This forum is pure hardball. Bring the heat in this discussion of Flames baseball.
By WestPAGator
#550682 Where did all the baseball experts go? Still think Jackson is putting out the best/strongest lineup?
By jinxy
#550695 Who are the young inexperienced hitters? No frosh production that i can see. Todd artis galazin and locklear are the only consistent production i see and they are all vets. Allen and embry to a lesser degree but they are vets. Maybe Matthieu but he has been boom or bust all year.


Jackson has his work cut out. His first recruiting class looks weak outside of todd and skirrow and todd will likely be gone. Honestly i cant see much better next year. Pitchers like degroat after TJ have really struggled like bertsch last year and herndon before that.
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By flameshaw
#550696
jinxy wrote:Who are the young inexperienced hitters? No frosh production that i can see. Todd artis galazin and locklear are the only consistent production i see and they are all vets. Allen and embry to a lesser degree but they are vets. Maybe Matthieu but he has been boom or bust all year.


Jackson has his work cut out. His first recruiting class looks weak outside of todd and skirrow and todd will likely be gone. Honestly i cant see much better next year. Pitchers like degroat after TJ have really struggled like bertsch last year and herndon before that.


I kinda expected more out of Jackson by now. Artis played better last year. Not any overall team improvement from last year to this year. We have had some key injuries, etc. I am willing to wait another or two. He is a great guy and a good LU fit, but can he win? We will just have to see how things go in the near future.
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By Jonathan Carone
#550699
jinxy wrote:Jackson has his work cut out. His first recruiting class looks weak outside of todd and skirrow and todd will likely be gone.


He was hired in July of his first year. What do you expect out of a rushed recruiting class? If this year’s freshman class doesn’t develop then yeah, you’ve got a leg to stand on. That first year is a wash.
By ballcoach15
#550705 Coach Jackson will get the job done. It will take time.

We beat Radford 11-10 today. Pitching wasn't good, but we scored 11.
By elvisistheking
#550709 What makes you so sure Jackson “will get the job done?” They lost two out of three to a supposedly inferior team. Scored 11 runs on a depleted pitching staff and barely won. My opinion for what it’s worth, is that the jury is still way out on Jackson.
By Chippy
#550711 I wonder if there is a stat for leaving runners on base (LOB)? It seems we should be near the top (worst) in the country.
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By Class of 20Something
#550713
Chippy wrote:I wonder if there is a stat for leaving runners on base (LOB)? It seems we should be near the top (worst) in the country.


Runners Left In Scoring Position is tracked in MLB. I'm not sure about college.
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By Jonathan Carone
#550723
elvisistheking wrote:What makes you so sure Jackson “will get the job done?” They lost two out of three to a supposedly inferior team. Scored 11 runs on a depleted pitching staff and barely won. My opinion for what it’s worth, is that the jury is still way out on Jackson.


The jury is definitely still out on him. I believe he’ll get the job done for a few reasons:

1) His reputation - people in the business speak very highly of him and he was a top tier assistant coach

2) His approach - he approaches the game in a smart way that puts us in position to win

3) His character - he does things the right way and is a great fit for the university

We will have to see if his recruiting and player development is where it needs to be. I think it will get there but that’s the unproven part right now.
By ballcoach15
#550732 Anyone not happy with Jackson, probably doesn't know much about college baseball. We are fortunate to have him, along with the pitching coach. Just give him time,
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By Jonathan Carone
#550768
elvisistheking wrote:Idk, I’m not so sure about this coach. But I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt, at least for now.


That's because just like WestPAGator, you have an axe to grind because of personal issues.
By elvisistheking
#550773 If I have an “axe to grind “ it’s with you, insinuating you know anything about me.

I read your post and 3 very generic talking points highlighting this coach’s attributes.
Could have said the same thing about Toman and a whole slew of other coaches.

As I said, I’m willing to give Jackson the benefit of the doubt for now. And please don’t tell me you know anything about someone’s character, unless you know them personally.
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By Jonathan Carone
#550779 My assumption was based on you posting for the same IP address as WestPAGator.

As for my generic points, 2 and 3 definitely don’t apply to Toman.
By rogers3
#550789
Jonathan Carone wrote:My assumption was based on you posting for the same IP address as WestPAGator.



Pretty sad.
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By flamesfilmguy
#550793 my guys had to walk off on Radford twice. They can hit. and don't have horrible front line pitching. Jackson is fine. All of the ACC guys speak very highly of him. Those who have issues with him are either parents/friends of a bench player not getting playing time. or have no idea what he's squeezed out of this team with the pitching injuries and lack of depth. I'm guessing the fact that two people are posting from the same IP address indicates its only really one person who has a serious issue with Jackson.
By thepostman
#550794
Jonathan Carone wrote:My assumption was based on you posting for the same IP address as WestPAGator.

As for my generic points, 2 and 3 definitely don’t apply to Toman.


And with that he goes silent...
By elvisistheking
#550827
thepostman wrote:
Jonathan Carone wrote:My assumption was based on you posting for the same IP address as WestPAGator.

As for my generic points, 2 and 3 definitely don’t apply to Toman.


And with that he goes silent...



So if someone has a differing opinion they obviously have some sort of conspiratorial agenda to fulfill.

Furthermore, looking up IP addresses seems unsavory and vindictive. You may think you know but you don’t really.

Please contact me directly if you want to discuss this further as this is getting ridiculous.

Btw, I am not westpagator.
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By Class of 20Something
#550830 Man, the drama here has been through the roof lately! And while it is entertaining, can football season come back so we are too preoccupied to have these kinds of "discussions."
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By Jonathan Carone
#550833
elvisistheking wrote:So if someone has a differing opinion they obviously have some sort of conspiratorial agenda to fulfill.

