle a 35,000 crowd with parking we have now.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#527030
Chris Lang wrote:Looking at this from the Big South angle ... I'm not sure there's any upside to the league just throwing LU to the curb. This is different than the Coastal situation. LU has been vocal about its hopes of going FBS since 2012. Coastal came out of the blue and moved all of its sports in a flash. If you look at the remaining schools in the Big South, no inside knowledge, but I still think there's a very real possibility Presbyterian realizes it's out of its depth in Division I and moves back to DII. The league only has nine members to begin with if Liberty is out, and if PC goes, then you're getting into dangerous numbers territory for all-sports purposes. And the chances of adding schools are limited thanks to the deal with the A-Sun. There's probably more upside for the Big South to hang onto LU as long as possible.

As for moving into an FBS conference, the independent status will help in showing that LU is capable of competing at that level. But I still don't think the Sun Belt will ever have any interest, and unless there's a lot of movement between CUSA and the AAC, I'm not sure where the openings will be there.

I will admittedly eat a lot of crow since I was one of the fiercest proponents of the idea that the NCAA would never cave to the independent rule.
I think the openings will be there as the FBS bubble begins to burst for several schools. It is not a financially long term sustainable model for schools. JR alluded to it himself that TV contracts are becoming less and less lucrative. More and more schools will be reexamining their commitment to that level of football
LU is the Charles Foster Kane (that movie is very relevant recently) of Football. It is losing millions of dollars on football but they don't care. Because that can AFFORD to lose Millions of dollars a year in football. Just like Kane and his first newspaper.
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By LUnpretty11
Registration Days Posts
#527031
Also, for those that still hate the fact that Liberty is going FBS Independent... The things worth doing - the most rewarding things - never come easily. It will be challenging, but it is absolutely worth it.

Ballcoach - the parking is there. Liberty fans are used to "convenient" and "free" parking. That will change. You may now need to walk a mile if you want to park for free. Or you now may have to pay $5-$10 for convenient parking, but the parking is there. Again, this encompasses an entire mindset shift from the athletic department and the entire fan base.
By ballah09
Registration Days Posts
#527032
I look it at a different angle. I think Gill knows he has a free pass this year. He can actually use that excuse more than anything. and throwing away a year of eligibility of your best young players on a pointless year will actually hurt any case he has of being the HC next year.

Spot on Chris.
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By LUnpretty11
Registration Days Posts
#527034
ballah09 wrote:I look it at a different angle. I think Gill knows he has a free pass this year. He can actually use that excuse more than anything. and throwing away a year of eligibility of your best young players on a pointless year will actually hurt any case he has of being the HC next year.

Spot on Chris.
Again, I challenge this thinking. If HCTG was in year 3, then yes. He is in year 6. He has to succeed this year and prove his worth to keep his job to be a part of the future.
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By VAGolf
Registration Days Posts
#527035
Just a few thoughts:

1. To me, this seems to actually give Gill a couple of more years. JFJR seemed to be very "pro-Gill" yesterday. It didn't look like something you would see if Gill was actually feeling pressure. However, if we haven't started winning by 2018, that would be a great time to let go of TG. We would be a very attractive option to several coaches, but hopefully we won't even consider Art Briles.

2. I'm a little surprised that someone hasn't at least joked about this, but if TG is fired in two years, I would be interested to see if Rocco's name pops up. He still has lots of connections to the area and Liberty's dynamic will have changed in more ways than one since he was last in Lynchburg.

3. The scheduling absolutely is of concern. I don't think I would "trust" McCaw with anything, but this will be a very difficult task. We won't have an issue getting a game at BYU, or at Army...etc, but I would be very surprised to see any nationally recognized programs taking a trip here, at least in the near future. Get used to a lot of UMass, UAB, and App State.

4. This is the only benefit to being independent. We are going to have a ton of flexibility with LFSN. A lot of people don't realize that LFSN has been incredibly limited due to KK. Now that we don't answer to a conference, we'll have freedom to broadcast all of our games and to market how we wish. Over time, this could and likely will help with the scheduling concerns.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#527036
LUnpretty11 wrote:If I am HCTG, there is no way I will red-shirting my best players. Look at it through another lens. HCTG is on the hot seat. He just got handed the biggest and greatest recruiting tool possible and it is up to him to drastically and quickly increase the level of recruiting for the program. He is not out of the woods yet and he cannot afford to have a losing or "down" year in 2017. Excitement is there and the fan base needs a reason to remain excited through 2018 as we turn to 2019 full FBS status. That gives HCTG 2 years to recruit a 3-star core and maybe even land some 4-star recruits, and don't think that is impossible. Just last year Liberty was in the top 3 for a 4-star DB who was choosing between Michigan, Arkansas and Liberty. The stadium expansion will be there in 2018 or 2019. The indoor practice facility is a HUGE recruiting tool. Imagine being a 4-star recruit and seeing the facilities and a brand new 35,000-40,000 seat stadium with the promise of playing some prime-time schools across the country. Talk about YUGE. We all know the ramifications down the road and how it will boost and bolster recruiting, but HCTG isn't in a position to look down the road. He has to make it through 2017 and hope he still has a job for 2018. Essentially HCTG is interviewing for 2018-beyond during the 2017 season. He doesn't have the luxury of "red-shirting the best players". Having Buck as a Sr. QB in the first year of bowl eligibility is great! So it's up to HCTG to have a 3-star or 4-star QB lined up to take the helm in 2020-beyond. Liberty HAS to be drastically better by 2019 than they are now, and that means recruiting better players than we have now. I hope Calvert crushes it, but I also hope he will be considered a mediocre option by 2019 because of how much better our recruiting will be at that time. That is not a shot against Calvert or any other QB on the roster, but that is the mindset of how things have to change and in a hurry.

