[bballfan84]

Got to see the guys play a couple pickup games over the weekend so I figured I would break down what I saw. By far this is the most talent we have had in a long time. This is the best group of big men we have had since the year we won the Big South Championship. I like the development I have seen from Andrew Smith although I think he is still probably a year away from being a major minutes guy. His athleticism is elite at 6'9 but still has a little ways to go. JR is a straight man who I think will start right away. He will bring boards and a toughness we have not had in a long time. Burrus looks about the same, I have never been a huge fan because his offensive game is extremely limited in my opinion, however he is a big body who can board. With JR and Burrus competing every day in practice that can only elevate each of their games. Sommy looks really good. It looks like he is still not fully comfortable after his injury but he is extremely coachable and is a great team player. I saw him duck in and post efficiently and grab multiple offensive rebounds. Tomaz is someone who I think can be a breakout player. He is a long athletic four who can knock it from the outside. Tomaz is going to be key in our success. He still needs to gain some weight but that is all a matter of work outside of the gym. All in all our bigs are our big strength.
There were a lot of new faces and I had trouble keeping them all straight. I was fairly impressed with our guards although I did not see much athleticism and height out of them. The transfer Davon is a 3 pt specialist who can run the team and make intelligent basketball decisions. I would look for him to run PG. If any of you guys remember Gainor (sp?) from Winthrop, he is a great comparison to Davon. The freshman Larry Taylor is a competitor who looked reallly comfortable out there. I dont think he will get much time but I think this kid will be a solid player down the road. I wasnt to big on the 3/4 freshman Wes, he seemed a little awkard to me and I do not think he can play as a 3 at the D1 level. Not sure on his future as a contributor. The walk on Casey Roberts was very impressive and I actually think he could log some serious minutes. I think he will provide some serious competition to Speaks. He plays the game a little tougher than Speaks and I think there is a chance he beats Speaks out for the starting gig. Chad Donley is another guy who I was impressed with and I think he can log some serious minutes this year. I didnt get a chance to see the new guy Jarrod but from what I saw we have some of the best overall talent in a while. Here is to hoping we can stay healthy and out of trouble.

[olldflame]

Was JVP playing? He is coming off back surgery, so they may still have him shut down. He showed some real flashes last year when he wasn't in pain.

[Chippy]

Got to see the guys play a couple pickup games over the weekend so I figured I would break down what I saw. By far this is the most talent we have had in a long time. This is the best group of big men we have had since the year we won the Big South Championship. I like the development I have seen from Andrew Smith although I think he is still probably a year away from being a major minutes guy. His athleticism is elite at 6'9 but still has a little ways to go. JR is a straight man who I think will start right away. He will bring boards and a toughness we have not had in a long time. Burrus looks about the same, I have never been a huge fan because his offensive game is extremely limited in my opinion, however he is a big body who can board. With JR and Burrus competing every day in practice that can only elevate each of their games. Sommy looks really good. It looks like he is still not fully comfortable after his injury but he is extremely coachable and is a great team player. I saw him duck in and post efficiently and grab multiple offensive rebounds. Tomaz is someone who I think can be a breakout player. He is a long athletic four who can knock it from the outside. Tomaz is going to be key in our success. He still needs to gain some weight but that is all a matter of work outside of the gym. All in all our bigs are our big strength.


There were a lot of new faces and I had trouble keeping them all straight. I was fairly impressed with our guards although I did not see much athleticism and height out of them. The transfer Davon is a 3 pt specialist who can run the team and make intelligent basketball decisions. I would look for him to run PG. If any of you guys remember Gainor (sp?) from Winthrop, he is a great comparison to Davon. The freshman Larry Taylor is a competitor who looked reallly comfortable out there. I dont think he will get much time but I think this kid will be a solid player down the road. I wasnt to big on the 3/4 freshman Wes, he seemed a little awkard to me and I do not think he can play as a 3 at the D1 level. Not sure on his future as a contributor. The walk on Casey Roberts was very impressive and I actually think he could log some serious minutes. I think he will provide some serious competition to Speaks. He plays the game a little tougher than Speaks and I think there is a chance he beats Speaks out for the starting gig. Chad Donley is another guy who I was impressed with and I think he can log some serious minutes this year. I didnt get a chance to see the new guy Jarrod but from what I saw we have some of the best overall talent in a while. Here is to hoping we can stay healthy and out of trouble.

