[D Edcil]

On a tac back to the topic................

The argument seems to be that to build a good team you need to have a good team. If you have a good team then BETTER players will come and make the team better.

In that light here is a question I have but don't know the answer too. How many players have been in RD's program for four years? Or how many have started and finished here? As I stated earlier, the tournament has shown us that teams that have been together for a few years at the mid major level can become "legit". My thoughts are that if we can get decent kids in here and improve them, then that should lay the foundation for our success. A pitiful example is football. When we had the ONE decent season under KK, you had a lot of linemen that had been around for awhile. Unfortunately he was not able to build on that success.

At any rate, that appears to be the route I would take to establishing LU's cred.

[LUconn]

^ Good info. That is definatly the way to build a solid program. The only problem is it takes a while but I really don't think there's a choice. It's gonna take time but nobody wants to admit that. Nobody in charge that is.

My plan: LCA = Oak Hill Part 2. funnel them right on up into LU's program. The only problem there is players are seldom at Oak Hill for more than 2 years if that.

[SuperJon]

The problem with doing that with LCA is you set yourself up for sanctions very easily. A coach can't talk to a player until his junior year (I think). With the school's being so close, you'd hafta watch out who talked to who, even if it's while they're eating out or something like that.

[LUconn]

Get old JFJr with his lawyering skills to set up some kind of system separates the 2 programs under NCAA regulations yet still encourages staying within THE program. I'm sure it could be done and since nobody cares about us they wouldn't make the rules more specific until one of the big boys did it. Like if ND set up a catholic prep school, they'd take notice of that.

[Brokeback Flamer]

Get old JFJr with his lawyering skills to set up some kind of system separates the 2 programs under NCAA regulations yet still encourages staying within THE program. I'm sure it could be done and since nobody cares about us they wouldn't make the rules more specific until one of the big boys did it. Like if ND set up a catholic prep school, they'd take notice of that.

Yeah that's the ticket. Cheat until you get caught. In the words of one of my prof's "If you are not cheating, you are not trying!!"

[Hold My Own]

guys you would be shocked how what yall are talking about already is taking place, the only reason we really don't see it is b/c LCA hasn't had any players with enough talent to even notice, but like it's been mentioned before, they are starting to get these players, heck they just brought in a kid that's 15 years old and is already 6 foot 7....Coach D doesn't have to do anything illegal b/c there are enough people with great respect (and knowing where their pay checks come from) for what LU has done that put in all the good words that are needed....Although it's fine for a Coach to start talking to a player after a certain grade and that's what we're seeing now with David over at LCA and Coach D....that kids a special player and unlike anything LCA has seen

[A.G.]

That is good to see, because, for the most part, in the past, the majority (not all, with appologies to Mr. Jennings) of the LCA TRANSFER athletes are those who had gotten cut or would not have gotten playing time at the area public high schools.

[D Edcil]

guys you would be shocked how what yall are talking about already is taking place, the only reason we really don't see it is b/c LCA hasn't had any players with enough talent to even notice, but like it's been mentioned before, they are starting to get these players, heck they just brought in a kid that's 15 years old and is already 6 foot 7....Coach D doesn't have to do anything illegal b/c there are enough people with great respect (and knowing where their pay checks come from) for what LU has done that put in all the good words that are needed....Although it's fine for a Coach to start talking to a player after a certain grade and that's what we're seeing now with David over at LCA and Coach D....that kids a special player and unlike anything LCA has seen

I think you make Brokeback's point. The problem most schools get into is in the realm of "friends of the program", which, according to your statement LCA has a lot of. One sidebar to this is the impact on the community. IF we want to reach out and make the campus more community friendly are we going to accomplish that by bringing "ringers" in for our athletic program? Area football schools are already steering their kids away from LU unless it is a last/only option b/c of the "recruiting" of area players. I do know we are getting some locals, but if we start doing this in all sports, and continue to play in our current conference, or keep trying to get into the VHSL, it will only make the problem worse. Now if we go into a "Prep" conference out of Richmond, NoVa or w/ Oak Hill that is different. Just my two cents

[LUconn]

Get old JFJr with his lawyering skills to set up some kind of system separates the 2 programs under NCAA regulations yet still encourages staying within THE program. I'm sure it could be done and since nobody cares about us they wouldn't make the rules more specific until one of the big boys did it. Like if ND set up a catholic prep school, they'd take notice of that.

Yeah that's the ticket. Cheat until you get caught. In the words of one of my prof's "If you are not cheating, you are not trying!!"

Oh stop. Nobody said anything about cheating. That's why I said get somebody with a lawyer's mentallity. Keep it well within the regulations, but get creative. Billy Donovan is looked at as being shady because he does what it takes to get recruits. Example, he stole a highly sought after recruit (I can't remember the name right now, because he wound up not being that good) right out of Kansas while old Roy was still there. Billy was at the kids house at 12:01am, the first day you're allowed to contact recruits. Roy came by that morning and was stunned that somebody had already been working the kid. Roy called foul play and the NCAA investigated but never found that Billy had done anything wrong. That's a simple example but just think what other tactics and methods could be used if you had someone who was familiar with NCAA compliance issues. It's not cheating until they change the rules.

