[Bigsouthking]

For all you guys that want a "big name" read this.

Greg Marshall a nobody before Winthrop. A charleston, Marshall assistant.
Bob McKillop catholic HS coach before Davidson
Brad Stevens a young asst and private business before Butler


Big name guys
Buzz Peterson, Jeff Lebo for instance have 1 NCAA appearance combined.

Big names don't always work.

[Purple Haize]

Can someone explain to me why this guy is still here...didnt Scorcho say something about dealing with him before BYD and manson took the reins?

Have you thought about
http://www.rxlist.com/ativan-drug.htm
Or
http://www.rxlist.com/xanax-drug.htm

[ATrain]

Can someone explain to me why this guy is still here...didnt Scorcho say something about dealing with him before BYD and manson took the reins?

Have you thought about
http://www.rxlist.com/ativan-drug.htm
Or
http://www.rxlist.com/xanax-drug.htm

Screw that...he should book a flight to Colorado or Washington State

[Lburglifer]

BJ, do I know you? What is your beef with my opinion? Are you in charge of the site?

[BJWilliams]

1) Probably not
2) Its been the same old song and dance ever since RD (Jeff Meyer for PH's sake) got canned...we know you hate JB and pretty much have made a point to continually rehash said song and dance in almost every basketball thread and its grown quite tiresome to have to deal with your bitterness in this particular section
3) I do not own the site

and for PH...I do not need Xanax or Ativan...or a doctor's referral for either

[SuperJon]

For all you guys that want a "big name" read this.
...
Big names don't always work.

I don't think most of us want a big name. I think a lot of us would love to try to find that assistant that would really build a program. What most people understand is that our AD goes for the name hire.

[Purple Haize]

1) Probably not
2) Its been the same old song and dance ever since RD (Jeff Meyer for PH's sake) got canned...we know you hate JB and pretty much have made a point to continually rehash said song and dance in almost every basketball thread and its grown quite tiresome to have to deal with your bitterness in this particular section
3) I do not own the site

and for PH...I do not need Xanax or Ativan...or a doctor's referral for either

Jeff Meyer

And that's debatable

[Lburglifer]

1) Probably not
2) Its been the same old song and dance ever since RD (Jeff Meyer for PH's sake) got canned...we know you hate JB and pretty much have made a point to continually rehash said song and dance in almost every basketball thread and its grown quite tiresome to have to deal with your bitterness in this particular section
3) I do not own the site

and for PH...I do not need Xanax or Ativan...or a doctor's referral for either

You are sadly mistaken. Hate/bitterness are you crazy. I simply agreed with VAGolf. You need to attend the games so you can see what we see.

[BJWilliams]

I have attended games...for many years...and the ones I havent been able to see in person since my move Ive watched online...

[Purple Haize]

BJ, everything is fine. I have no problem with lifer expressing his opinion. The fact that you don't like it doesn't mean we will be punishing him.

How dare you defy and not capitulate to the powerful BEEJ

[Purple Haize]

The beej is powerful...

His has no effect on but it's you mere mortals for whom I fear

[thepostman]

Lburglifer, the man who put that player out on the football field is no longer the coach here. I am not sure if you are aware of that.

That also has nothing to do with the basketball program. I am not going to bring up swimming when talking about soccer so why would you bring up football when talking about the basketball coach?

Makes zero sense

Your opinion on the lack of results with the basketball program for nearly its entire D1 existence is valid with a few exceptions here and there, but bringing up things that only serve the purpose to advance your hidden agenda is ridiculous.

BSking, where are you getting the idea from that most on here want a "name" coach? From what I have read it is quite the opposite.

[BJWilliams]

Lburglifer, the man who put that player out on the football field is no longer the coach here. I am not sure if you are aware of that.

That also has nothing to do with the basketball program. I am not going to bring up swimming when talking about soccer so why would you bring up football when talking about the basketball coach?

Makes zero sense

Your opinion on the lack of results with the basketball program for nearly its entire D1 existence is valid with a few exceptions here and there, but bringing up things that only serve the purpose to advance your hidden agenda is ridiculous.

BSking, where are you getting the idea from that most on here want a "name" coach? From what I have read it is quite the opposite.

there is my problem with it...the fact that he has an opinion isnt my issue (or why he got banned so much)...its the bolded part

[VAGolf]

I haven't exactly been following Lifer, what exactly is his "hidden agenda?"

[thepostman]

We all know beej. Don't worry.

[JK37]

Lifer's mention of the football situation is valid, on the basis of the fact that those in administrative authority who expressly placed that decision in the hands of the coach, are both still here and going nowhere anytime soon. It was delicate, but it was also highly calculated. And even better now, because the coach is an even easier scapegoat now that he's gone. I poont this out simply to say that while I disagree with the overwhelming majority of what Lifer says, he can't be vilified for bringing this example to the fore.

Coach Layer was absolutely a name hire, as well as someone known well to program insiders to help calm the fury at the time of his hiring. He is a bigger name in coaching than many here would be capable of realizing.

