[El Scorcho]

It all comes down to what students have been saying since I got here: we're worrying so much about expansion that we're neglecting what we already have.

I'm sorry, but that's an ignorant viewpoint. The students are seeing it from the only viewpoint that matters to them, which is the "me, me, me" viewpoint. We're a growing school, yes. That's not going to change. But we know exactly how much we're going to grow every year. It's a controlled growth. That means you can plan for that growth, and we're doing that. Just because a problem arises one year and it's not immediately fixed doesn't mean no one is doing anything. Things take time, and in the eyes of a college student who's only going to spend four years here, it always seems like things take too long.

We just built brand new dorms two years in a row, but we've got dorms falling apart that we're not doing anything about. It took two years of horrible traffic on campus to get a transit system. They're doing everything they can to get kids here without thinking as much about the ones who are here. Yes, we've gotten some great things, but even in terms of Student Life, etc, it's all based around how to get kids here.

Yep. It took time to get a transit system. To negotiate the deal with the GLTC and the city. To arrange everything legally. To make sure we had $75k a month to spend on something like that. THINGS TAKE TIME. You can't just snap your fingers and make things happen. I know it drives current students crazy to hear old hags talk about how things used to be, but there's a point to it. Things are better. Things have improved. Things will continue to improve. It just takes time.

Plenty of time, money and effort are spent on current students. It would be nice if current students cared even a tiny bit as much about the school the attend and the people who are breaking their backs in an effort to keep it open. Someday, maybe. Someday.

[SuperJon]

If they were forced to move out of a place they lived in now in a matter of six hours because of something that's been going wrong for years...

Sorry, buddy, but no. It's been a problem for years, and they were aware of it. It was on their radar, but it wasn't something that made the building uninhabitable. However, the engineers believe the recent dry weather (or some other factor y.t.b.d.) caused a sudden shift. So, the timetable has been pushed up.

I can understand being upset over having to move mid-semester. What I cannot understand are all of the conspiracy theories and accusations of negligence just to save a buck. (I'd be very careful throwing around the term negligence, by the way.) This school wants to take care of it's students. It's doing the best it can with what it has. I know 18-22 year olds know how to run EVERYTHING better than anyone else, but give the old folks a chance. They're not here to "getcha" or get rich off of anyone. There's no need for the conspiracy theories.

The biggest complaint is that they were told "Be out by 8pm so we can fix it" and nothing has been fixed yet. Why did they have to miss class, miss work, miss job interviews, etc to move out if no one has entered the building to fix it yet?

[Schfourteenteen]

LU has never been a place that takes care of it's buildings and now it has come back to bite them in the tail.

Scorch: I dont know how "the system" works but there is no way that the way we maintain our buildings cant improve. Just about everybody who's lived on the circle has pointed out an instance where something went haywire on their dorm. In all this LU should be looking for a better way to keep up with the buildings or put more resourses into keeping the buildings from having cracks in them

Not saying someone needs to be fired just LU ought to put more focus on keeping up with the buildings

[El Scorcho]

If they were forced to move out of a place they lived in now in a matter of six hours because of something that's been going wrong for years...

Sorry, buddy, but no. It's been a problem for years, and they were aware of it. It was on their radar, but it wasn't something that made the building uninhabitable. However, the engineers believe the recent dry weather (or some other factor y.t.b.d.) caused a sudden shift. So, the timetable has been pushed up.

I can understand being upset over having to move mid-semester. What I cannot understand are all of the conspiracy theories and accusations of negligence just to save a buck. (I'd be very careful throwing around the term negligence, by the way.) This school wants to take care of it's students. It's doing the best it can with what it has. I know 18-22 year olds know how to run EVERYTHING better than anyone else, but give the old folks a chance. They're not here to "getcha" or get rich off of anyone. There's no need for the conspiracy theories.

The biggest complaint is that they were told "Be out by 8pm so we can fix it" and nothing has been fixed yet. Why did they have to miss class, miss work, miss job interviews, etc to move out if no one has entered the building to fix it yet?

Because the engineers said it might not be safe? I'm sure they'll fix it as soon as they have the necessary materials, equipment, personnel, etc.

[SuperJon]

I'm one of the students who sticks up for the school 90% of the time to my friends and all of that. It just seems like if they knew we were going to add "x" amount of students in 2004, we should've started negotiating for the transit stuff in 2002 if it was going to take four years.

