[ballcoach15]

Any Guru know how the LU players are doing in the summer leagues around the country.

[BJWilliams]

A bunch of guys are playing in the Coastal Plains League including the already mentioned Carson Herndon, plus Caleb Evans, Andrew Kowalo (?), Will Shepherd and Sammy Taormina.

[Flamepop]

Will Shepherd was just named a CPL All Star

[huntandfish]

I just showed up to watch a LU player play in my town. Showed up with my LU shirt etc..and boy was I shocked. I have known this young man for years and so happy he went to LU. Well,until he told me that he just got a call from one of the asst coaches that informed him his money had been pulled. Toman did not have the character to even call the kid. He is a Jr and its July 13 come on what are we doing. The kid was told in his end of the year meeting that his money would still be there in 2015 2016 to have a good summer work hard etc.. and this was a kid that played a bunch. Somebody has got to help me on this one why would we do this to a JR this later? We expect our kids to act with character and the coach said Coach Toman has changed his mind. Wow this guy has a job at LU. What happened to a mans word. Well as an alum and a former player I feel bad for the kid. I guess things have changed on Liberty Mtn and I'm not saying don't cut a kid but to tell him his money is good and then call July 13th and say I changed my mind. That's just bad business. How does this happen.

[Trottalot]

I just showed up to watch a LU player play in my town. Showed up with my LU shirt etc..and boy was I shocked. I have known this young man for years and so happy he went to LU. Well,until he told me that he just got a call from one of the asst coaches that informed him his money had been pulled. Toman did not have the character to even call the kid. He is a Jr and its July 13 come on what are we doing. The kid was told in his end of the year meeting that his money would still be there in 2015 2016 to have a good summer work hard etc.. and this was a kid that played a bunch. Somebody has got to help me on this one why would we do this to a JR this later? We expect our kids to act with character and the coach said Coach Toman has changed his mind. Wow this guy has a job at LU. What happened to a mans word. Well as an alum and a former player I feel bad for the kid. I guess things have changed on Liberty Mtn and I'm not saying don't cut a kid but to tell him his money is good and then call July 13th and say I changed my mind. That's just bad business. How does this happen.

This is just another example of what I have been saying for years; this man is a jerk and doesn't care about his players. LU could do so much better for a head coach.

[huntandfish]

My simple question is how does Coach Toman get away with doing things like this? Are we so bent on winning that we have lost our way? Again its not about cutting a kid or taking his money that is part of the process but to tell a kid, Coach changed his mind on July 13 is just wrong and I would love to hear how anyone can support this move by Toman.

[ballcoach15]

Things like this should never happen. Someone dropped the ball somewhere. Sounds as if administration needs to investigate. This may be a problem that needs to be resolved "above" coaching level.

[SuperJon]

This has been going on for years. It's the way Coach Toman operates. It is what it is at this point. Everyone knows it happens. No one seems to care. Bring on the next group of guys that are better than what we currently have.

[newoldschool17]

Correct Jon. No dropped ball. Always happened, no secret. If a better player can be signed then the other kid gets a call. This is the first time someone you have known personally it has happened to, but nothing new. It's an ever year deal and program (big time baseball recruiting) mentality.

[jinxy]

Life isnt always fair. This happens in all 3 major sports. Youd def like the timing to be better but it is what it is. One thing in tomans defense is that baseball and the draft make roster decisions really difficult. Were to the point where were losing kids to the draft every year and the roster is fluctuating. Its a challenge and the timing stinks but its a part of college baseball now. Not just is. I promise you that. I can narrow it down to 2 players i think and neither of them exactly secured their spots with their play this year.

[flameshaw]

We are reacting to a conversation between two friends, and just hearing one side of the story? Just want to make sure. smh.
This happens all the time at almost all schools,in almost every sport. I don't like the fact that baseball has very limited scholarship money, but it is what it is, not likely to change anytime soon.

[SuperJon]

I agree it happens every year and think it's the coach's right to be able to give/take away scholarship money. However, where my problem has always been with Coach Toman is the timing of it. He's told guys at their exit interview that they'd have money, only to find a better guy over the summer and take away the first guy's money. If he wants to take it away at the exit interview, sure. But once you tell a guy he's getting his money, honor that commitment for the next year.

[newoldschool17]

Flameshaw, not reacting to huntandfish's conversation. Was giving a real look and how things are done with the staff and the recruiting mentality when it comes to scholarships. Whether someone thinks it's wrong or right is up to them, but we do take money if a better player is available at any point of the offseason. Sign all the guys you can and figure it out on the back end.