Thanks for the insights and observayions. Sounds very encouraging.

[bballfan84]

Was JVP playing? He is coming off back surgery, so they may still have him shut down. He showed some real flashes last year when he wasn't in pain.

JVP wasnt playing and wasnt even there. In my opinion I dont think JVP should get a lot of minutes with what I have seen from him the last 3 years and what I see with the new guys we have. I would rather see those minutes go to Sommy, Tomaz, and Andrew Smith.

[jcmanson]

JVP just had a 2nd surgery last week

[olldflame]

Was JVP playing? He is coming off back surgery, so they may still have him shut down. He showed some real flashes last year when he wasn't in pain.

JVP wasnt playing and wasnt even there. In my opinion I dont think JVP should get a lot of minutes with what I have seen from him the last 3 years and what I see with the new guys we have. I would rather see those minutes go to Sommy, Tomaz, and Andrew Smith.

I want to see the minutes go to the most productive players. The fact that Joel needed a second surgery may be an indication of just how bad his back actually was last year, and explain why he had games when he didn't play many minutes or very well, yet he had a few when he looked really good. I hope this isn't a chronic problem for his sake, but it does look like we have excellent depth at the position now.

[Bigsouthking]

So from reading the original post here is what I gather:

Smith is great
Burrus not so great
Speaks comes off the bench
Not sure on the Point guard position
None of the true freshman were that impressive

[olldflame]

So from reading the original post here is what I gather:

Smith is great
Burrus not so great
Speaks comes off the bench
Not sure on the Point guard position
None of the true freshman were that impressive

I agree (I think) that bballfan84 is all over the map with his assessment and appears to contradict himself at times. He raves about Smith, but then says he won't play much. I'm not sure which Antwan Burrus he has been watching for 3 years or if he has taken notice to how Layer deals with his players, but you can bet that Antwan will be a fixture at the 4. Layer loves to play seniors, and Twan is the only one left from his first recruiting class. He has been out of position at the 5 for his whole career, and I think he will have an excellent senior year at PF.

The possibility that Speaks may not start would IMHO be a positive, as it would indicated we have upgraded the talent there. His minutes may be cut but I will be shocked if he does not start. Another senior.

Not sure where you get the uncertainty at PG. It's going to be Marshall, with Taylor backing him up. As far as the true freshmen are concerned, we only have 2, and it seems he liked Taylor and wasn't impressed with Alcegaire.

[bballfan84]

So from reading the original post here is what I gather:

Smith is great
Burrus not so great
Speaks comes off the bench
Not sure on the Point guard position
None of the true freshman were that impressive

I agree (I think) that bballfan84 is all over the map with his assessment and appears to contradict himself at times. He raves about Smith, but then says he won't play much. I'm not sure which Antwan Burrus he has been watching for 3 years or if he has taken notice to how Layer deals with his players, but you can bet that Antwan will be a fixture at the 4. Layer loves to play seniors, and Twan is the only one left from his first recruiting class. He has been out of position at the 5 for his whole career, and I think he will have an excellent senior year at PF.

The possibility that Speaks may not start would IMHO be a positive, as it would indicated we have upgraded the talent there. His minutes may be cut but I will be shocked if he does not start. Another senior.

Not sure where you get the uncertainty at PG. It's going to be Marshall, with Taylor backing him up. As far as the true freshmen are concerned, we only have 2, and it seems he liked Taylor and wasn't impressed with Alcegaire.

Sorry guys I dont have a journalism degree and didnt sit down for two hours to make it more clear to yall. I dont see any contradiction in my statement as I said i liked Smiths progression but I still think he is a year away from being a contributor. As for Burrus, I said he is what he is, I am not personally a fan but I am not the coach either so I think he will bring what he has brought for the past 3 years. Big south king I dont think I could get more clear about the pg situation when I said I think Davon is most likely the starting PG, and I also liked the backup freshman Larry Taylor. Did you actually read the post????????????????????????? I was just trying to fill people in on what I saw since the season was so far away and a lot of people dont have the opportunity to see the team until November.

