[jcmanson]

To me, everything short of direct physical contact is fair game.

So you're cool with students representing LU talking vulgar about someone's sister? ok.

It doesn't bother me. Maybe it should, but it doesn't.

Well in that case, SJ let VMI have it on Saturday! No holding back. F- them.

[El Scorcho]

Here's the lady that said SJ didn't know Jesus because he said "shut up"...

[LUconn]

that picture turned out much better than mine.

[LUconn]

To me, everything short of direct physical contact is fair game.

So you're cool with students representing LU talking vulgar about someone's sister? ok.

It doesn't bother me. Maybe it should, but it doesn't.

Feel free to question my salvation.

I obviously won't question your salvation. But I will question your logic. Our representation of our school and really of young christians doesn't just get suspended because it's a sporting event. Some people will always take clean razzing the wrong way because they are just prudes. But I don't see how swearing and sexual connotations could ever be acceptable.

[olldflame]

So RTF, I guess that means racially offensive remarks are OK too?

I totally agree with you that a good college sports environment should be one that annoys/disrupts the opponent, but that does not mean the rules of society or the standards by which we present ourselves as christians are suspended just because there is a ball game going on and we are fans.

[ToTheLeft]

I love all of the slippery slopes we use to argue...

[olldflame]

that picture turned out much better than mine.

Taking a good action shot in athletics is one of the most difficult challenges in photography; especially in poor lighting conditions like we have in the Vines. First and foremost you have to have good equipment, and that means $$$$. Sports photographers have to invest more in lenses than any other genre. Then it's a matter of knowlege, a good eye, timing, experience, and quite frankly, luck. The other thing is that if you are constantly looking for a shot, it's hard to really watch the game as a whole, and that's tough if you're there as a fan.

[TDDance234]

Alex McLean dunked on that guy--not Christian. If he was a true Christian, he would have bricked the shot, got his rebound and shared the ball with the Barton player.

[ToTheLeft]

Alex McLean dunked on that guy--not Christian. If he was a true Christian, he would have bricked the shot, got his rebound and shared the ball with the Barton player.

That's what Kevin Keys was saying that he was afraid of, going down this slippery slope.

We need to draw a line, and stick with it.

[DutchyNY]

carson and godwin are just trying to preserve something that went out the door years ago...you cannot have a school the size of LU and still think you can control the students the way they did back in the day....i am looking forward to the day the people of lynchburg get behind LU athletics whole-heartedly, what do we do then verify their christian status before they enter our games? carson and godwin only said something because they see the students of Liberty as children and not as the tuition paying young adults who can think on their own and still make morally sound decisions

[El Scorcho]

Taking a good action shot in athletics is one of the most difficult challenges in photography...

I plan to find out for myself pretty soon. After football is over I'll be shooting basketball this year, just to try my hand at it.

[LUconn]

do you have something more than the kit lense? I was right in the front row and no matter what setting I used it was just coming out blurry. I could tell it was a combination of the distance I was from the court (even though I was right on top of it, but I just have a 55mm) and the lighting in the Vines. That's why the photographers have that giant flash that goes off on the Vines roof when ever they take a picture.

[RagingTireFire]

So RTF, I guess that means racially offensive remarks are OK too?

I totally agree with you that a good college sports environment should be one that annoys/disrupts the opponent, but that does not mean the rules of society or the standards by which we present ourselves as christians are suspended just because there is a ball game going on and we are fans.

I think you are confusing what behavior I am OK with as a person as opposed to what behavior should be banned at our events. There's a lot of things that go on in college stadiums across the country that I would not be want to see Liberty students doing but I don't think they should be getting tossed out of stadiums for it either.
As SJ says, where's the line? The "rules of society" argument doesn't work. Rules of society dictate that I don't walk into someone's workplace and yell and scream, hoping they miss a few keystrokes while typing a memo and, yet, that's exactly what we do at a sporting event. As for "the Christian standards" thing, I think the whole point of this thread was trying to figure out what those "Christian standards" are at a sporting event. Thus far, nobody has an adequate answer.

In terms of racially offensive material, I think that I might have a different perspective than a lot of others on this board. Suffice to say, I've heard just about everything that's out there and most of it doesn't bother me anymore.

[El Scorcho]

do you have something more than the kit lense?

I have a 50mm f/1.8 lens in addition to my kit lens. At 1.8 I can get all kinds of light in so that's not a problem, but since it's a prime lens, I'd be limited to shooting under one basket, pretty much. However, I'll be shooting with LU photography and borrowing the secondary glass they're not shooting with. Les asked if I wanted to last night and I'd love to get some experience, so why not?