As for scheduling. I feel confident IM, JLFJR and others will get the scheduling figured out. The games are there and the pieces will fall into place. ODU has been vocal about wanting to be able to play Liberty after we paid them a visit in 2013. A cooler thought, can you imagine the crowd in Williams Stadium if Army came to Lynchburg to play? How incredible would that atmosphere be?! For those thinking this is the curse of LU sports, I encourage you to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. I'm not saying it will be easy, but the overnight change in mindset is incredible. There are schools that will have to come play Liberty in Lynchburg because they need the game. Also, Liberty has a great reputation for a game day experience, so that will only help bolster more schools coming to the bill. It will be a challenge, but it will be so worth it when we have FBS schools coming to the Burg!

Go Flames!
Hopefully no one gets distracted by this post. I haven't run it by the proper censors yet

That's a good thought about Gill. I guess it does all boil down to how much on a hot seat he feels. If he thinks it's hot then he absolutely will not Redshirt anyone that can help him right now. Who cares about Bowl Eligibility if you don't have a job. On the other hand if he feels safe and secure in his job then it would be smart to redshirt as many as he can. The next two years are totally irrelevant. Why burn a year on kids when you can use them later when it counts? Think long term. Also, you can sell it to the kids saying 'look you have a chance to play in 2 Bowl Games!'
Scheduling is going to be a lot harder then people think. I listed some teams I thought LU would get on a consistent basis but apparently everyone was to distracted to notice. But this is where Ian can make his money. He does have connections so hopefully what he told JR about his ability to bring teams to Lynchburg rings true
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#527037
LUnpretty11 wrote:Also, for those that still hate the fact that Liberty is going FBS Independent... The things worth doing - the most rewarding things - never come easily. It will be challenging, but it is absolutely worth it
Climbing Mt Everest is not easy. Lots of people die trying. If I went there right now and tried to climb I would probably die. Judging the worthiness of something by its difficulty is fraught with fallacy
By ballah09
Registration Days Posts
#527039
I see your point. I believe the transition bought him another year or two and In the long run the smart thing to do is to redshirt the young talent.

also no more ASN :mrgreen:
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By lawrenceq
Registration Days Posts
#527040
You guys cool with the ceiling being a conference championship and a bowl game? At least at the FCS level you can compete for a national championship.
By ballcoach15
Registration Days Posts
#527041
In the current college football landscape, I think a bowl game would out weigh a BSC championship.

Someday we will be in a FBS Conference.

Why did KK limit LSFN ?

I think there will be some big surprises as to some of teams coming to LU. Some big boy teams may want to play in Lynchburg to aid recruiting in this part of the country. Some schools do play in uncharted landscapes to help with recruiting.
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By lawrenceq
Registration Days Posts
#527042
ballcoach15 wrote:In the current college football landscape, I think a bowl game would out weigh a BSC championship.
I agree with that, but what about a FCS national championship?
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By LUnpretty11
Registration Days Posts
#527043
I'm cool with the fact that we won't have to share a conference title for a least a few years, that will be nice!

PH, I get where you're coming from. Several schools have "died climbing that mountain" already. As many people have said, if there is a school to succeed doing it, it's Liberty. I get the redshirt argument and I would typically agree with it. It made complete sense for App, but when you're in your 6th year and just handed the best gift you can imagine... Success is paramount and time is of the essence. HCTG has to keep the fans engaged and excited for the next 2 years, he has no choice.

For the scheduling concerns. When was the last time App State came to Lynchburg for a football game? Who wouldn't want to see that game?! I would buy tickets tomorrow for that matchup. It is far more exciting to see NM State, UMASS and UAB in Williams Stadium than it is Presby, GW and Monmouth. That's not downing Presby, GW or Mon - it's just the fact of playing a higher caliber and more recognizable opponent. I'm not saying it's the best scenario, but the "playing for an FCS national championship" mindset has sailed. Liberty proved it wasn't going to win it by evidence of the last 2 seasons. Woodrums Sr. year was "our year" for the FCS title. It's time to move on and have a mindset shift from the top down. IM knows what he is doing. Risky and bad PR hire? Absolutely. Scrutiny and backlash for at least a year? Sure. If he's innocent, then that will not matter and we will be fine. Guilty? Whole other story and discussion.
Last edited by LUnpretty11 on February 17th, 2017, 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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By LUnpretty11
Registration Days Posts
#527045
Guys, put this in perspective. JMU won the NC this year. They are the champs of FCS football and slayed the NDSU dragon that hoarded that trophy for the last half decade. Their fans woke up this morning furious and envious of Liberty football. THAT is why this is such an amazing thing for Liberty football. Our facilities are or will be on par or better than any other FBS school in the state (maybe not size, but we all know size isn't everything - you're welcome PH). JMU is rolling in envy at our move to FBS. They are the National Champions, and they are envious. That's perspective.
By goldendomer
#527046
Congrats on the move up!
I will be cheering you on and hope your transition goes well. I am a Notre Dame fans(Raised around ND fans in my family) who happens to be Southern Baptist . I think you have a chance to plug in like ND does to the Catholic Schools across the country and pull some real good recruits. Very exciting times for you all .

