[bluejacket]

Look who crawled out from his bridge with the loss...

Yeah, because I've been saying this for almost 18 months......

[bluejacket]

This is crazy gill is not the reason we are losing games, it's the execution by your 4 yr starter 3 yr captain, when it's not the 6 and 13 show the team is good but when u put urself before team this is what you get. Parker was open countless times but 6 has to throw to 13. Ther were multiple ppl open but again 6 throws to 13. This is all 6. Look what happen in 2nd half the original effort to get Parker the ball, but that went out the window quick n back to the 6 n 13 show. I guess when u know scouts are looking it's what u do.
The story has gotten old to JW, maybe the fact he has been here 4 yrs has worn thin, maybe it's time for new blood under center someone with no real dog in the fight and will just hit the open guy

When will you criticize the coaches, more specifically the defense?

[adam42381]

Josh threw more teammates under the bus:

“That’s pretty much the story of the season — we haven’t been able to run at all — and defenses are just sitting back and playing coverage on us,” Woodrum said. “It’s just a lack of execution more so on the blocking.”

This is exactly how losers talk. He's a cancer.

[adam42381]

Dude. I didn't get what I wanted. I wanted Turner Gill to be hired and for us to take the next step as a program. That hasn't happened. We've actually taken a step back, even with the playoff appearance.

You love stats, so take a look at this:

The teams we have beaten this year are a combined 13-32 against Division I opponents. Our "tough schedule" with "big wins" don't look that tough or big when put in context.

The teams we have lost to are a combined 23-24 against Division I opponents. Take CSU and WVU out of there because they were supposed to beat us, and three of our losses are to teams with a combined record of 10-19.

Prior to this year we had lost to CSU twice in the entire history of our program. Under Gill we have lost to CSU twice in as many years.

I want what's best for Liberty University and Liberty Football. Four years ago I thought that was Turner Gill (and was one of the guys pushing for us to hire him) but it's beyond obvious that it's not.

I've questioned if Gill was the guy for the future in the past but I'm firmly in the open that we need to get rid of him as soon as Friday. There's nothing in his history at other schools nor his recent history at Liberty that says we're anything better than lightning in a bottle once every four years.

Now, for my closing arguments, I will refer you to the team that beat us today: Charleston Southern. Jamey Chadwell came in to a program in much worse shape than Liberty with a tenth of the resources and in less time has CSU ranked in the top ten in the country and outright undefeated champions of the Big South (something that hasn't happened since 2007).

Moglia had worse and has done better.
Chadwell had worse and has done better.

At what point do we admit we made a mistake, cut bait, and move on?

I agree with most of this. Gill seems like a very nice man, but his track record does not show that he is a capable D1 head coach. Time to cut bait.

[bluejacket]

What YOU expect n what is reality is two totally different things. At the end of the day, and with all the $$$ in the world we still hv to get players, and remember it takes a certain type kid to come to LU. Other kids on other teams are just as talented as LU, whether you want to down them or not based on their facilities or what not doesn't matter, what our supposed budget is doesn't matter. As you can see $$$ don't buy you everything. It takes kids and coaching and buying into the system. I tell my team this all the time, all the athleticism in the world won't beat a team that executes and plays assignment football. Has to be I >me

This is your argument in a nutshell.

It's not our players. They're just as talented as everyone else.

It's clearly not our facilities or budget. They have everything that they need.

So basically, the problem is coaching and the "system" that they have put in place.

I don't disagree.

[bluejacket]

We will be getting new team leaders, so hopefully the ship can be righted this coming season. I don't care if we go 0-5 OOC, we need to win the Big South.

I don't believe this for one second.

[A Sea of Red]

7 takeways from loss to Charleston Southern

http://www.libertyflamesnation.com/7-ta ... -to-8-csu/

[JK37]

At what point do we admit we made a mistake, cut bait, and move on?