[bigsmooth]

are you kidding me ?? alums getting high and mighty??? for goodness sake the small number of these guys are acting like babies. yes i would be mad, but i would also be glad i am in a safer place, and that actions are being taken to remedy it. yes the school should have done something sooner, and they need to do whatever is necessary to make sure these students are taken care of. i can appreciate the students on this board trying to take up for your own, but use common sense. these students should grow up and present their concerns to the school in a professional manner. and one more comment that these guys are 18-20 and that is how they act?? give me a break...i know men and women that age that act more mature than these men and i think could handle a small inconveinence better than this.

[El Scorcho]

Scorch: I dont know how "the system" works but there is no way that the way we maintain our buildings cant improve. Just about everybody who's lived on the circle has pointed out an instance where something went haywire on their dorm. In all this LU should be looking for a better way to keep up with the buildings or put more resourses into keeping the buildings from having cracks in them

Not saying someone needs to be fired just LU ought to put more focus on keeping up with the buildings

I understand what you're saying. But when you talk about a "system" or "they" or "LU", you're talking about specific people. I don't like the generalizations. If someone isn't doing their job, call them out on it. You'd do it if they were a football coach.

[SuperJon]

Because the engineers said it might not be safe? I'm sure they'll fix it as soon as they have the necessary materials, equipment, personnel, etc.

Too dangerous to live in, yes. But was it too dangerous to walk in and grab a tv or some clothes on Saturday morning instead of Friday night? I know of kids who missed job interviews because of having to move out. Would it have been too dangerous for him to come in on Saturday morning to move out so he could've went to the job interview? If so, there's no way that dorm is fixed in two weeks.

[TDDance234]

If they were forced to move out of a place they lived in now in a matter of six hours because of something that's been going wrong for years...

Sorry, buddy, but no. It's been a problem for years, and they were aware of it. It was on their radar, but it wasn't something that made the building uninhabitable. However, the engineers believe the recent dry weather (or some other factor y.t.b.d.) caused a sudden shift. So, the timetable has been pushed up.

I can understand being upset over having to move mid-semester. What I cannot understand are all of the conspiracy theories and accusations of negligence just to save a buck. (I'd be very careful throwing around the term negligence, by the way.) This school wants to take care of it's students. It's doing the best it can with what it has. I know 18-22 year olds know how to run EVERYTHING better than anyone else, but give the old folks a chance. They're not here to "getcha" or get rich off of anyone. There's no need for the conspiracy theories.

The biggest complaint is that they were told "Be out by 8pm so we can fix it" and nothing has been fixed yet. Why did they have to miss class, miss work, miss job interviews, etc to move out if no one has entered the building to fix it yet?

They never said they were going to fix it that evening. They were told to be out by 8pm because it was Friday afternoon before anyone knew they were going to have to be relocated and students were starting to go home for the weekend. It's not as easy as "get out" and whoever is running point on the operation sending in engineers and construction gear.

[El Scorcho]

I'm one of the students who sticks up for the school 90% of the time to my friends and all of that. It just seems like if they knew we were going to add "x" amount of students in 2004, we should've started negotiating for the transit stuff in 2002 if it was going to take four years.

Except that in 2002 we didn't know someone was going to buy Ericsson and give it to us. We didn't know we'd have two campuses with academic facilities that students would need to get to. All of our planning was centered around Demoss Hall.

That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. Students don't get that because they come in here for four years and whine about all of the problems, not knowing the changes, efforts and time that have gone into fixing problems they never even had to see.

[Schfourteenteen]

Scorch: I dont know how "the system" works but there is no way that the way we maintain our buildings cant improve. Just about everybody who's lived on the circle has pointed out an instance where something went haywire on their dorm. In all this LU should be looking for a better way to keep up with the buildings or put more resourses into keeping the buildings from having cracks in them

Not saying someone needs to be fired just LU ought to put more focus on keeping up with the buildings

I understand what you're saying. But when you talk about a "system" or "they" or "LU", you're talking about specific people. I don't like the generalizations. If someone isn't doing their job, call them out on it. You'd do it if they were a football coach.

