[JK37]

Searching the history books for when we’ve ever had as many conferences and conference members as today. Still searching…

[ballcoach15]

Most conferences have become too big. This creates unbalanced schedules.

The only way we'll ever register on the playoff radar screen is go undefeated, regardless of schedule.

[LUOrange]

Why else would I have mentioned it?

I’m supporting your claim. Making sure those who’d prefer LU stay Independent understand

Searching the history books for any team that could not fill a full schedule or who had to fold their team as an Independent. Haven’t found one so far. If we weren’t going to maximize being an Independent, might as well join CUSA. Just please never bring up “fulfilling the vision” at this level. If Ian elects to only play 1 P5 a year as a CUSA member, I have no problem with that and think it is prudent IF he feels that is best chance to make a Playoff as a G5 ( if that ever comes through ).

I'm kinda at the point of thinking- if the CFP isn't expanded with a G5 auto-bid, maybe we ought to back out of CUSA. I know much of that thinking is due to my frustration with not wanting to try and play 2 P5's a year. And again, I also know the necessary benefits CUSA provides for all of our other teams and a lot also depends on what McCaw knew and believed at the time he made the decision. But this is where I'd love a good explanation and rationale from McCaw for his decision.

[LUOrange]

Most conferences have become too big. This creates unbalanced schedules.

The only way we'll ever register on the playoff radar screen is go undefeated, regardless of schedule.

In my ideal NCAA world, these conferences will start to shrink down and re-organize regionally and with a conference cap of 12. I'd also maybe include provisions schools have to be in the region appropriate conference, ie., Notre Dame must join nd us, UMass, UConn, etc. can't be excluded. Kinda like how most state's high school leagues work.

[Ill flame]

G5 NY6 bowl bid is still on the table if the cfp doesn't end up expanding. It's not a cfp appearance but it would be massive for this program and wasn't very realistic for us as an independent. The cfp expansion seems inevitable at this point, it's just a matter of how much it expands and when.

[LUOrange]

G5 NY6 bowl bid is still on the table if the cfp doesn't end up expanding. It's not a cfp appearance but it would be massive for this program and wasn't very realistic for us as an independent. The cfp expansion seems inevitable at this point, it's just a matter of how much it expands and when.

Yeah, I overlooked the NY6 bid in my frustration. Last I heard, CFP expansion had hit an impasse. I hope I'm wrong, as I think CFB needs it as much as the G5 needs it.

[tyndal23]

CUSA is what it is in football. Only upside is a Conference Championship that no one outside CUSA gives a crap about or even notices.. After vacillating between 1 P5 a year vs more in a weak G5 Conference, I prefer the hardest G5 non con schedule over “more wins” - long term, I prefer 3 P5 games over 1 and here is why. Only G5 Kent State
averages 3 or more P5 games a year over next 5 years in G5. They do it for cash. We would do it for recruiting. I think a P5 transfer or stud HS recruit wanting to go pro needs to at least say he played x number of P5 games in a year. Factor in the current staff, facilities, mission etc., being able to say we play more P5 teams than any other G5, AND have a chance for Conference Championship outweighs winning % for recruits. I know geography has its appeal with VA and Carolina, but would pursue BC,TCU,Baylor,WF for the private religious long term series “potential rivalries”. I defer to the ACC 2 off years of a school not playing ND for series with BC and WF and 2 for 1 with TCU/Baylor ( or maybe just a long term 1 off alternating years - benefit to LU is we play in TX annually ) BYU series is only viable at a neutral field now that they are officially P5 due to geography. BC and WF we would pay them an incentive for 1 for 1.

[tyndal23]

CUSA is what it is in football. Only upside is a Conference Championship that no one outside CUSA gives a crap about or even notices.. After vacillating between 1 P5 a year vs more in a weak G5 Conference, I prefer the hardest G5 non con schedule over “more wins” - long term, I prefer 3 P5 games over 1 and here is why. Only G5 Kent State
averages 3 or more P5 games a year over next 5 years in G5. They do it for cash. We would do it for recruiting. I think a P5 transfer or stud HS recruit wanting to go pro needs to at least say he played x number of P5 games in a year. Factor in the current staff, facilities, mission etc., being able to say we play more P5 teams than any other G5, AND have a chance for Conference Championship outweighs winning % for recruits. I know geography has its appeal with VA and Carolina, but would pursue BC,TCU,Baylor,WF for the private religious long term series “potential rivalries”. I defer to the ACC 2 off years of a school not playing ND for series with BC and WF and 2 for 1 with TCU/Baylor ( or maybe just a long term 1 off alternating years - benefit to LU is we play in TX annually ) BYU series is only viable at a neutral field now that they are officially P5 due to geography. BC and WF we would pay them an incentive for 1 for 1.

