Anything and everything about Liberty Flames football. Your comments on games, recruiting and the direction of the program as we move into new era.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke, Class of 20Something

Where does the game against Syracuse Rank in importance in program history?

Top 5
7
27%
Between 6-10
10
38%
Between 11-25
2
8%
It's just another game
7
27%
User avatar
By Kricket
Registration Days Posts
#632134
I've been thinking about this game's importance for the past few weeks. There's a lot on the line.

Publicity: If we win, it'll be a coveted P5 win on TV on a Friday night.

Ranking: We probably get ranked afterwards as we are on the cusp of being ranked already.

Malik's Draft stock: We aren't going to have too many players hyped as a potential top 10 pick. This is huge for Malik and the program. This game is probably top 2 in importance this year for his draft stock.

Conference realignment: We're right in the thick of the AAC trying to add schools to their conference. We have been on the outside looking in. Does a huge win here get us closer to the inside of the conversation?

I'm sure there are a trillion other reasons that add to the importance. What do you guys think? Where does this game rank in importance so far in program history?
jmclaughlin, Just John liked this
#632137
Not in order but

ODU 2019 - First FBS Win
VT 2020 - Obvious in state program win
Cure Bowl 2020 - #BeatCoastal and showed the world we can ball with the best.
JMU 2014 - Finally a post season win
Baylor 2017 - First win against P5

Sure the stakes are higher, but it would likely have to unseat one of those from the top 5.
Kricket liked this
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#632141
Our FBS era is still so fresh that any of these major conference games is a big deal, but this isn’t a make-or-break game for our season. Plus, we’ve already beaten the Orange, so it’s not like we’d be making any kind of history.

I agree with @flamehunter, if we win it’s a top-10 win (for now), but I don’t see the game itself as all that crucial. In a couple of years it’ll be forgotten. We’ll be playing and beating teams as good or better than Cuse several times a year.
Kricket, ballcoach15 liked this
By willflop
Posts
#632144
If we use the analogy of LU climbing a ladder, the higher one goes up the ladder the more important each rung is and the more there is to lose if it breaks. We gained a little by beating ODU in 2018, but we wouldn’t have fallen far, either, if we lost. It was a fun and important game to fans, but it was not a program trajectory catapult either way. So, I agree with Kricket’s points on this. Because of what we have to lose, if we do lose, all those other wins pale in comparison. In my mind, I classify some of our big wins more as milestones vs. truly the “most important wins.” Our subsequent loss to Saint Francis, among other loses, in 2017 really unraveled the meaning of the Baylor win for me. Thankfully, our big wins in 2020 were part of a consistent winning pattern and not just a fluke, so I don’t think a single loss on Friday will take away from that. But, given our current trajectory, we have to win the games we could/should win to keep the chains moving. Hopefully Ole Miss beats Alabama. We may slide down a rung with a loss to them, but it seems like we may fall of the entire ladder with a loss to Syracuse.

I also agree it's not a make or break for our season if we lose, depending on what that means. We are still a good program and will have a good record, potentially. But, if we think in terms of the press Malik gets and our ability to get ranked, it is a make it or break it. A loss to SU bumps us way down. Then, by time we may be on the cusp of getting into the top 25 with an 8-1 record, a loss to Ole Miss will finish those hopes for the rest of the season.
Kricket, Liberty22, jmclaughlin and 1 others liked this
User avatar
By Kricket
Registration Days Posts
#632167
Class of 20Something wrote: September 22nd, 2021, 7:51 am Not in order but

ODU 2019 - First FBS Win
VT 2020 - Obvious in state program win
Cure Bowl 2020 - #BeatCoastal and showed the world we can ball with the best.
JMU 2014 - Finally a post season win
Baylor 2017 - First win against P5

Sure the stakes are higher, but it would likely have to unseat one of those from the top 5.
This is really close to my top 5. Those are definitely historic for us, but I'm not sure all of them really propelled us like beating Syracuse could. Perhaps we're looking at it from two different perspectives.
User avatar
By Kricket
Registration Days Posts
#632168
willflop wrote: September 22nd, 2021, 8:46 am If we use the analogy of LU climbing a ladder, the higher one goes up the ladder the more important each rung is and the more there is to lose if it breaks. We gained a little by beating ODU in 2018, but we wouldn’t have fallen far, either, if we lost. It was a fun and important game to fans, but it was not a program trajectory catapult either way. So, I agree with Kricket’s points on this. Because of what we have to lose, if we do lose, all those other wins pale in comparison. In my mind, I classify some of our big wins more as milestones vs. truly the “most important wins.” Our subsequent loss to Saint Francis, among other loses, in 2017 really unraveled the meaning of the Baylor win for me. Thankfully, our big wins in 2020 were part of a consistent winning pattern and not just a fluke, so I don’t think a single loss on Friday will take away from that. But, given our current trajectory, we have to win the games we could/should win to keep the chains moving. Hopefully Ole Miss beats Alabama. We may slide down a rung with a loss to them, but it seems like we may fall of the entire ladder with a loss to Syracuse.