I agree with most of this. Gill seems like a very nice man, but his track record does not show that he is a capable D1 head coach. Time to cut bait.[/quote]

I'm not going to say there's a wealth of evidence that Coach Gill can lead a DI program to dynamic success, but. I disagree its time yet to make a change. Team chemistry is a very fickle thing, and coaches cannot be entirely to blame for it. If t becomes a pattern through 2-3 consecutive classes of players, it becomes a PROGRAM chemistry issue as opposed to just team chemistry. If the players were united against a coach or the staff, then a change may be in order. But there's no indication of this.

Finally, I think we need to protect the reputation of the school and program in the eyes of coaching prospects for if and when a change is deemed necessary. Coach Gill is one season removed from an conference title and the first playoff run in history. What does it say to any better coaching prospect if he is axed just one year later. Nothing good, I believe. You can spit in it as " we've made it clear winning is the constant expectation," but it's not the preeminent goal here (nor should it be).

Of course a deep analysis of the program is in order, involving all of the University powers. And if the reasons for lack of success found this postseason still exist with no improvement a year from now, only then do I believe we can begin to discuss termination.

The results on the field notwithstanding, I still believe Coach Gill is doing a fine job. This offseason will tell us a lot by way of what changes are made. And then he'll get next season to prove those changes right. At the heart of this is still a group of 18-23 year olds. And kids be crazy!!

[Chippy]

Even though there is no joy in Gillville, I'm looking forward to next year. We'll have 8-9 returning starters on D, we'll get back Holder, Passmore and Smith from injuries to man the OL in addition to Duff who redshirted this year, we'll have Denver Daniels and Frankie Hixon also redhirts at RB with Macon, a more mobile QB (Masha, Calvert, et al) and all the receivers except Petey back. We will probably ditch the pro offense which is tailored to Woodrum's abilities and open things up more. The cup is half full

Will the TE who got hurt be back?

Yes - Kendall Couamin. We must have 5 completions all year to a TE. Our TE was open over the middle a number of times yesterday and was never looked at. Couamin will be an additional target next year. I feel positive about next year.

[Rooster Cogburn]

Injuries have us beyond thin at OL, TE is down to #3, New LS, very young secondary, lost a very good RB/ returner, lots of Freshmen and RS Freshmen playing a ton. Not sure how we can even talk about releasing the coach. Tweaks? Sure. Not time to cut and restart. Great talent coming in.

LU fans are so fickle. Chill out. It's going to be ok.

Frustrated? Very. Impatient? No.

Gill will be our coach in 2016.

[Purple Haize]

First of all, it's not a coincidence that the posters here most connected to the old coaching regime are the most critical of the current one.

I also have to wonder if we are heading in the right direction. Successful programs have an identity. What is our football identity?

A couple of folks who are capable of dispassionate analysis both said the same thing to me. This was a team chemistry issue. That's on leadership, and the coaches. We will be getting new team leaders, so hopefully the ship can be righted this coming season. I don't care if we go 0-5 OOC, we need to win the Big South.

I agree 100% about an identity. Maybe / hopefully that will change with someone else under center. Ask yourself to describe LU football in 2 sentences or less. Kinda tough
As for chemistry, that's not something you can really coach. I believe that lack of team chemistry was a huge factor in this seasons disappointment

[SuperJon]

The OL was a weakness even before the injuries. How is a full strength bad line going to be an improvement?

Next year is a rebuild. Good thing Coastal is out of the league and Chadwell won't be at CSU. We may be about to sneak into a conference championship.

[SuperJon]

We all agree Josh is a giant problem. How does Gill get no heat for not creating a competition or allowing Josh to become a cancer?

The locker room issues went back to last year and Gill let it get worse. He's responsible for it.

[Purple Haize]

We all agree Josh is a giant problem. How does Gill get no heat for not creating a competition or allowing Josh to become a cancer?

The locker room issues went back to last year and Gill let it get worse. He's responsible for it.

Do you know for a fact he didn't address the issue?

[SuperJon]

Josh is still the starter and a captain so there obviously weren't any consequences.