Update
BC - pretty wide open even with ND scheduled - 2026 and beyond.
https://fbschedules.com/ncaa/boston-college/

WF has an opening 27 and beyond
https://fbschedules.com/ncaa/wake-forest/

Baylor - openings
https://fbschedules.com/ncaa/baylor/

TCU - openings
https://fbschedules.com/ncaa/tcu/

[JK37]

I like it. I don’t think we get the games we want on the schedule at the snap of a finger. But if we do, we better win some of those games. Because if we go 0-3 a couple of times vs. P5’s. It’ll get used against us in recruiting far more than we can use it for our favor in recruiting.

Then if we win a few, and I hope we do, it’s going to get much tougher to schedule the mid- and low-tier P5’s that you’re targeting.

Note: BC doesn’t like us very much. That one may be tough, but I like the others.

[tyndal23]

I like it. I don’t think we get the games we want on the schedule at the snap of a finger. But if we do, we better win some of those games. Because if we go 0-3 a couple of times vs. P5’s. It’ll get used against us in recruiting far more than we can use it for our favor in recruiting.

Then if we win a few, and I hope we do, it’s going to get much tougher to schedule the mid- and low-tier P5’s that you’re targeting.

Note: BC doesn’t like us very much. That one may be tough, but I like the others.

Didn’t know that. BC always made sense to me but in reality does the least for us in Recruiting area.

[LUOrange]

I like 2 P5's plus CUSA, merely because we shouldn't give up home games and we should play regional and brand name G5's. But I'm all for 3 P5's if we can get 1 at home.

I've always thought/wondered if we could turn Wake into a rival. We split in baseball most years. MBB has beaten them a couple times. We're both Baptist bred schools. It makes sense to me. I'm not even sure who their rival is anyway. All I really know about their sports is that Tim Duncan went there, practically no one goes to their football games, and you're hard pressed to find Wake gear in the Piedmont Triad area.

[tyndal23]

I like 2 P5's plus CUSA, merely because we shouldn't give up home games and we should play regional and brand name G5's. But I'm all for 3 P5's if we can get 1 at home.

I've always thought/wondered if we could turn Wake into a rival. We split in baseball most years. MBB has beaten them a couple times. We're both Baptist bred schools. It makes sense to me. I'm not even sure who their rival is anyway. All I really know about their sports is that Tim Duncan went there, practically no one goes to their football games, and you're hard pressed to find Wake gear in the Piedmont Triad area.

The math can work for 3 P5 games in CUSA as a 9 team league with 4 home conference games guaranteed and 4 non con games to play. Easier to do with 3 schools giving us staggered 2 for 1 games where LU gets one P5 home game a year. Even if it isn’t a TX religious school and simply an ACC school, this is easy to do IF willing. ( the argument that the better we get is harder to schedule is a complete falsehood - even ACC schedules tough G5 consistently. ). It actually makes
it easier to schedule a 2 for 1 if it is an intriguing away game that is close proximity for ACC fan base. The “disputes” will be over $ and guaranteed penalty $ for cancellation, how many tickets LU guarantees for visiting fans, etc. And yes, one can use individual examples of ECU/VT screw job, Marshall/WVU long term screw job - but those are exceptions to the rule. Again, geography is our friend with ACC and the right teams being mid to low tier P5. Ideology is our friend with a lot of Big 12 and a lot of SEC schools for 1 off games. Even IF our philosophy is to stay in our time zone for all away non con games, and we take a one off game with the likes of Clemson, Miami every other year and 2 for 1 with VT and WF types, it is much easier for LU to get 1 home P5 game a year than a Kent St type Program ( who once again are doing it strictly to fund their Program and take all away $ games ). IF we were willing - it is very doable.

[Ill flame]

The beautiful thing about being in a conference now is that we can lose all of our nonconference games and still have a shot at a conference championship which should be the goal for now. Our softball program is the best example of this. I think doing 2 for 1 deals with 3 P5s a year so that we always have 1 P5 at home is possible although difficult to pull off consistently. If we were to do that it would make the most sense to add an easy fcs home game to get us to 6 home games a year.

I understand why HF wants 1 P5 but it would be nice to have a second P5 eventually or at least 3 G5s with one of them being a top G5 like boise st. I hope HF stays for awhile but I would prefer to see this philosophy change once he moves on.

[JK37]

It could change before he moves on. Coaches just want wins and home games.

[Purple Haize]

Let’s understand what P5’s are being discussed. It’s the low end of each Conference. Those teams are looking to schedule wins. So if LU plays a Vanderbilt and wins that’s going to be a red flag for bottom dwellers in P5’s. If those teams are on the rise playing LU again will bolster their confidence and their coaches leverage.
Now if LU is looking for money games, that’s another story. Take the L and rake the money. Or take the W and make scheduling harder.
Being in a Conference makes life a lot easier to schedule. I’m not a fan of 2-1 because eventually that math doesn’t add up and having home games is a good thing if you want people to buy tickets. Also, with winning Conference Championships it adds a ‘prestige factor’ to scheduling LU. Where losing to them won’t hurt as bad and winning will be seen as a feather in their cap.

