Anything and everything about Liberty Flames football. Your comments on games, recruiting and the direction of the program as we move into new era.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke, Class of 20Something

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By Sly Fox
Registration Days Posts
#108149
We make our first roadie of the year this Saturday at 7pm in Williamsburg.

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The College of William & Mary
Williamsburg, Virginia

Official Football Site
CAA Zone W&M Forum
The Tribe Has Spoken - Kaplan Karzies' W&M Blog

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Jimmye Laycock
Head Football Coach

2006 Results: 3-8
CAA Preseason Poll: 6th in South Division


2007 Results:


8/30 - Delaware ........................... L 49-31
9/08 - @ VMI ................................ W 63-16

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#11 Jake Phillips
6' 3" 225 lb Junior Quarterback
Thru 2 Games: 39-of-56 for 675 Yards, 5 TDs & 0 INTs + 1 TD Rushing


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#86 Drew Atchison
6' 7" 245 lb Senior Tight End
Thru 2 Games: 7 Catches for 141 Yards with 2 TDs



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#25 Courtland Marriner
5' 9" 180 lb Redshirt Freshman Running Back
Thru 2 Games: 17 Carries for 128 Yards with 1 TD



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#8 DeBrian Holmes
5' 9" 185 lb Junior Running Back
Thru 2 Games: 26 Carries for 95 Yards with 3 TDs



YouTube Highlight of INT
#6 David Caldwell
5' 11" Sophomore Defensive Back
Thru 2 Games: 20 Tackles including 1.5 for Loss + 1 Pass Breakup + 1 Forced Fumble



Notes: The Tribe only posted three wins in a frustrating 2006 campaign. But one of those left a homecoming crowd at Williams Stadium with a severe case of heartburn. They have had QB issues in the past but Jake Phillips won the job right before the season opener and has been spectacular.