Coach Layer is a great man of God, a fantastic character example to the men in the program and a good coach. All of coaching - at ALL levels - can be categorized in three areas: recruit them, teach them, motivate them. In that order.

My observation is Coach Layer is an excellent teacher and a good motivator. Let's keep him around for awhile.

[Lburglifer]

Who gives a rip about recruiting classes? You know who's had great recruiting classes in football for the past several years? UVA. Do you know what their record is for the past several years? Pathetic. I hate the "well, we've got a solid recruiting class!" argument.

And the practice facilities? As if we haven't had the best facilities in the conference for the past 5 years+. Recruiting classes and practice facilities aren't the problem.

I've been to the games, we have talent. Maybe not as much as a team like CSU or Radford but we have more talent than High Point and Longwood. The talent isn't great, but I don't think it's part of the problem. The culture surrounding our athletics is the whole problem. IMO, Jeff Barber and Dale Layer are the reasons behind the lack of success in basketball.

And let's stop with this, "He inherited a mess" crap. It's his 5th year here, the mess is gone. Also, his best two years here were his first two years. So, if he inherited a "mess," that was a much better "mess" than what we currently have.

VAGolf I simply agree with your statements about accountability over the program and seems that Mr BJ is the discerner of everyone's intent as well as qualifier for freedom to support your well stated opinion. I brought up the Asa situation because some are like isn't this about the mission. You think LU has a 20 million dollar baseball facility without a priority of winning and the MBB resources are there because most think Layer is a good guy. Let me look closer so I can speak with some facts not just observations from attending the games as well as listening to a few at work.

[thepostman]

What was the excuse before Jeff barber? I am not a huge barber fan. I never have been but our basketball program has never been able to sustain success except for maybe the Jeff Meyer years but even that didn't last long.

So why can't liberty basketball have sustained success? It is a question I can't answer.

[Sly Fox]

Comparing eras beyond the past ten years or so is tough. In the '80s, we had a bigger brand than today thanks to the Old Time Gospel Hour but we were primarily competing in DII and just making our way into DI status. In the '90s, we lost some of the cache from being in everyone's living rooms every Sunday but we finally had a true DI home in the Big South and had a nice run riding the Nigerian pipeline before the rest of the basketball world followed suit overseas. The past 14 years are really the apples to apples comparison IMHO.

Count me among those frustrated right now but willing to stand behind Coach Layer. There is no question that we need to recruit stronger to take the next step up. There is reason to believe this Class fo 2014 is a step in the right direction. More than any other sport, a couple of hits in a class (even with a few misses) can change your fortunes quickly in basketball.

[BJWilliams]

I think that is the $64,000,000 question postie...one that probably cant be answered by a single change, it would take something more holistic, and would require patience by all involved.

I do think that they could stand to look at additional recruiting hotbeds, like the 757. The VirginiaPreps.com Classic was last weekend in Virginia Beach. There was a kid from Bruton (his name escapes me) who would be a great pickup to finish out the class

[Purple Haize]

We have Braxton Bonds, who is being pumped up by pop but seems like a solid talent and Evan Maxwell who is at best a question mark bigger than the one on Riddlers plane and a project worthy of the DIY channel, but who else? No one of Burress dimensions. We still have at least 3 probably 4 players that are good but nowhere near D1 talent. What is there to tout in this upcoming recruiting class? Honestly asking

[SuperJon]

So why can't liberty basketball have sustained success? It is a question I can't answer.

The men's basketball culture and the Evangelical Christian culture clash. You've got to find kids like Jesse who really want to go the Christian route to have a chance. In football and baseball, the shear number on the roster, along with being a sport that wears helmets and hats, allows those "non-Liberty" kids to hide. On a team of 12 where you wear sleeve-less uniforms and are fully exposed, there's nowhere to hide those kids.

We all talk about how "bad" the Dunton-era players were in terms of being a fit with Liberty, but there are just as many, if not more, guys like them playing football/baseball that you never hear about. Anthony Smith getting his girlfriend pregnant was a scandal. The same year there were 2-3 football players that got their girlfriends pregnant that no one ever heard about. In basketball, you can't hide the non-Liberty kid like you can other sports.

[PAmedic]

finally somebody said it.

took 2 pages.

we had this discussion a couple years ago but I Can't find my post.

point being: IN GENERAL- the kids that are hoops stars are NOT interested in what we're selling. sorry. call me a @#$% but its true

[Sly Fox]

Part of that is the self-indulgent culture of summer ball. It fosters more of a sense of entitlement and less of an appreciation for everything that makes Liberty special.

Perhaps the most athletic kid in our Class of 2014 is over here in Texas ... AC Reid. He is close to Antwan's dimensions but more of a wing. I suspect Stavian Allen will be our athletic four in this class.

[SuperJon]

point being: IN GENERAL- the kids that are hoops stars are NOT interested in what we're selling. sorry. call me a @#$% but its true

Because they're not interested, that's why you have to do one of the three things I laid out in this post.