[Psalm34:1believer]

I'm completely pro-life, but I understand it takes more than just a president to overturn something like Roe vs Wade. I agree completely with the McCain statement about Roe vs Wade. Abortion is terrible, but I'm not going to let that one single issue determine a presidency for me. Obama's stance on the issue is completely wrong but I wouldn't let that keep me from voting for him if he was solid on all of the other issues. The thing is, I don't think he is. Neither is McCain though.

agreed... I was a Bush supporter. While I firmly believe that his last term was one of the worst things to happen to America, I respect him because he was always firm on the issues that he believed in. We can't really see this characteristic in either candidate, but I feel that Barack Obama will be the stronger, more determined of the two.

[Psalm34:1believer]

i agree it sounds like psalms is doing a lesser of too evils vote and has also unfortunately bought into the whole change/hope crap.
...

i have many barack supporters that i'm friends with....most are gullible and would buy a ketchup and onion popsicle if the ad was good enough.

being that i live in illinois, i'm not so concerned with barack's policies and i can live with them. my taxes will go up, more gay people will get married, and there will still be abortion. its sucks, but its going on right now and while this might sound terrible, my life is pretty good. as long as the republicans take back congress...(you know that congress that is controlled by the democrats and has the lowest approval rating EVER) which i believe they will, i'm not too hysterical. The problem is he is either shady or he's too naive to be our president. look at the people he's associated himself with in illinois. some of the biggest crooks in our state. many of whom are in jail. either he knows about it, or he's a pushover....my guess is the latter and thats not what i want as my president...

First off, The whole ketchup and onion popsicle thing made me literally giggle out loud. I'm not gonna' lie, that is so true of many young Obama supporters. They bought into the hype that surrounds all that is "Obama". it is ridiculous.

Secondly, While I'm excited for "change", I'm not cliche about it. I'm not voting for Obama becuase he stands for "change", that sir, would make me an idiot. I believe either candidate would bring change (from the policies of the Bush Administration). Barack is way better at hacking into what the American people want, something all politicians do. It's merely an advertisement that gets a lot of attention, and causes many of America's youth to flock to him. I believe that they are ridiculous, and should do more research. I assure you, that is not why I am voting for Obama. I am not naive, and I do not treat my ballot as something frivalous.

I would have no problem with a republican congress. Our current congress is lacking something. I am not a republican, I am not a democrat. I vote with a lot of prayer, thinking, and research. You hit the nail right on the head when you said that "all of these will continue to go on". It's true. Change is gradual. No matter who is elected, lets make sure that we still stand up for what we believe in.

As far as Barack being a pushover? ...It may be partially true, but if he was such a pushover, he would've picked Clinton as his vice by now. If he did, pennsylvania, west virginia, michigan, and, most likely, florida would already be "in the bag"

[Psalm34:1believer]

I could understand that if the candidate were not clearly pro-choice. For me, being pro-life isn't a selling point for me but being pro-choice is to guarantee that I will not support you. As a father, I could never, ever, under any circumstances, vote for a person who condones killing children.

RagingTireFire, can I respectfully ask you a question? While I condone you for standing firmly for what you believe, how do you feel about John McCain's wishy-washy stance on abortion?

[RubberMallet]

I could understand that if the candidate were not clearly pro-choice. For me, being pro-life isn't a selling point for me but being pro-choice is to guarantee that I will not support you. As a father, I could never, ever, under any circumstances, vote for a person who condones killing children.

RagingTireFire, can I respectfully ask you a question? While I condone you for standing firmly for what you believe, how do you feel about John McCain's wishy-washy stance on abortion?

while not directed at me, i feel the same about that as i do about obama's blatant flip flop on FISA...

[RagingTireFire]

I could understand that if the candidate were not clearly pro-choice. For me, being pro-life isn't a selling point for me but being pro-choice is to guarantee that I will not support you. As a father, I could never, ever, under any circumstances, vote for a person who condones killing children.