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Zable Stadium
Capacity: 12,259
Built in 1935
Last edited by Sly Fox on September 15th, 2007, 4:05 pm, edited 5 times in total.
By LUconn
Registration Days Posts
#108150
I'm pretty nervous about this game. I was pretty confident about it before the season began. Hopefully we can get a healthy dose of Rashad early to open up the passing game. Then we can truely evaluate the '07 Brock.
By Stevev
Registration Days Posts
#108151
I can't begin to tell everyone how important this one game is to LU this season. Our season, our pride, national and regional recognition, our playoffs are on the line this Saturday. We simply can not continue to loose to teams such as this if we are to take that next big step forward in the development of this program. If we loose this game it is going to be a serious uphill battle to reclaim whatever recognition we have received so far.
By Knucklehead
Registration Days Posts
#108152
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Nice resemblance with the coach and Luther (Jerry Van Dyke)
By LUconn
Registration Days Posts
#108153
Stevev wrote:I can't begin to tell everyone how important this one game is to LU this season. Our season, our pride, national and regional recognition, our playoffs are on the line this Saturday. We simply can not continue to loose to teams such as this if we are to take that next big step forward in the development of this program. If we loose this game it is going to be a serious uphill battle to reclaim whatever recognition we have received so far.
I think it's safe to say this is true for the rest of our games except for Toledo. But a win against a traditionally good team sure does look good on the surface.
By ALAFlamesFan
Registration Days Posts
#108154
Stevev wrote:I can't begin to tell everyone how important this one game is to LU this season. Our season, our pride, national and regional recognition, our playoffs are on the line this Saturday. We simply can not continue to loose to teams such as this if we are to take that next big step forward in the development of this program. If we loose this game it is going to be a serious uphill battle to reclaim whatever recognition we have received so far.
We are going to lose this game and it won't even be close unless we get far better play from our quarterback. This is about the best I-AA team on our schedule this year (yes our schedule is weak) so if we want any shot at the playoffs we have got to see Brock play like a second year starter and not a rookie. If not we need to take a good look at who will be our QB next year and start developing him because that will be all this season is good for after a W&M loss imo...
By SuperJon
Registration Days Posts
#108155
This game didn't bother me all, especially after the Delaware game. Then the way the put up numbers on VMI scared me. I know it's VMI, but still. In both games, they've put up over 400 yards passing. That part scares me. However, in both games, they've given up a lot of rushing yards. Against Delaware they gave up 281 yards on the ground and against VMI they gave up 249. I think with our backs, and our line, we should be in good shape running the ball. We just have to play good in the secondary.
By Knucklehead
Registration Days Posts
#108156
No question this is a huge game. It is a must win in MHO. The offense must improve as we will not be able to count on opponet miscues and big special teams plays as we have been able to with the 2 D2 teams. I think Rashad's presence will be huge, not only for what he brings but the change-up factor between he an zach. It will make Zach fresher when he comes in too. I also hope Eddie P is back to open some bigger holes for the run. If the run can be more consistent, the looks will come much easier for Brock in the passing game.
Last edited by Knucklehead on September 10th, 2007, 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
By SuperJon
Registration Days Posts
#108159
Everyone keeps saying Brock had a bad game. He didn't have a bad game. He was 65% passing (11-17). There were two dropped balls so he should've been 13-17. There was one ball that should've been picked but luckily it wasn't. The only other bad balls were the over throw to Luck and a swing pattern that was a touch overthrown. What do you want out of him? He's not a Tyler Thigpen type to go out and sling the ball all over the field. He got his job done. He was 65% with two touchdowns. Some of you guys need to chill on the criticism of him and actually pay attention to the game and the problems. The first game, yes, he had some very bad throws. This week he had a very solid game. No one said great, but Brock did what he was supposed to do on Saturday. Could he get better? Yes. However, a lot of the stuff on Saturday were things that weren't Brock's fault and you guys are simply throwing him under the bus without even watching the game.
By LUconn
Registration Days Posts
#108160
ALAFlamesFan wrote:
Stevev wrote:I can't begin to tell everyone how important this one game is to LU this season. Our season, our pride, national and regional recognition, our playoffs are on the line this Saturday. We simply can not continue to loose to teams such as this if we are to take that next big step forward in the development of this program. If we loose this game it is going to be a serious uphill battle to reclaim whatever recognition we have received so far.
We are going to lose this game and it won't even be close unless we get far better play from our quarterback. This is about the best I-AA team on our schedule this year (yes our schedule is weak) so if we want any shot at the playoffs we have got to see Brock play like a second year starter and not a rookie. If not we need to take a good look at who will be our QB next year and start developing him because that will be all this season is good for after a W&M loss imo...
let's not go crazy. Sure a loss means no playoffs. But there's still the BSC which we've never won. We've got to do that eventually, so might as well do it now. As for the pass defense, I'm pretty excited about it against W&M. Redd is a one man pass rush. I can't imagine their QB being able to consistantly get enough time to get the throw he wants.
By Knucklehead
Registration Days Posts
#108163
SuperJon wrote:Everyone keeps saying Brock had a bad game. He didn't have a bad game. He was 65% passing (11-17). There were two dropped balls so he should've been 13-17. There was one ball that should've been picked but luckily it wasn't. The only other bad balls were the over throw to Luck and a swing pattern that was a touch overthrown. What do you want out of him? He's not a Tyler Thigpen type to go out and sling the ball all over the field. He got his job done. He was 65% with two touchdowns. Some of you guys need to chill on the criticism of him and actually pay attention to the game and the problems. The first game, yes, he had some very bad throws. This week he had a very solid game. No one said great, but Brock did what he was supposed to do on Saturday. Could he get better? Yes. However, a lot of the stuff on Saturday were things that weren't Brock's fault and you guys are simply throwing him under the bus without even watching the game.
I actually thought he looked much sharper and much more settled in the pocket. I do think he will be asked to throw more this week, and I hope he does well.
By SuperJon
Registration Days Posts
#108164
The people throwing Brock under the bus don't look at how much better his decision making has gotten. He scrambled and got us a first down once instead of forcing a pass. He threw one ball away. He took a sack instead of throwing a ball up for grabs. I notice it's the people who can't watch the games who throw him under the bus more than the ones who actually watch them.
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By thepostman
Registration Days Posts
#108165
This game should be a win...I had said in my predictions before the season started that we would lose this game...not because I think we should lose this game...but for some reason William and Mary scares me and they seem to have our number....I don't think enough can be said when a team has another teams number...