[Purple Haize]

A little birdie told me that LU has some of the worst fans in terms of sportsmanship in the Big South. Ironically, it wasn't the students who were causing the problem!! When Ron Godwin and D Carr. start to police THEIR side of the stands then I will give some credibility to them wanting to reign in the student sections. I have stated before and will again, I think we have a great opportunity to be creative in our taunts. Do I think "Hey Ref You Suck" is wrong? Nope. Inane? Absolutely. As one who is often abused I really tune out 90% of it. I DO remember the creative ones and usually enjoy those. For instance, the MySPace/Facebook stuff is GOLD!!! Making fun of a caoches clothing, VERY funny. Having some ritualistic chant when an opposing coach starts whinning, would be good. One student section I have been at actually starts "mock crying" when the coach does that!!
The fact is that there are old schooler's who still think the world revolves around them. So you are just going to have to deal with it till they move on.

And of course PROPS to my boy Mickey!! If I hear of ANYONE giving him crap, I CAN find out where you live and have a little suprise for you!!!

[Hold My Own]

.....I CAN find out where you live and have a little suprise for you.....

Any takers? Is that a sample pack or are you happy to see me

[SuperJon]

I try to get creative. We chanted a guy's exgirlfriend's name while he was shooting a free throw and he clanked both of them. I think there's a time for the creative stuff and there's a time for simply "Shut up and sit down."

[Rocketfan]

.....I CAN find out where you live and have a little suprise for you.....

Any takers? Is that a sample pack or are you happy to see me8)

Would you want a drug dealing, loud-mouth showing up at your house?

[Ed Dantes]

Let me first say that I have complete faith in Jeff, Mickey, Kevin, and whoever else is involved in this that the right thing will be done, but I want your opinion on this.

We have talked about people getting on our cases for yelling things in the stands before, and I wanted to have one thread about it because it all came to a head tonight at the Barton game. I'm going to explain what happened and try to be as objective as I can. This will probably be a little long, but please read it and give your opinion. Keep things civil. I want a discussion, not a fight.

About a minute and a half into the game tonight, I was threatened to get kicked out by an LUPD officer. Barton's coach was on the floor yelling at the ref and I yelled at him and said, "Sit down and shutup." As I was turned talking to someone else, an LUPD officer came and grabbed my arm and spun me around. Apparently he had tried getting my attention but I didn't hear him, so he grabbed me. He told me if I said shutup again I was going to be removed from the game.

After this situation, I went and found Jeff Barber. I apologized for bothering him while he was with his family, told him what happened, and he said it was the first time he'd heard about it. I asked him if saying shutup was ok and he told me it was. I told him I wasn't cussing and wouldn't do that, he understood, and I went back to my seat. A little while later Mickey walked up to me and asked what happened, I explained, and was told as long as it wasn't cussing or sexual in nature that it was fine. I said ok, and went back about my way.

Later in the second half, I yelled at the coach to shutup again. The LUPD officer just looked ticked off but he didn't say anything. Just because I'm an antagonizing jerk sometimes (I admit it), when one of their players was leaving the court we yelled, "Sit down! Shut up!" when he went to the bench. This brought another LUPD officer to us. He was telling me I couldn't say that. I was pointing out that I was told I could by two people, and was talking with my hands, and since I was higher up than he was, he felt as though I was putting them in his face (understandable looking back on it). He told me to stop being disrespectful to him and I told them to stop being a prick to me and grabbing me, etc (I later apologized to him and the other officer but we'll get to that in a minute). He relayed that to Kevin Keys and Kevin said something to me about it, and I apologized to Kevin and admitted I lost my cool for a second.

After the game, the original officer came up to me and we started talking. Nothing rude, just a conversation. He was explaining why he told me I couldn't say shutup. Apparently Ron Godwin and Dwayne Carson said we shouldn't say it. He was an older man, and I told him I believed it was a generation thing because shutup is not offensive to us and may be to his generation. We talked about that for a few second. After that, I told him that Jeff and Mickey told me I could say it, and until they say otherwise, I will. I also said that last year they asked us not to say the word "suck" and we have obeyed that request for the most part (it slips at times). During this conversation, a woman from Barton came up and questioned if I was a Christian or not because I was saying shutup during the game. She questioned what the faith meant on my shirt.

During this whole conversation, Kevin Keys was within ear distance and was listening. He later chimed in and said something along the lines of if we did what every school thought we should do as Christians, we'd be sitting on our hands the entire time. Presby fans complained and said we were rude because our students stood the whole time and waved pom poms. Coastal fans complained because we stood and used thunder sticks and were loud. Some of our fans thought that "Beat Coastal" was degrading to Coastal and we shouldn't do things that could be degrading to the other team.

As the conversation went on, I apologized to the older LUPD officer for what I said (the prick statement), I explained that I lost my cool and apologized for that, and was sincere about the whole thing. I shook his hand, we both said that we wouldn't hold a grudge, etc. As I saw the younger one leaving, I got his attention, apologized to him personally, shook his hand, and we all ended by telling each other to have a good night.

The whole thing boiled down to the fact that the Athletic Department and I guess it's Spiritual Life/Student Affairs will have to have a talk about what can and cannot be said at game. What we think doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things, but I want to know where we draw the line. What is too much? Where is the line? "You suck" is obviously over it. Is yelling at a coach to shutup over the line or is it ok? What is acceptable and what isn't?