[libertyfan4life]

So from reading the original post here is what I gather:

Smith is great
Burrus not so great
Speaks comes off the bench
Not sure on the Point guard position
None of the true freshman were that impressive

I agree (I think) that bballfan84 is all over the map with his assessment and appears to contradict himself at times. He raves about Smith, but then says he won't play much. I'm not sure which Antwan Burrus he has been watching for 3 years or if he has taken notice to how Layer deals with his players, but you can bet that Antwan will be a fixture at the 4. Layer loves to play seniors, and Twan is the only one left from his first recruiting class. He has been out of position at the 5 for his whole career, and I think he will have an excellent senior year at PF.

The possibility that Speaks may not start would IMHO be a positive, as it would indicated we have upgraded the talent there. His minutes may be cut but I will be shocked if he does not start. Another senior.

Not sure where you get the uncertainty at PG. It's going to be Marshall, with Taylor backing him up. As far as the true freshmen are concerned, we only have 2, and it seems he liked Taylor and wasn't impressed with Alcegaire.

Sorry guys I dont have a journalism degree and didnt sit down for two hours to make it more clear to yall. I dont see any contradiction in my statement as I said i liked Smiths progression but I still think he is a year away from being a contributor. As for Burrus, I said he is what he is, I am not personally a fan but I am not the coach either so I think he will bring what he has brought for the past 3 years. Big south king I dont think I could get more clear about the pg situation when I said I think Davon is most likely the starting PG, and I also liked the backup freshman Larry Taylor. Did you actually read the post????????????????????????? I was just trying to fill people in on what I saw since the season was so far away and a lot of people dont have the opportunity to see the team until November.

bballfan84,

For what it's worth, I appreciated the post and insight that you made in your comments. The Men's Hoop's Forum has been a little slow lately. It's hard waiting for the Flames Basketball season to arrive soon enough.

I am not on campus, and I am also out of State (on the other side of the country), so any info people like you have in terms of a hot scoop, team news and or opinions (being shared) on this season's team is always appreciated!

I watch the Flames games strictly online. It's my only option. And I havent seen a game live (in person) in about three years. Ugh. I would have loved to have been in your shoes just to see a live game, pickup scrimmage or practice etc of the Flames and from your vantage point. Sounds awesome. It's hard watching a game online when as a student I never missed a game for anything.

From my vantage point, you are blessed.

My only live, game day experience for anything Liberty related this year will be in three weeks when Liberty plays Montana in Football in Missoula. I am personally stoked.

All of this is to say, that I rely mostly upon the people in this forum who are currently living in the Liberty Community to share their insight, experiences and or opinions on anything related to all things Flames Athletics.

That is in my opinion the greatest value of following these forums.

[bballfan84]

Thanks.

[Purple Haize]

. JR is a straight man.....l

ATrain may be disappointed by this news

[chukels911]

I would like some honest opinion about the expectations of the Squad this year. We havent been dominant since Layer has been here, correct me if i am wrong but i have not been impressed. I have seen so much talent on our squad but not a lot of production. In my unprofessional opinion this is a make or break year for Layer. Thoughts? arguments? Insults?

[flamehunter]

I think you are right on as far as this is Layer's year to prove something. I think the talent has been decent but not necessarily much ahead of where we have been in the past. As for insults, you have a funny name.

[olldflame]

I would like some honest opinion about the expectations of the Squad this year. We havent been dominant since Layer has been here, correct me if i am wrong but i have not been impressed. I have seen so much talent on our squad but not a lot of production. In my unprofessional opinion this is a make or break year for Layer. Thoughts? arguments? Insults?

I don't know how long you have been following the program, but the fact is we have NEVER been "dominant" in the BSC, under Layer, McKay, Dunton, Hankinson, or even Meyer. The only team that can say that is Winthrop.

IMHO, Layer went "all in" by signing so many JUCO players this year, and I think he has 2 years to make the program at least a strong challenger for BSC championships. They need to show progress this year and be REALLY GOOD by next year. If they were to take a step back this year, I think his job could be in jeopardy.

[Chippy]

I would like some honest opinion about the expectations of the Squad this year. We havent been dominant since Layer has been here, correct me if i am wrong but i have not been impressed. I have seen so much talent on our squad but not a lot of production. In my unprofessional opinion this is a make or break year for Layer. Thoughts? arguments? Insults?

With all due respect, our talent level is, at best, average to below average, except for 1-2 players at a time. Dominant teams have 3+ superior talented players on their team. This team has potential but they will be hard pressed to be dominant with the talent they have now, even in the Big South. With our talent I would expect us to be preseason ranked in the middle of the pack at best.