Furthermore, looking up IP addresses seems unsavory and vindictive. You may think you know but you don’t really.

Please contact me directly if you want to discuss this further as this is getting ridiculous.

Btw, I am not westpagator.


When someone shows up in the middle of a rough patch criticizing a coach in the same way as a small minority, it’s standard practice to check if that person is just the same person stirring up issues under a different username. In your case, it’s obvious you’re not WestPAGator but that there is a relationship there as evidenced by posting from the same IP address on some posts.
By jinxy
#550853 Im with flameshaw in that i expected more. If the class was rushed we should have went mofe juco heavy to bridge the gap since your not getting the HS talent you want anyway. Our pitching is an unmitigated disaster and a healthy degroat and mcinvale would have helped some but not enough to fix the development issues. I dont see anyone thats gotten better is my biggest problem. I like jackson and i hope he is the guy. The third year will be a big year for this staff to show something.
By JK37
#550962 I love how some people think coaches can just snap their fingers, and JuCo prospects just flow into a program. “Just go JuCo” - it ain’t that easy. So whose to say Jackson didn’t look at that?
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By Jonathan Carone
#550964 Jackson’s biggest recruits for his first year were DJ Artis and Jack DeGroat. He had to convince those guys to stay before he could convince new guys to come.
By jinxy
#550991 Let me break it down for you. All 3 coaches were employed and coaching at other schools. Hence they know the lay of the land and who is available. In fact we have a feeder system of juco coaches that reach out to the school for baseball regardless of who is the coach letting them know who to take a look at. In fact most juco guys dont get a chance simply because its generally frowned upon by most staffs and looked at as a band aid. I agree but there are certain instances where it makes sense and bridging the gap between coahes is one of them. Toman relied too heavily on it until he whiffed a couple years and then it cost him. You dont have to beleive me but i know personally 2 of the juco coaches that have sent multiple studs to us in the past 5 to 7 years and thats exactly how it works. Its up to the coach which route they take. Jackson opted for the complete rebuild via HS route with todd and galazin really being the exceptions. So. Yes it is def that easy but its all about each coaches philsophy.
By olldflame
#550995
jinxy wrote:Let me break it down for you. All 3 coaches were employed and coaching at other schools. Hence they know the lay of the land and who is available. In fact we have a feeder system of juco coaches that reach out to the school for baseball regardless of who is the coach letting them know who to take a look at. In fact most juco guys dont get a chance simply because its generally frowned upon by most staffs and looked at as a band aid. I agree but there are certain instances where it makes sense and bridging the gap between coahes is one of them. Toman relied too heavily on it until he whiffed a couple years and then it cost him. You dont have to beleive me but i know personally 2 of the juco coaches that have sent multiple studs to us in the past 5 to 7 years and thats exactly how it works. Its up to the coach which route they take. Jackson opted for the complete rebuild via HS route with todd and galazin really being the exceptions. So. Yes it is def that easy but its all about each coaches philsophy.


I'm sure JK37 is happy that you straightened him out on how things work in college recruiting.
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By Cider Jim
#551003
jinxy wrote:Im with flameshaw...

Those are 3 words you seldom see in the same sentence. Crybaby
By jinxy
#551012 I only answered a direct challenge with facts. Im only talking juco baseball college recruiting. To say otherwise is disengenious. Every word of what i said is true. The thought that you cant land juco players in a years time is ludicruous. Those kids are hungry for opportunity and the coaches makes recommendations to d1 coaches including us every single
Year.
By olldflame
#551015
jinxy wrote:I only answered a direct challenge with facts. Im only talking juco baseball college recruiting. To say otherwise is disengenious. Every word of what i said is true. The thought that you cant land juco players in a years time is ludicruous. Those kids are hungry for opportunity and the coaches makes recommendations to d1 coaches including us every single
Year.


You said exactly the same thing about football.
By JK37
#551021 My point was that if any prospect - HS or JuCo - is good, it's not simple to get them. If a kid is easy to recruit, there's a reason.
By jinxy
#551087 False. I dont know football juco coaches personally as i do baseball. 2 totally different points. Jk. Agreed in general however jucos are often overlooked because the market isnt that strong for them. I can promise you in baseball we have tons of interest from all 3 programs i know well. Think 2 of our best relievers and 2 aces and one of the best power hitters in recent years. There is loads of talent in the jucos and some are fits. Not all but some. Baseball is easier to find fits for LU imho

Football was simple. We need d lineman. They did the same thing this year. The juco d lineman we took had no offers to speak of i just said we should have added a couple more last summer which was proven true for depth if nothing else.

The 2 primary scenarios for bulk jucos are coaching changes and fbs transition.
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By Jonathan Carone
#551088 Or maybe he didn’t want to have a quick fix with guys who may not fit the culture he was wanting to build and instead took the slow and steady route to truly build the program.
By jinxy
#551110 Thats a valid point. I keep saying it. i like jackson. Just analyzing where we are etc. i just think were in a bit of a dangerous place talent wise. Subtract todd and artis and its kinda scary next year. We cant afford to totally tear it down and comp will be better next year in asun.

HS players are very difficult to evaluate. Competition is so varied and everybody is in on the obvious guys with plus velocity and core power. Projecting the rest is very difficult. Jucos floors are higher but their ceiling is usually lower with the exceptions being the tre todds.
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By Jonathan Carone
#551111 Our roster was in a really bad place when Jackson got here. We had a lot of the same type of player without much versatility. The studs at the top were really, really good but the rest of the roster hadn't been developed. It was a tough place to be.