God Bless!
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By LUnpretty11
Registration Days Posts
#527047
Oh and for scheduling. Army has played AT some pretty low level schools in the last 6 years. They aren't a guarantee - obviously - but there is hope there and other schools with name recognition. Army at Williams Stadium might be a pipe-dream, but so was FBS for many on this board about 3-6 months/years ago.
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By R i
Registration Days Posts
#527048
lawrenceq wrote:You guys cool with the ceiling being a conference championship and a bowl game? At least at the FCS level you can compete for a national championship.
We can blaze our own path. BYU, Notre Dame, Boise State, have all provided good examples. The great thing is , LU is not them, and they are not LU. We have a chance to write our own history. Given what LU has done in its short history , academically , politically, and socially, I have no doubt in my mind this University can make major moves athletically in my life time. I want to be alive when we beat Notre Dame in South Bend.

Taking a bit of a PR hit and hiring Ian makes so much more sense now. Jerry has worked tirelessly to make this move happen. I believe this last year has been the biggest in the schools history, and I am genuinely excited to watch it continue to grow.
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By Redbonebandit
Registration Days Posts
#527049
Saw this article and thought this bit was interesting, don't care for the article title though. Sorry about the link I'm not sure how to shorten it.

"The program does not have a “bonafide invitation” from an FBS conference required by NCAA bylaws, but Liberty will use the two-year transition phase to secure one. It’s next home is most likely the Sun Belt or Conference USA."

http://www.cbssports.com/college-footba ... stigation/
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#527050
LUnpretty11 wrote:Again, this encompasses an entire mindset shift from the athletic department and the entire fan base.
I wanted to revisit this statement so people catch it It's amazing how far the Athletic Department and fan base has come since the Sam days. I remember when people actually PAYING for tickets was seen as some sort of an anathema. And the game day experience is much better than it ever was (excluding concessions). And this step is going to require an equally bigly change in mindset.
For starters Alabama USC ND FSU OSU etc are not coming to Lynchburg on a regular basis if at all. Judging by this thread that is going to be the first change in mindset.
I believe the threshold is 6 FBS wins for a Bowl Game. How many wins does LU have in its history against FBS schools? How many 6 wins seasons does LU have? With an Independent schedule LU will be the Presby' on teams schedules LU will have to look long and hard to find those 6 wins to be eligible
LU won't be playing around New Years. The first LU Bowl game will generate crazy excitement as it should. But understanding it will probably be in Shreveport on a Tuesday before Christmas.
LU will have more scholarships available. But so will every school they play so they will not have an advantage they will be at parity. Just like they are now.
LU has really nice facilities. That will be its best selling point for the next couple of years
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#527051
App St hasn't scheduled LU for several reasons. Moving to FBS hasn't changed those reasons. I hope they do get over their issues though. It would be great for both schools
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By A Sea of Red
Posts Custom
#527052
goldendomer wrote:Congrats on the move up!
I will be cheering you on and hope your transition goes well. I am a Notre Dame fans(Raised around ND fans in my family) who happens to be Southern Baptist . I think you have a chance to plug in like ND does to the Catholic Schools across the country and pull some real good recruits. Very exciting times for you all .

God Bless!
Welcome to the board! :welcome
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By A Sea of Red
Posts Custom
#527053
Redbonebandit wrote:Saw this article and thought this bit was interesting, don't care for the article title though. Sorry about the link I'm not sure how to shorten it.

"The program does not have a “bonafide invitation” from an FBS conference required by NCAA bylaws, but Liberty will use the two-year transition phase to secure one. It’s next home is most likely the Sun Belt or Conference USA."

http://www.cbssports.com/college-footba ... stigation/
Welcome to the board! :welcome
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By R i
Registration Days Posts
#527054
I for one am looking forward to embracing the underdog role for a while. I was tired of being a Big Fish in a little pond and not having great success. The underdog role is much more endearing.
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By Redbonebandit
Registration Days Posts
#527055
A Sea of Red wrote:
Redbonebandit wrote:Saw this article and thought this bit was interesting, don't care for the article title though. Sorry about the link I'm not sure how to shorten it.

"The program does not have a “bonafide invitation” from an FBS conference required by NCAA bylaws, but Liberty will use the two-year transition phase to secure one. It’s next home is most likely the Sun Belt or Conference USA."

http://www.cbssports.com/college-footba ... stigation/
Welcome to the board! :welcome
Thanks been a long time reader, thought it was time to contribute.
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