I also agree it's not a make or break for our season if we lose, depending on what that means. We are still a good program and will have a good record, potentially. But, if we think in terms of the press Malik gets and our ability to get ranked, it is a make it or break it. A loss to SU bumps us way down. Then, by time we may be on the cusp of getting into the top 25 with an 8-1 record, a loss to Ole Miss will finish those hopes for the rest of the season.
You said it much better than I could. There's a difference between a milestone win, and one that really is pivotal for trajectory.

We all thought JMU was huge at the time we won. The sad reality is, nobody nationally noticed or cared. Friday, we will have many many more eyes watching us than the JMU game. It could impact our conference affiliation, a first round pick, and a ranking. That's huge. So I think I'm looking at it through different glasses than most are.
User avatar
By Liberty22
Registration Days Posts
#632169
It’s certainly super important for this season and all the coverage coming for MW and top 25 if we win. If we lose we probably don’t get back into top 25 discussion again unless we’re 8-1 and upset Ole Miss. So to me the importance for exposure sake with all that’s on the line for MW and top 25 it’s crucial for this season but also crucial for MW Heisman chances. We probably need to go undefeated for him to have a chance at beating out Corral. The exposure of all these things is certainly program changing. So I could certainly argue the importance of all this.

Side note: the JMU playoff game doesn’t make my top 5 anymore. Feels like none of that matters now that we’re FBS.
Kricket liked this
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By Kricket
Registration Days Posts
#632170
Liberty22 wrote: September 22nd, 2021, 5:39 pm Side note: the JMU playoff game doesn’t make my top 5 anymore. Feels like none of that matters now that we’re FBS.
I'm strangely with you on that. It was #1 on my list when it happened. It seems insignificant to me at this point with all the other stuff going on currently. I'd put our first bowl game ahead of that by far.
Liberty22 liked this
By Rubicon
Posts
#632184
I didn't vote in the poll, but I think timing and luck are important. If Liberty could have a special season this year (no pressure), that could just be striking while the iron is hot and catch lightning in a bottle. Cincinnati hasn't had sustained success, but on the strength of basically last year (I think they ended up #21 in 2019), boom --- they are invited to the Big12.

Sooooo . . . taking care of business and pulling some upsets just might position them in this era of realignment upheaval --- despite bigotry and dislike. It doesn't hurt that Liberty has vast resources, especially if excitement for big things builds.
Liberty22, LUOrange liked this
User avatar
By JCS Flames Fan 31
Posts
#632213
Kricket wrote: September 22nd, 2021, 5:38 pm
willflop wrote: September 22nd, 2021, 8:46 am If we use the analogy of LU climbing a ladder, the higher one goes up the ladder the more important each rung is and the more there is to lose if it breaks. We gained a little by beating ODU in 2018, but we wouldn’t have fallen far, either, if we lost. It was a fun and important game to fans, but it was not a program trajectory catapult either way. So, I agree with Kricket’s points on this. Because of what we have to lose, if we do lose, all those other wins pale in comparison. In my mind, I classify some of our big wins more as milestones vs. truly the “most important wins.” Our subsequent loss to Saint Francis, among other loses, in 2017 really unraveled the meaning of the Baylor win for me. Thankfully, our big wins in 2020 were part of a consistent winning pattern and not just a fluke, so I don’t think a single loss on Friday will take away from that. But, given our current trajectory, we have to win the games we could/should win to keep the chains moving. Hopefully Ole Miss beats Alabama. We may slide down a rung with a loss to them, but it seems like we may fall of the entire ladder with a loss to Syracuse.

I also agree it's not a make or break for our season if we lose, depending on what that means. We are still a good program and will have a good record, potentially. But, if we think in terms of the press Malik gets and our ability to get ranked, it is a make it or break it. A loss to SU bumps us way down. Then, by time we may be on the cusp of getting into the top 25 with an 8-1 record, a loss to Ole Miss will finish those hopes for the rest of the season.
You said it much better than I could. There's a difference between a milestone win, and one that really is pivotal for trajectory.