RagingTireFire, can I respectfully ask you a question? While I condone you for standing firmly for what you believe, how do you feel about John McCain's wishy-washy stance on abortion?

Honestly, I'm not a fan of either candidate's wishy-washy stance on a number of topics, not the least of which being the abortion issue. That's one reason that I don't plan on voting for either of them.

[RubberMallet]

i agree it sounds like psalms is doing a lesser of too evils vote and has also unfortunately bought into the whole change/hope crap.
...

i have many barack supporters that i'm friends with....most are gullible and would buy a ketchup and onion popsicle if the ad was good enough.

being that i live in illinois, i'm not so concerned with barack's policies and i can live with them. my taxes will go up, more gay people will get married, and there will still be abortion. its sucks, but its going on right now and while this might sound terrible, my life is pretty good. as long as the republicans take back congress...(you know that congress that is controlled by the democrats and has the lowest approval rating EVER) which i believe they will, i'm not too hysterical. The problem is he is either shady or he's too naive to be our president. look at the people he's associated himself with in illinois. some of the biggest crooks in our state. many of whom are in jail. either he knows about it, or he's a pushover....my guess is the latter and thats not what i want as my president...

First off, The whole ketchup and onion popsicle thing made me literally giggle out loud. I'm not gonna' lie, that is so true of many young Obama supporters. They bought into the hype that surrounds all that is "Obama". it is ridiculous.

Secondly, While I'm excited for "change", I'm not cliche about it. I'm not voting for Obama becuase he stands for "change", that sir, would make me an idiot. I believe either candidate would bring change (from the policies of the Bush Administration). Barack is way better at hacking into what the American people want, something all politicians do. It's merely an advertisement that gets a lot of attention, and causes many of America's youth to flock to him. I believe that they are ridiculous, and should do more research. I assure you, that is not why I am voting for Obama. I am not naive, and I do not treat my ballot as something frivalous.

I would have no problem with a republican congress. Our current congress is lacking something. I am not a republican, I am not a democrat. I vote with a lot of prayer, thinking, and research. You hit the nail right on the head when you said that "all of these will continue to go on". It's true. Change is gradual. No matter who is elected, lets make sure that we still stand up for what we believe in.

As far as Barack being a pushover? ...It may be partially true, but if he was such a pushover, he would've picked Clinton as his vice by now. If he did, pennsylvania, west virginia, michigan, and, most likely, florida would already be "in the bag"

he's a pushover but he's not stupid. you don't pick the person you campaigned against for all this time as your vice president....it makes you seem like a dumb politician. most people watching that rally where hillary came out and supported him thought it was hilarious BS....because thats all it was....they dispise each other an anyone who thinks different is fooling themselves....

btw, look at the state of illinois....its laughable all the things he hopes and says he will do yet the state he represents is in a corrupt turmoil, with more industry moving out of the state than ever before....i understand theres not a whole lot you can do as a state senator but comeon... and look at all his comrads that are going to jail.

and while i don't judge a person by his associates normally, i will judge a person based off the mentors/friends he chosen....and that too shows a excess/lack of wisdom....and his ex-reverend (was a mentor to him for 20+ years) is a racist nutball (don't even question this, if you studied anything about the Black Liberation movement, you will agree)....

[Innocent Bystander]

How do I justify voting for Obama while be pro-life? Wow- it's a tough question, I'm not gonna lie. As a Christian, I believe that life should be given freely to everybody, even to the unborn. However, there comes a time where we have to decide, "is this one issue keeping me from voting for a candidate that could help boost so many other avenues?" It was tough. I have marched in Anti-Abortion rallies, and participated in Walks for Life for as long as I can remember. This election season will not change that. I will proudly vote for Barack Obama, and then proudly continue to rally for the Pro-Life Movement.

I'll be honest. I didn't read past this paragraph because I was somewhat stunned. "is this one issue keeping me from voting for a candidate that could help boost so many other avenues?". I don't see how you can be pro-life and support life for the unborn and ask that question. How many people is it okay to kill to get better health care, lower taxes, a stronger military, help to the poor and a stonger economy? I don't mean to attack and be sensational here, but your statement treats the life of a human being as a bargaining chip. Help me to understand this and I will go back and read the rest of your post. If you already answered this further on, please ignore my message.