with that said, this is a must win game...and we have a great shot at winning it...its our first real test of the season, and I am looking forward to seeing how we do against decent I-AA competition
By Stevev
Registration Days Posts
#108182
William and Mary is descent but certainly not great by any means. They have been great in the past but that was 3 years ago. The competition in the Big South conference would tend to make them appear better than what they really are which ain't much. I would not want to think that we are as bad as VMI (God forbid) so comparisons are not really legitimate. In my opinion W & M is a "below par" Colonial conference team and that is a fact.
By FlamingChick
Registration Days Posts
#108183
SuperJon wrote:The people throwing Brock under the bus don't look at how much better his decision making has gotten. He scrambled and got us a first down once instead of forcing a pass. He threw one ball away. He took a sack instead of throwing a ball up for grabs. I notice it's the people who can't watch the games who throw him under the bus more than the ones who actually watch them.

SJ- I don't think that folks are intentionally "throwing Brock under the bus" (well, maybe a little..). YES, Brock looked MUCH better than he did last week against Tusculum. Agreeing with your statement above, I too noticed that Brock's decision making was a lot better this game and he didnt force the pass as much, and didnt overthrow as many receivers. I think the main frustration everyone has (from what I hear from folk's statements regarding last years' season...) is the fact that Brock is inconsistent on the field. We heard a lot of positive reports coming out of training camp regarding Brock's improvements, so maybe some people set their expections a little too high and expected one of the Manning brothers to show up in an LU uniform last Saturday night--and are now back to reality?? Even Coach Rocco has expressed his disappointment in his press conferences, so it doesnt sound like Brock is performing as well as he expected either?... Like you said, yes he's better than last week, BUT can you honestly say that Brock's performance these first two weeks has been what you expect from your junior starting QB, who is entering his second year as a starter, and also saw playing time as a true Freshman? I think people would be a lot easier on him if this were his first year starting, and he didnt already have a full season of experience under his belt. That being said, I do hope that Brock continues to show improvement this week against W&M b/c we definitely need the WIN to make a statement and to earn a little more RESPECT.
By FlamingChick
Registration Days Posts
#108186
Stevev wrote:William and Mary is descent but certainly not great by any means. They have been great in the past but that was 3 years ago. The competition in the Big South conference would tend to make them appear better than what they really are which ain't much. I would not want to think that we are as bad as VMI (God forbid) so comparisons are not really legitimate. In my opinion W & M is a "below par" Colonial conference team and that is a fact.
I still cant believe they let Cuff (Delaware) score 7 Touchdowns on them!!!! Sounds like they have a hard time stopping the run? Their QB seems to be having a pretty good season so far though. I'm looking forward to the game :D
By TIMSCAR20
Registration Days Posts
#108187
I have heard or attended the press conferences and I try to read everything Chris Lang writes and what I am hearing is not just criticism of Brock by coach Rocco but by the entire offense in general. I agree that Brock was much sharper on Saturday and his numbers are decent. The problem has been the fact that the offense has not had a drive longer than 7 plays for 2 straight weeks. With a line and backs like we have you would think otherwise. I hope we can get that ball possession portion of our game going next week. We don't turn it over though and that is really key in football from what they tell me. Just ask my Eagles. :cry:
By Stevev
Registration Days Posts
#108188
I am not going to say that Brock is doing a poor job up until this point. He looked much better the last game than he did in the first and we should give him credit for that. This week we are going to see the real Brock Smith against legitimate competition and then we can start judging him.
By Stevev
Registration Days Posts
#108189
I still cant believe they let Cuff (Delaware) score 7 Touchdowns on them!!!! Sounds like they have a hard time stopping the run? Their QB seems to be having a pretty good season so far though. I'm looking forward to the game