In regard to Layer, I think he gets the most out of each player. They seem to work hard for him. The effort they make is far more than what I have seen from Dunton and McKay. We have bigs in place for a few years. We are a pure shooter away from being at the top of the BSC. The last decent shooting team was, dare I say, Seth Curry and Anthony Smith.

[Bigsouthking]

I would like some honest opinion about the expectations of the Squad this year. We havent been dominant since Layer has been here, correct me if i am wrong but i have not been impressed. I have seen so much talent on our squad but not a lot of production. In my unprofessional opinion this is a make or break year for Layer. Thoughts? arguments? Insults?

With all due respect, our talent level is, at best, average to below average, except for 1-2 players at a time. Dominant teams have 3+ superior talented players on their team. This team has potential but they will be hard pressed to be dominant with the talent they have now, even in the Big South. With our talent I would expect us to be preseason ranked in the middle of the pack at best.

In regard to Layer, I think he gets the most out of each player. They seem to work hard for him. The effort they make is far more than what I have seen from Dunton and McKay. We have bigs in place for a few years. We are a pure shooter away from being at the top of the BSC. The last decent shooting team was, dare I say, Seth Curry and Anthony Smith.

The sentence in bold is where I will debate, now all things consider if JB doesnt get hurt LU wins at least 20 last year, but, I think Jesse Sanders GOT the most out of his teammates.
It will be interesting to see who/how they do without him, who will lead, how they get easy baskets, etc. alot of questions that need to be answered. -- There again with Jesse in uniforn their effort LOOKED better... (anytime you have white players on a team regardless of the team, everyone gives them more credit for playing hard) Dunton, McKay kids played hard, they just made it look effortless. Go ahead and bash me....

[LUconn]

I think Jesse Sanders GOT the most out of his teammates.

That's an interesting thought. May very well be true, but I guess we can't know until the next couple seasons. The rest of your post has some truth but kind of goes too far. Some players do make it look easy and are unfairly labeled as lazy or they have no heart, but it's fairly obvious when a player has quit and is just going through the motions and we've seen it quite a bit in at least the last 12-14 years

[jbock13]

As far as Layer, I like him. But if we lose the first round of the conference tourney again, its time to start thinking.

[LU-Hoo]

As far as Layer, I like him. But if we lose the first round of the conference tourney again, its time to start thinking.

One trend I've noticed with Layer's teams... They always finish a season stronger than they start. The players and teams always seem to get better each season. From a coaching aspect, that's what you want to see. As the overall talent on the teams improve, you should see better results come tourney time. I'd like to see recruiting and retention improve.

[jcmanson]

As far as Layer, I like him. But if we lose the first round of the conference tourney again, its time to start thinking.

One trend I've noticed with Layer's teams... They always finish a season stronger than they start.

Except for 2 years ago...

[LU-Hoo]

Except for 2 years ago...

They ran out of gas at the very end of that season, IMO. Overall, the team did get better as the season progressed.

[TylerBakersGonnaBGreat]

Was JVP playing? He is coming off back surgery, so they may still have him shut down. He showed some real flashes last year when he wasn't in pain.

JVP wasnt playing and wasnt even there. In my opinion I dont think JVP should get a lot of minutes with what I have seen from him the last 3 years and what I see with the new guys we have. I would rather see those minutes go to Sommy, Tomaz, and Andrew Smith.

If that is what you would rather see, then you want to see soft post play. There is nothing wrong with it if you want them taking jump shots, but you arent getting any rebounds an no one is posting up. Our biggest issue the last few years is there hasnt been someone on the block getting the ball to open up the rest of the floor. At the middle/end of last year JVP and Antwan started to do that and we were really turning the corner. If that is your preference that is fine, but if they get the minutes, we have 0 post-play (although Im sure Sommy will make a play or 2).

[TylerBakersGonnaBGreat]

Not sure what the solution is...but Layer is running out of time IMO. It's incredible how far Barber set this program back. We went from national attention and tons of momentum to a dead program again.

FIFY

[truthorconsequences]

Not sure what the solution is...but Layer is running out of time IMO. It's incredible how far Barber set this program back. We went from national attention and tons of momentum to a dead program again.

FIFY

+100!