First off, I apologize if my statements offend you. I do not mean to place a human life as a bargaining chip. Again, this is a tough issue for me. I believe Senator Mccain merely uses his alleged "pro life" stance just to attract voters. He's always been wishy-washy on the issue, and I have no doubt he will continue to be. Even if he was telling the complete truth, and he acted fully upon his word, turning over roe vs. wade and closing down all abortion clinics across the nation within three months of his election--that would be catastrophic. Women would scramble for back alley hanger abortions, or other destructive methods. Abortion, like anything else, is not going to disappear over night. It's a steady process. If we can first limit the number, by mandating that, within a set time frame, only those at health risk, or those who were raped, or were a case of incest could have the option for abortion. I do believe that if the mother is at risk, abortion is the choice between the parents of such said child. ---This isn't going to go away anytime soon, no matter who we elect. I also feel that by improving the economy and better sex education programs in our schools, we can help curtail the number of abortions drastically as well.

I'm glad that Senator Obama is honest in his position of abortion. I respectfully disagree with him. My vote will still be cast, and I will still be pro-life.

Psalm 34:1,
First, you did not offend me. The issue of trading a candidates stance on abortion for a more favorable stance on other issues has been discussed here more than once since the primaries began. I am with RTF on this issue. A pro-choice stance guarantees that a candidate will not get my vote. I think even people that are pro-life have become somewhat desensitized to the issue somewhat when we begin to discuss our willingness to make concessions on whether or not it is okay to kill another human being on the same level that we discuss national security, taxation, education and health care. Don't worry, my best friend and I have the same 'argument' with each other, so I am not going to judge you for your opinion. I view this country's tolerance of abortion on a level with the Holocaust. That is not, in any way, meant to diminish the horror of the Holocaust, but to illustrate the seriousness that I view this issue.

Second, I want to echo Sly and commend you for staying and entering into reasoned discussion and calm debate. Something sorely lacking in the current political climate in this country.

[Baldspot]

I'm over 40, born and raised in Central PA and have close relatives living in the Scranton area where Hilary is from. The farm I grew up on has been in my family for approximalely 150 years. I know the area well. Barack Obama does not know the area well. His comments to a group of liberal donors in Califormia during the PA primaries preceeded a landslide loss in PA. We can't wait for the general election for a second chance. PA will be very important to Obama.

To make such a stupid and inappropriate statement in the midst of an important primary leads me to believe his background as a community organizer has not prepared him well for the White House. Just how many times will Obama have to apologize for inappropriate statements about religious people or his associations with terrorists and bigotted pastors for the young and impressionable to realize his rock star status has no depth.

Obama's status as the most liberal senator was a softball that anyone who knows the issues would realize his rating. Perhaps Psalmist do a little more research on his candidate before denigrating the people from my state.

http://nj.nationaljournal.com/voteratings/

[thepostman]

wow...haven't been back to this thread in a while and am glad to see someone from the Obama camp actually answering questions...

I don't see it your way...but at least you are answering questions...I respect that...

I just find it hard to vote for someone who has not taken a stance on much of anything, and the things he does take stances on I completely disagree with him...he preaches change yet does the same old tricks....hypocrisy does not bode well with me and I believe Obama is a big one..

Now McCain...I like his toughness..that is something I have always liked about him....but he, like all politicians, change what he says to cater to who he is talking to....

this is going to be a tough election...I know I'm not voting for Obama...but I don't know if I can vote for McCain either...

[Baldspot]

Ok, Baldspot. We may disagree on this. I have lived in Pennsylvania for a few years now. Have you ever been to Northern Pennsylvania; such as Scranton or other areas. Racism abounds, almost to a crazy standard. Central Pennslyvania is made up primarily of Old-school baptists, most over the age of 40. I believe Barack's statement was not appropriate, although, not entirely false.