Hey if Omar Cuff can light these guys up so can Rashaad Jennings and Zach Terrell. That is how I see it. I don't think that we will give up 400 yards passing. Not with our improvements in the secondary and Vince Redd. We are not VMI you know.
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By Fumblerooskies
Registration Days Posts
#108191
Will the game be televised anywhere?
By ALAFlamesFan
Registration Days Posts
#108192
SuperJon wrote:Everyone keeps saying Brock had a bad game. He didn't have a bad game. He was 65% passing (11-17). There were two dropped balls so he should've been 13-17. There was one ball that should've been picked but luckily it wasn't. The only other bad balls were the over throw to Luck and a swing pattern that was a touch overthrown. What do you want out of him? He's not a Tyler Thigpen type to go out and sling the ball all over the field. He got his job done. He was 65% with two touchdowns. Some of you guys need to chill on the criticism of him and actually pay attention to the game and the problems. The first game, yes, he had some very bad throws. This week he had a very solid game. No one said great, but Brock did what he was supposed to do on Saturday. Could he get better? Yes. However, a lot of the stuff on Saturday were things that weren't Brock's fault and you guys are simply throwing him under the bus without even watching the game.
Granted, I can only listen to the games and I am not throwing him under the bus so much as trying to temper some of the expectations. We had inconsistant QB play last year that kept us from being a better team. It was understandable considering we had a sophomore QB. Now here we are a year later and the same thing is showing up again. Over thrown receivers, missed communication,etc... and this is against DII competition. If you are in your second year and you are still figuring out what game speed is we have a problem. You may be right and we look better in person than we sound on the radio but here are a few quotes from the News and Advance that sound like maybe someone else saw what I am hearing.

Look there are many serviceable QB's out there. They do a good job running the offense and lead their teams to respectable records but most championship level teams (with the exception of the Chicago Bears last year) have great QB play. All I am saying is to get where we want to go you cannot be satisfied with average QB play. Not from a second year starter. And yes winning the Big South is a start but PLEASE that is not a very lofty goal, the BS is aweful this year. I may have my sights set too high but winning the BS is too low a goal. Playoffs is the starting point, winning a playoff game would be my measure of a successful season this year. Winning one or two year in and year out means we have arrived and can start talking moving up a division. No excuses...now is the time to take our big step forward! Lets all expect our leader, our QB to raise his game and lead by example. Until we find one who will we will have to be content with winning DII games and a few against the Prebyterians and Elons of the world. UGH!

From Chris Lang's "Despite Lopsided win, LU coach see's room for improvement.
Sure, Brock Smith completed a beautiful 50-yard pass to Dominic Bolden with Tusculum's Adrian Samples bowling into him at full speed. But he also showed some of the inconsistency that plagued him last year, overthrowing receivers time after time.

For us to go out there and have the kind of season we're wanting to have and expecting to have, we're going to have to play a lot better than that," Rocco said. "Offensively, we were inconsistent. Some of the things that reared their ugly head last year kind of showed up here again tonight. That was disappointing."

Smith completed 13 of 25 passes for 145 yards and threw one interception, a low ball that Tusculum's James Knight batted at the line of scrimmage and came down with.

"I think the thing me and the receivers need to realize is that when we get in a game situation, everything is going to be a step faster," Smith said. "The ball is going to be coming quicker. That's something we have to work on. Overall, it was average. We could have done much better."