[Hold My Own]

Yeah, where did you get cheating from what I said...let me say it again, LCA is full of people who love LU for different reasons, so they try to direct their kids to the school that they love....and your talking about area football, but I'd disagree I think the parents who want what's best for their kid in football send their kids to LCA b/c they can get the coaching of D1 coach's and then from there LU's football field is just a few feet away

[D Edcil]

LUCONN mentioned that if ND, not LU, set up a prep school the NCAA would take notice. To me that sounds like you already know what it is to be shaddy,and this would be it. I never said that it would be cheating, I just said it leaves the door WIDE OPEN for abuse. There are several good natured individual s that don't know the NCAA rules and would probably do and say something that would be against the rules. Not to mention the same thing about coaches etc. I am sure the NCAA would rule that as an "Unfair Advantage" and take strict measures. My thought is, why go through the bother? Why put yourself in a position that the NCAA can drop the hammer on you. BTW, LUCONN, don't you think there are people in Indy chomping at the bit to drop a hammer on JF? They did it to ORU, we would be no different. Besides history shows the NCAA usually goes after the little guys to make a point to the "big fella's". Sure you get a few big time hits, but that is usually AFTER the little guy doing the same thing has already been whacked.

[Sly Fox]

I think the contact issues could be rather easily managed. They are not as stringent as you might think in today's environment.

Would the clowns who moved from Overland Park to Indy jump on us if they had an opportunity? Absolutely yes. But building these types of cases is a real challenge unless it is self-reported.

[Hold My Own]

there are a ton of schools that already do this and the NCAA has a open invitation to check anything out, I think they know where they can reach JF or JFjr

[LUconn]

I dont think it's shady, but I do think it could be looked at as somewhat of a loophole. And I really don't see anything wrong with that. I used ND as an example because, it seems to me that in order for the NCAA to take action somebody has to whine and complain and if they did it, somebody definatly would. I hadnt thought about them wanting to slap us down, you could be right there. I just figured we were under their radar.

[Ed Dantes]

I know we've discussed how many high level christian athletes there are competing. I've also heard it said that if they all came to LU we could be a major player on the sports scene.

I put this thread here because I was watching the 700 club yesterday, and they were interviewing bball players at the Final Four who were christians. I was amazed at how many had a professed faith in Christ! It was awesome! There were a couple on each team, including Lee Humphrey of Florida.

I don't see why we can't lure these guys to LU. Why would they not want to come here? I understand not getting some of them if they can go win a national championship elsewhere, but for others who are at mid-majors such as George Mason, why can we not get them here? I think these athletes should be our#1 priority. Maybe they are, and we just haven't been able to get them in. I don't know.

Not to toot my own horn, but I was in Indy to produce that piece.

Glad you liked it. 'Preciate the viewers.

[Ed Dantes]

Reasons we don't get people:

Horrible conference

Not many athletes want to be forced to take GNED 101, GNED 102, two semesters of Theology, Old Testament, New Testament, Evangelism, and Creation Studies. That's 8 classes that they wouldn't have to take at a secular school.

The Liberty Channel is not great. The only time any student watches it is for a game.

There are tons of Christians out there that can't stand Jerry Falwell.

Lynchburg ain't the most exciting place in the world.

The Liberty Way

I could go on. There's no way the top athletes will come here on a regular basis.

By the same token, top students wouldn't want to come to Liberty because of the thigns you just listed. I mean, for those of us students who took Evangelism during the Danny Lovett years, we had questions on our test like this:

50.) Jesus is what:
A) The son of God
B) The risen savior
C) Awesome
D) All of the above.

I mean, c'mon! This is college, not Sunday School!

[LUconn]

haha, I hated that class.

[D Edcil]

Reasons we don't get people:

Horrible conference

Not many athletes want to be forced to take GNED 101, GNED 102, two semesters of Theology, Old Testament, New Testament, Evangelism, and Creation Studies. That's 8 classes that they wouldn't have to take at a secular school.

The Liberty Channel is not great. The only time any student watches it is for a game.

There are tons of Christians out there that can't stand Jerry Falwell.

Lynchburg ain't the most exciting place in the world.

The Liberty Way

I could go on. There's no way the top athletes will come here on a regular basis.

By the same token, top students wouldn't want to come to Liberty because of the thigns you just listed. I mean, for those of us students who took Evangelism during the Danny Lovett years, we had questions on our test like this:

50.) Jesus is what:
A) The son of God
B) The risen savior
C) Awesome
D) All of the above.

I mean, c'mon! This is college, not Sunday School!

Let me first say I love your sandwiches Ed. Much better then the rueben.

You may unknowingly be giving a good reason for "Top Tier" athletes to come to LU. If tests are THIS difficult, staying eligible should be a cinch. Which makes you wonder how are athletes become INeligible