Is this the best Obama's supprters can do - offend over 40 year old, white Baptists from states that are very important to their candidate's election? Is this all we've leaned about race relations since the civil rights legislations from the 60's.

[4everfsu]

Let the Obama camp continue to offend white folks from PA, they can kiss the state good bye.

[SumItUp]

Let's keep the facts straight. John McCain scores 0% by NARAL on his pro-choice voting record.

Highlights of his voting history as reported by NARAL:

* Voted anti-choice 125 out of 130 times in his congressional career.
* Consistently voted to restrict access to abortion care.
* Voted against measures to prevent unintended pregnancy.
* Voted for the global gag rule, which prohibits federally funded family-planning clinics from giving women full information about their reproductive-health options.
* Voted for and co-sponsored the Federal Abortion Ban.
* Voted in favor of anti-choice Supreme Court Justices like Samuel Alito and Clarence Thomas and Chief Justices like John Roberts.

While I may perceive my stance against abortion to be stronger than his, McCain has stated that Roe vs. Wade was a flawed decision and needs to be overturned. The importance of the presidential selections for Supreme Court justices and Federal judges should be one of the strongest factors in the Presidential decision process for a Christian.

[RubberMallet]

* Voted anti-choice 125 out of 130 times in his congressional career.

he's only 96% against abortion....how wishy washy

[4everfsu]

And if someone thinks better sex education in schools is going to help curtail abortions. Well this is wishful thinking, I got a bridge to sell you

[Baldspot]

Obama thinks more than PA resident's are racists. While giving an interview on an all-sports radio station in Philly, he further explained his white grandmother's racist tendencies by stating she is just a "typical white person".

...his white grandmother "who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe."

Typical White Person

Perhaps just another regretable statement.

http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_up ... _some.html

[Kolzilla41]

I don't know why were are still talking about this guy. Anyone who claims to be a Christian and votes for Obama is slapping the face of the big guy

[AZjonz]

This should be a great time to be a Democrat running for President due to the Bush fatigue factor. Yet, Obama only has a 6 point lead according to yesterday’s (or two days ago) Gallup poll.

I find that interesting. You would think with the media coverage of him that this thing is not even close especially after the European rock star tour.

[Hold My Own]

I got my NRA pocket sized cards with the top 10 reasons not to vote for Obama....they gave me 4, 1 to keep and 3 to hand out





They dont like him very much to say the least

[RubberMallet]

for me the less gvt the better, just a fundamental belief i have....all i see from obama is more regulation, more gvt...

[AZjonz]

This should be a great time to be a Democrat running for President due to the Bush fatigue factor. Yet, Obama only has a 6 point lead according to yesterday’s (or two days ago) Gallup poll.

I find that interesting. You would think with the media coverage of him that this thing is not even close especially after the European rock star tour.

Gallup show only a 1 point lead today, and yes, I quoted myself.

[SuperJon]

Anyone who claims to be a Christian and votes for Obama is slapping the face of the big guy

I'm sorry, but this is one of the dumbest statements I have ever read. I hate when people say stupid crap like that. Not all Christians are right-wing conservatives.

[TylerBakersGonnaBGreat]

Very True... Just the saved ones

[JDUB]

I don't know why were are still talking about this guy. Anyone who claims to be a Christian and votes for Obama is slapping the face of the big guy

probably not as much as calling the God that created the Universe "the big guy". i think He is more than just a "big guy"

[Hold My Own]

Sure not ALL Christians are right winged....but should they be? Of course



It's no different then you're daily walk...everyone has certain areas in their life that they are weaker while someone else is stronger in their walk.



I hate this more then anything but WWJD....bottom line is it's no secret who Jesus would vote for...would JM make him completely happy? No way, but he is the best logical choice he has

[RagingTireFire]

Anyone who claims to be a Christian and votes for Obama is slapping the face of the big guy

bottom line is it's no secret who Jesus would vote for...

You two have got to be kidding. This is turning out worse than the name-calling thread. That one, at least, was funny.