[Rooster Cogburn]

No, we don't all agree... Consequences for what? Do you know any of this for a fact? Just your observations IMHO.

Josh takes a lot of heat here. Issues at times, yes, but he's won a lot of games here in his career. Like it or not, he holds a lot of records and will be in the HOF. Glad he came.

[SuperJon]

The fact some players were glad Masha was the QB going into Coastal last year shows you how big the divide is in the locker room. They'd rather have an unproven guy with the season on the line than Mr. Woodrum.

[Rooster Cogburn]

Fact? I missed that.

[SuperJon]

Right. Because I would make up something like that.

[olldflame]

We all agree Josh is a giant problem. How does Gill get no heat for not creating a competition or allowing Josh to become a cancer?

The locker room issues went back to last year and Gill let it get worse. He's responsible for it.

I´m sure in his mind sticking with Josh has been a question of loyalty, but is it a coaches role to be loyal to a specific player just because he has been around a long time? Personally I don´t think so, so I agree Gill is largely responsible. Did we have a lot of options at QB? Obviously not, but I really don´t understand why what Masha did against CSU and Coastal last year appears to have been totally discounted. He was the guy who was at the helm for the win that got us into the playoffs. He didn´t take a single snap yesterday, and hasn´t taken more than one or 2 in a game all year. If I´m Stephen right now and I don´t play against Coastal, I´m out of here, because it would be as much as Gill saying the starting job is Calvert or Yearick´s next year. Then we are back to square one with only 2 QBs on the roster, but this time they are both true Freshmen.

[Rooster Cogburn]

Wow. Seriously? I happen to be an independent thinker who chooses not to run lockstep with some naysayers. There are issues for sure. None that can't be fixed with some tweaks. No reason to start for scratch at this point.

[SuperJon]

It won't be from scratch. We still have amazing facilities and FCOA. It's not that hard to recruit football players who can mostly be anonymous. Our rules are almost non existent now.

[BJWilliams]

Im part of the above crowd I will admit, but Id be perfectly fine with someone being able to go on record rather than hiding behind the "anonymous source" nonsense. If youre going to make a potentially incendiary statement, you ought to be able to own it whether its right or wrong.

[forbidden]

What YOU expect n what is reality is two totally different things. At the end of the day, and with all the $$$ in the world we still hv to get players, and remember it takes a certain type kid to come to LU. Other kids on other teams are just as talented as LU, whether you want to down them or not based on their facilities or what not doesn't matter, what our supposed budget is doesn't matter. As you can see $$$ don't buy you everything. It takes kids and coaching and buying into the system. I tell my team this all the time, all the athleticism in the world won't beat a team that executes and plays assignment football. Has to be I >me

This is your argument in a nutshell.

It's not our players. They're just as talented as everyone else.

It's clearly not our facilities or budget. They have everything that they need.

So basically, the problem is coaching and the "system" that they have put in place.

I don't disagree.

hold up in one post you said when do I blame the coaches, read what I had stated all throughout the game thread I blamed players and coaches on certain things. PERIOD. Some things are COACHING and some things are on PLAYERS. The players will only do what they are ALLOWED to get away with the coaches, but trust me I do know just like someone else said this is more about TEAM CHEMISTRY, nothing more nothing less.

[jinxy]

Gill is getting a little heat on the Facebook post. Must be insane that people other than usports question him. Gill allowed woodrum to get to this point. He hasn't been able to recruit a qb in 4 years. He had a ton of attrition this year right after the best stretch in school history. Isn't that a cause for concern. The o line won't be any better next year without burgess and Sommer. The secondary is awful, Wimberley is clueless against the option. Stamn is either red hot or stone cold every other game. The special teams have been an abject disaster for 4 years and they are currently worse than year 1. His daughter has turned into a loose cannon. I mean howe anyone can say oh yes this is the guy is beyond me. I'm getting close to the dale layer comparison. Great man but his record is what it is. Doing less with more. Liberty football since 2009.