We all thought JMU was huge at the time we won. The sad reality is, nobody nationally noticed or cared. Friday, we will have many many more eyes watching us than the JMU game. It could impact our conference affiliation, a first round pick, and a ranking. That's huge. So I think I'm looking at it through different glasses than most are.
I agree that this game is a very important one for us, I believe mainly for the continued Malik exposure that you both noted. Obviously it helps the entire program and recruiting across the board for us to win a Nationally Televised game on a Friday night. The higher Malik's stock can go throughout this season can not be overstated. I really hope that Malik can have the same kind of effect for LU that Robbie Bosco & Steve Young had for BYU. I understand that is asking a lot and that Bosco won a National Title with BYU and Steve Young, well he's Steve Young doesn't need much explaining. He and HCHF have that kind of potential to take the LU brand to places few outside of Dr. Falwell thought possible. IMO every game from here on out this season is really important, because they're all chances for Malik to showcase his truly special talent to next level decision makers. With us being thrown around in realignment rumors and everything else winning against P5 squads is always going to be very important; so all that to say yea this game is an important one! :football 8)
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By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#632219
LU is favored. For it to be a good-great season, gotta win the games you’re supposed to win. This is a game LU should win. (Can’t believe I’m saying that.)

So that said, this is a game important to this season. I don’t think it’s importance as one game goes much beyond that.
User avatar
By LUOrange
Posts
#632337
Since we lost, we need Syracuse to keep winning. It'll help us some if they get Bowl eligible and be a middle of the pack P5 rather than one of the worst P5's that they've been the last couple of years.
User avatar
By rmiller1959
Posts
#632340
ESPN said it best:

"Liberty: The Flames were on the cusp of breaking into the AP Top 25 and missed out on a chance at a big win. The Flames could have notched a key win over a Power 5 conference opponent. The Flames have just one more game against a Power 5 conference team left on their schedule. Liberty will play at Ole Miss on Nov. 6."
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#632344
Beating Ole Miss remains the top target on our schedule. That game is significant is on so many levels. Perhaps, the SU loss will light a fire under this team, and we keep it burning into a marquee match-up in Oxford Miss.
ballcoach15 liked this
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#632383
This particular game against Syracuse wasn't nationally televised though. It was in ACC region only. I guess, Florida to Maryland and a remote blotch of western upstate NY. Not bad exposure, but far from national.

Who we draw this season bowl-wise should be interesting. We are fun to watch. Big time pass game. Our o-line is tragic though. Sad to say, it's holding us back.
By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#632392
paradox wrote: September 26th, 2021, 9:49 am This particular game against Syracuse wasn't nationally televised though. It was in ACC region only. I guess, Florida to Maryland and a remote blotch of western upstate NY. Not bad exposure, but far from national.

Who we draw this season bowl-wise should be interesting. We are fun to watch. Big time pass game. Our o-line is tragic though. Sad to say, it's holding us back.
This is simply not correct. It was shown on the ACC Network. Which is a national network, but is not carried nationally by some carriers. That said, there was no other ACCN programming shown at that time. So for anyone in the NATION watching ACCN, they were watching Syracuse beat LU.
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#632397
That's a very broad definition of nationally televised, when most don't have it. UVA & Wake were on ESPN that night. Insignificant ACC game, but probably wider audience than our game.

I'm anticipating some better exposure later in the season, especially if we're winning. Malik is special.
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#632398
Kricket wrote: September 26th, 2021, 11:13 am I live in Wisconsin and I watched it on the ACC network and I know 3 others who had it on in their houses up here.
I see what you're saying, but you're still going to need some kind of package for that. I'm on the east coast and I have the Pac-12 in my package.
By willflop
Posts
#632399
Don't you need a package for any cable/cord-cutter service network? Even ESPN falls in that category, but I think that's national unless we limit it to abc/nbc/fox/cbs. Last year it was truly regional because it was carried on accn rsn, and we had blackouts.
By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#632403
paradox wrote: September 26th, 2021, 11:55 am That's a very broad definition of nationally televised, when most don't have it. UVA & Wake were on ESPN that night. Insignificant ACC game, but probably wider audience than our game.

I'm anticipating some better exposure later in the season, especially if we're winning. Malik is special.
Agreed to all, except you can’t say “most don’t get it” anymore.

“ In the ACC Network's first athletic year, ESPN successfully negotiated the network's carriage to 70 million households on all major cable and satellite TV providers, with the sole exception of Comcast.The holdout, Comcast, which provides cable television to 19 million households as of Q3 2020, claimed in September 2019 that ESPN was not allowing them to carry the network at a ‘fair and reasonable cost’ to their customers. ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips has said that the network will likely reach a carriage agreement with Comcast by September 2021.”

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACC_Network
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