Once again, I ask to please keep this civil and a discussion, not a fight. I want to be serious about this one.

Dude, seriously. Shut up.

[Hold My Own]

wow, I just laughed really hard

[El Scorcho]

Let me first say that I have complete faith in Jeff, Mickey, Kevin, and whoever else is involved in this that the right thing will be done, but I want your opinion on this.

We have talked about people getting on our cases for yelling things in the stands before, and I wanted to have one thread about it because it all came to a head tonight at the Barton game. I'm going to explain what happened and try to be as objective as I can. This will probably be a little long, but please read it and give your opinion. Keep things civil. I want a discussion, not a fight.

About a minute and a half into the game tonight, I was threatened to get kicked out by an LUPD officer. Barton's coach was on the floor yelling at the ref and I yelled at him and said, "Sit down and shutup." As I was turned talking to someone else, an LUPD officer came and grabbed my arm and spun me around. Apparently he had tried getting my attention but I didn't hear him, so he grabbed me. He told me if I said shutup again I was going to be removed from the game.

After this situation, I went and found Jeff Barber. I apologized for bothering him while he was with his family, told him what happened, and he said it was the first time he'd heard about it. I asked him if saying shutup was ok and he told me it was. I told him I wasn't cussing and wouldn't do that, he understood, and I went back to my seat. A little while later Mickey walked up to me and asked what happened, I explained, and was told as long as it wasn't cussing or sexual in nature that it was fine. I said ok, and went back about my way.

Later in the second half, I yelled at the coach to shutup again. The LUPD officer just looked ticked off but he didn't say anything. Just because I'm an antagonizing jerk sometimes (I admit it), when one of their players was leaving the court we yelled, "Sit down! Shut up!" when he went to the bench. This brought another LUPD officer to us. He was telling me I couldn't say that. I was pointing out that I was told I could by two people, and was talking with my hands, and since I was higher up than he was, he felt as though I was putting them in his face (understandable looking back on it). He told me to stop being disrespectful to him and I told them to stop being a prick to me and grabbing me, etc (I later apologized to him and the other officer but we'll get to that in a minute). He relayed that to Kevin Keys and Kevin said something to me about it, and I apologized to Kevin and admitted I lost my cool for a second.

After the game, the original officer came up to me and we started talking. Nothing rude, just a conversation. He was explaining why he told me I couldn't say shutup. Apparently Ron Godwin and Dwayne Carson said we shouldn't say it. He was an older man, and I told him I believed it was a generation thing because shutup is not offensive to us and may be to his generation. We talked about that for a few second. After that, I told him that Jeff and Mickey told me I could say it, and until they say otherwise, I will. I also said that last year they asked us not to say the word "suck" and we have obeyed that request for the most part (it slips at times). During this conversation, a woman from Barton came up and questioned if I was a Christian or not because I was saying shutup during the game. She questioned what the faith meant on my shirt.

During this whole conversation, Kevin Keys was within ear distance and was listening. He later chimed in and said something along the lines of if we did what every school thought we should do as Christians, we'd be sitting on our hands the entire time. Presby fans complained and said we were rude because our students stood the whole time and waved pom poms. Coastal fans complained because we stood and used thunder sticks and were loud. Some of our fans thought that "Beat Coastal" was degrading to Coastal and we shouldn't do things that could be degrading to the other team.

As the conversation went on, I apologized to the older LUPD officer for what I said (the prick statement), I explained that I lost my cool and apologized for that, and was sincere about the whole thing. I shook his hand, we both said that we wouldn't hold a grudge, etc. As I saw the younger one leaving, I got his attention, apologized to him personally, shook his hand, and we all ended by telling each other to have a good night.

The whole thing boiled down to the fact that the Athletic Department and I guess it's Spiritual Life/Student Affairs will have to have a talk about what can and cannot be said at game. What we think doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things, but I want to know where we draw the line. What is too much? Where is the line? "You suck" is obviously over it. Is yelling at a coach to shutup over the line or is it ok? What is acceptable and what isn't?

Once again, I ask to please keep this civil and a discussion, not a fight. I want to be serious about this one.

Dude, seriously. Shut up.

You need to work on your social skills. What's your problem?

[thepostman]

yes!! fight! I am in the station til 11...i need some good entertainment

[Hold My Own]

I think he was doing a play on words...SJ's whole post was about how someone thought he shouldnt say shut up...I hope thats all it was...if not then I retract my laughter

[grm]

Any of you guys follow hockey?

Try this one...

"Hey (ref's name)! Are you pregnant? You've missed two periods."

[El Scorcho]

I think he was doing a play on words...SJ's whole post was about how someone thought he shouldnt say shut up...I hope thats all it was...if not then I retract my laughter

Ohhhhh. Well in that case the joke would definitely be on me.