From Chris Lang's article "LU posts dominating, but misleading victory"
But overall, the passing game again received a "just average" grade from the coaching staff. Smith completed 11 of 17 passes for 170 yards, with 65 coming on that one play. Receivers Brandon Turner (four receptions, nine yards) and Dominic Bolden (one catch, 12 yards), and tight end Chris Luck (one catch, seven yards) barely registered in the offense.

"I don't know how well I can define my frustration," Rocco said. "It's a combination of things. There were a couple of plays where we didn't have sound protection. There were a couple of plays where I didn't feel like routes were run at the proper depth or with the proper precision in which they needed to be run. And Brock was inconsistent."
By SuperJon
Registration Days Posts
#108193
What is the most important position on the field, next to quarterback?

Answer: the tackle on the QB's blind side.


Who plays tackle of Brock Smith's blind side?

Answer: Eddie Pinigis.



Anyone else see the correlation here? It's not that hard to figure out.


To put this in terms of the NFL so that maybe some of you people can understand it: All off season the biggest question for the Colts was "how will Peyton Manning do with a new tackle on his blind side?" Anyone else here played OL before or QB before? Anyone else have any clue how important it is to know that the guy protecting your back is out there and that you can trust him? You practice with a guy for over a year, you trust him back there, and then, right before the first game, you're forced to try and trust a new guy. The backup is good, don't get me wrong. He was supposed to start before Eddie transferred. However, he's not Eddie Pinigis.

As for the question by FlamingChick, did Brock do what I expected? Yes. Brock did everything I expected of him on Saturday night. We're not going to throw the ball around against Shippensburg. He completely the passes that he needed to. We're really complaining about a QB who completed 65% of his passes and threw two touchdowns? Maybe everyone else in the league is right when saying our fans have unrealistic expectations.
By SuperJon
Registration Days Posts
#108194
Dude, you're not making a separation between game one and game two. You keep saying "overthrown receivers and missed communication." That was the first game. There was a significant increase in the play of the quarterback between the first game and the second game. No one has said it was great. However, you guys are acting like he was complete horse crap when he wasn't. Wait til we get all of our weapons. Wait til we can put Rashad in the backfield and split Zach out wide and have the threat of both of them in the game. We couldn't do that the past two games. Do you realize how much of a threat the two of them on the field at the same time is?
By Knucklehead
Registration Days Posts
#108199
I agree that some are being WAY too harsh!
However, I do agree that the inability to sustain long drives is not good at all. In both games most the offensive scores have come on long strikes. While these are awesome to watch, they can't be counted on regularly. Also the lack of #s to anyone but Wynton is concerning. Someone is going to have a great corner, and we'll be in trouble. That being said, I still say Rashad and Eddie's presence will be huge if both are back.

SJ you are going against your own stated philosophy though. You told us to listen to and trust the coach. If he is concerned, shouldn't we be? :P
By Stevev
Registration Days Posts
#108200
Look there are many serviceable QB's out there. They do a good job running the offense and lead their teams to respectable records but most championship level teams (with the exception of the Chicago Bears last year) have great QB play. All I am saying is to get where we want to go you cannot be satisfied with average QB play. Not from a second year starter. And yes winning the Big South is a start but PLEASE that is not a very lofty goal, the BS is aweful this year. I may have my sights set too high but winning the BS is too low a goal. Playoffs is the starting point, winning a playoff game would be my measure of a successful season this year. Winning one or two year in and year out means we have arrived and can start talking moving up a division. No excuses...now is the time to take our big step forward! Lets all expect our leader, our QB to raise his game and lead by example. Until we find one who will we will have to be content with winning DII games and a few against the Prebyterians and Elons of the world. UGH!

I would hope that more than just winning the Big South conference would be the football teams goal this year. Jerry Edwards stated that and a possible run at a playoff birth and a national title would be the goals but then must contend with App State to get that done. I don't think that your expectations are unrealistic but in line with those associated with the program. You are right about the Big South this year. It is horrible to say the least. Coastal and Chuck South are way down from last year and their ain't much taking up the slack. Unless that would be LU.
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