If I knew who was in charge of Building Maintenence and how often building inspectors came into the dorms each year and who those inspectors are, then instead of saying "we can do better" here I would probably be e-mailing them, and if my e-mail gets ignored I'd email Jeff Barber, because he can do anything

[SuperJon]

I get that stuff. I was talking in terms of transportation, etc. I completely understand Erickson, etc.

[TDDance234]

I'd email Jeff Barber, because he can do anything

...so true.

[Schfourteenteen]

Because the engineers said it might not be safe? I'm sure they'll fix it as soon as they have the necessary materials, equipment, personnel, etc.

Too dangerous to live in, yes. But was it too dangerous to walk in and grab a tv or some clothes on Saturday morning instead of Friday night? I know of kids who missed job interviews because of having to move out. Would it have been too dangerous for him to come in on Saturday morning to move out so he could've went to the job interview? If so, there's no way that dorm is fixed in two weeks.

Thats just the timing of it. If they decided to clear everybody out on Tuesday, my guess is the 7ers would have more than a couple hours to get out.

[El Scorcho]

If I knew who was in charge of Building Maintenence...

http://www.liberty.edu/financeadmin/fie ... fm?PID=433

[Knucklehead]

[LUconn]

[Knucklehead]

Now that's WAY more scary than Cracks in walls or sleepint next to an IT rack or no air conditioning or a refugee camp or . . . . . .

[thepostman]

I pray to God I never forget what its like to be a student...thats all I have got to say about this....just like I hope I never forget how I was in high school, or the first year I came to college....people so easily forget the mindsets that you have when you are younger and just call these kids stupid....its an easy thing to fall into....but come on....these kids, for the most part, are taking this thing fairly well....I have talked to some and even the RD....and they have been fairly positive...about as positive as anybody can be in this kind of situation...you guys are letting 3 kids that have bad attitudes define a whole group of guys....I guess thats what mature adults do...but i hope i never turn into that....

[LUconn]

obviously those that aren't being babies aren't included in our generalizations. I also haven't forgotten what it's like to be a student. It wasn't that long ago. I still wake up with the feeling every once in a while that I forgot to do some sort of homework or project and that I'm screwed.

[El Scorcho]

you guys are letting 3 kids that have bad attitudes define a whole group of guys...

They're the ones talking about it on Facebook and in the paper. It seems to me that it's the group of guys who are letting those kids define them, not me.

[thepostman]

well...the other guys don't care that much one way or another....its always the ones with the stronger opinions that are more vocal...I just think some of the guys on this board are jumping all over these guys and completely forgetting that these are students paying money...if this happened to my very own aparment and I had to move all my stuff out in a few hours I would be just as upset...and to say you guys wouldn't be is crazy...of course they are less mature then you guys because they are 5-10 years younger....

[El Scorcho]

if this happened to my very own aparment and I had to move all my stuff out in a few hours I would be just as upset...and to say you guys wouldn't be is crazy...of course they are less mature then you guys because they are 5-10 years younger....

See, the thing is, something very comparable happened to me (see above) with even less notice than they got. I woke up to standing water in my room. And I don't remember me or any of my three roommates getting that upset over it. It was just something that happened. Stuff happens.

[ALUmnus]

sj, every mistake that happens at this school is the end of the world for "some kid" that you know. They missed about half a day of their lives. This is something that can happen at any time of any day, it's called life. Get in a car wreck, you can pretty much be certain that the rest of your day is shot. But in this instance, the school has been very reasonable and done everything they needed to to help these guys out. If that one kid fails his class, it's not because he missed one study session.

And by the way, Liberty is constantly updating/upgrading/improving the "stuff we already have". The whole campus has been rewired, more than once, new furniture in every room, floors replaced in halls, less people in each room, those hardware towers in the lobbies, etc, etc. They improve every year. And all the thousands of stories of things going wrong in the dorms do happen, albeit with some exaggeration, but they also happen to brand new buildings, just as frequently. One day all the circle dorms will be torn down and built over, but I'm sure there's a timetable for all that, created by people who are much smarter than we are.

[SuperJon]

See, the thing is, something very comparable happened to me (see above) with even less notice than they got. I woke up to standing water in my room. And I don't remember me or any of my three roommates getting that upset over it. It was just something that happened. Stuff happens.

I see yours as a freak accident that they could not have seen coming. Your situation sucked, yes, but it's not something that they saw coming in advance. This is something that, from all accounts, has had signs for years.