[huntandfish]

And this is just OK and that's the way it works. What happened to let your yes be yes and your no be no? The timing is the issue and as a Christian I changed my mind don't work. After 15 years of marriage would that work on your wife when you see a better one. But that's marriage and this is baseball. But they still have a signed contract and agreement between coach and player. As far as I know the contract was not broken. The asst coach simply said coach changed his mind. They have a contract and the funny thing is the NCAA will not allow the players to " change his mind" without setting out a yr. What happened to my word is my bond? But you are saying the the coach can do that. The whole world is going to Hell in a hand basket. In the words of "Big Al" this guy has no character. Why are we allowing a man to coach the program that has zero character?

[BJWilliams]

I was going to offer some perspective huntandfish but you have clearly dug your trench on this one and I'm simply going to defer to the others.

[thepostman]

I think it's shady and cowardly but let's not compare this to marriage. Completely different.

[flameshaw]

Hey, having your money taken away sucks. However, because of the NCAA rules, there is only a very limited amount to go around. If a player doesn't realize that circumstances are fluid and things change, is a bit shortsighted. It happens every year, I don't like the way the system works at all. Players change their minds on the draft, leave school, etc. If we don't win, people complain we can't recruit. When we try to field the best team, with limited resources, people complain. smh. Hopefully, this player can find a place where he can play and get more money. If not, maybe he sticks around, has a good year and gets his money back next year. It has happened before. Regardless, I wish him nothing but the best.

[huntandfish]

That is the problem we don't compare it to marriage or anything we just say it's college baseball. What happened to a man's word weather it's a hand shake or your vows. The " I changed my mind" works in divorce as well. I guess I was born in the wrong era and if this is what college sports has gotten to be I'm glad I got out when I did. The sad part is the buddies I have that are still in coaching and are not , as Big Al would say saved, act the same way our coach does. A former LU player who got into coaching years ago was told by a LU coach " always treat your players like they are somebody's son, because they are." I like that. I'm sure Toman would have no issue with his son's future HS coach telling them they made the club and then on Monday calling them in and telling them I only have x number of unies and I have changed my mind. I can't keep you. This guy has got to have someone as a mentor that can help him not make dumb ungodly choices. How hard is it to keep your word. Is the guy coming in worth losing your character over.

[thepostman]

Marriage is not the same thing as a relationship between a player and coach. That is downplaying the importance of the marriage relationship. Like I said it is shady and cowardly but a man doing something like this to a player is completely different than I man not being loyal to his wife. Even you must understand that.

[ATrain]

Coach/player is different than a marriage partnership. Marriage requires a level of commitment far above the relationship between a coach/player. However, promising one thing and then choosing to go back on that promise is just shady and cowardly. It would be one thing if the administration was cutting baseball, reducing scholarship funding, etc...but that is hardly the case here. If Coach Toman did this in the business world, he'd soon find himself without any good partners and in an area full of people willing to do the same to him.

[flameshaw]

......

[flameshaw]

All this...................... and we only have one side of the story? Has anyone asked Toman his side, or do we just take the word of the players friend, as gospel? I guess one is guilty here until proven innocent. smh. Lexapro?

[huntandfish]

Can someone call Toman and ask him? I would love to but as you can tell I'm not sure how I would handle it. There are two sides to every story this is true but even with two sides there is only one right and correct side. However in today's world there could be two rights............ Even on this board I am blown away at how we want to defend Toman and talk about is record. What about is Christian example? I'm not saying he is not a believer but what about training young champions for Christ. How is he doing on that? Is that not the core value of the University or has it changed. If it has changed then I would never say a word because as you guys have stated many times that college sports. But LU was built to be a light is a dark world and I guess that is not covered in sports.

[olldflame]

Not only are we not getting both sides of the story, I have doubts that the side we are getting is totally straight. The player supposedly ¨just got a call¨ on July 13 informing him his scholarship won´t be renewed. My understanding is that the deadline to do that is July 1. Whatever you may think of Toman´s methods, he´s smart enough to know he needs to work within the NCAAs time frame, so that call he ¨just got¨was almost certainly at least 2 weeks ago. If not, we have a violation here.

If a clear promise was made and reniged on, I have a problem with that. It isn´t necessary. If a player is a borderline keeper, there is no reason not to b e honest with them and let them know that it is possible the scholarship money that they have been receiving will be going to another player, and they will know by July 1 at the latest.

[huntandfish]

The kid was not told before July 1. But even if he was we are still talking about a kid that was told his money is good in May and then in July I changed my mind. That is crazy and would love to here the 'rest of the story". Now we could get into deeper issue if the July deadline is correct which I don't remember from my college coaching days. So he would move the money around without the kids knowing it and then call them and say I changed my mind. Forget a violation what about a violation of Christian character or is lying OK now in college sports. We need some help on this one.