[tyndal23]

Let’s understand what P5’s are being discussed. It’s the low end of each Conference. Those teams are looking to schedule wins. So if LU plays a Vanderbilt and wins that’s going to be a red flag for bottom dwellers in P5’s. If those teams are on the rise playing LU again will bolster their confidence and their coaches leverage.
Now if LU is looking for money games, that’s another story. Take the L and rake the money. Or take the W and make scheduling harder.
Being in a Conference makes life a lot easier to schedule. I’m not a fan of 2-1 because eventually that math doesn’t add up and having home games is a good thing if you want people to buy tickets. Also, with winning Conference Championships it adds a ‘prestige factor’ to scheduling LU. Where losing to them won’t hurt as bad and winning will be seen as a feather in their cap.

Outside of Bill Snyder at KSU - ( scheduling only sure wins philosophy ) that just isn’t accurate. Below is ACC schedule.

https://fbschedules.com/acc-football-schedule/

[Purple Haize]

I am not sure how posting ACC schedules is refutation. But I’m sure you will write a response as though you are paid by the letter to explain it to me and show everyone how idiotic they are for not adopting the Tyndal P5 Equivalent Plan

[tyndal23]

I am not sure how posting ACC schedules is refutation. But I’m sure you will write a response as though you are paid by the letter to explain it to me and show everyone how idiotic they are for not adopting the Tyndal P5 Equivalent Plan

Nothing to do with Tyndal23 Plan. That was based on 4 key factors that had to be implemented simultaneously. This is simply scheduling non con game philosophy as weakest Conference in FBS. Least or most. Your using the same argument for a 3 game P5 schedule as you did 6 game P5 schedule with no math or data to back it up. I am pretty neutral now that we are in CUSA G5 Purgatory - but lean towards a tougher schedule slightly vs a 11 win built in bottom 115 SOS schedule annually.

[LUOrange]

Hopefully, we're only a few more recruiting classes away from when Freeze will be more comfortable having a non-con schedule philosophy similar to Dot Richardson and Scott Jackson's. IMO in football that would mean trying to schedule 2-3 P5's a year. I know that would probably mean B12 and out of region ACC and SEC schools and difficulty/their reluctance to play, ie., UVA. But to be the best, you have to play and associate with the best. In the mean time, let's be CUSA Champs as much as possible!

[Purple Haize]

Hopefully, we're only a few more recruiting classes away from when Freeze will be more comfortable having a non-con schedule philosophy similar to Dot Richardson and Scott Jackson's. IMO in football that would mean trying to schedule 2-3 P5's a year. I know that would probably mean B12 and out of region ACC and SEC schools and difficulty/their reluctance to play, ie., UVA. But to be the best, you have to play and associate with the best. In the mean time, let's be CUSA Champs as much as possible!

I’d be perfectly happy with that Maybe 1 Marquee Matchup with a mid to upper level P5 and one with a Lower level P5.
The key is Freeze building the program up to the point of respectability. Changing the paradigm of how LU is perceived. He is the guy who can do it and it’s already started

[Ill flame]

Hopefully, we're only a few more recruiting classes away from when Freeze will be more comfortable having a non-con schedule philosophy similar to Dot Richardson and Scott Jackson's. IMO in football that would mean trying to schedule 2-3 P5's a year. I know that would probably mean B12 and out of region ACC and SEC schools and difficulty/their reluctance to play, ie., UVA. But to be the best, you have to play and associate with the best. In the mean time, let's be CUSA Champs as much as possible!

I've had this same thought. Our outgoing seniors were essentially fcs caliber recruits and the current seniors aren't much better. How we have been able to win 18 games over the last two years with our talent level is a testament to how good HF is as a coach. The incoming class puts us in the upper middle class of G5 talent. I imagine he would want that level of talent to be a baseline across the roster before trying to play a harder schedule. Considering he's stated before that not being in a conference was the biggest concern for recruits, I hope us joining c-usa ends up helping our recruiting moving forward.

[tyndal23]

One could argue that guessing ahead and playing top 2 teams in MAC, SunBelt,AAC every year does more for our chances of winning the G5 slot in Fiesta Bowl or the G5 slot in an expanded playoff than scheduling any P5. Frankly, I think the upside for top tier G5 to schedule us is going to be harder than a low mid tier P5. No real upside to playing LU for teams like App St / Coastal etc and a very big downside if they lose.

[LUOrange]

One could argue that guessing ahead and playing top 2 teams in MAC, SunBelt,AAC every year does more for our chances of winning the G5 slot in Fiesta Bowl or the G5 slot in an expanded playoff than scheduling any P5. Frankly, I think the upside for top tier G5 to schedule us is going to be harder than a low mid tier P5. No real upside to playing LU for teams like App St / Coastal etc and a very big downside if they lose.

Thinking about it, that has to have also been a part of the thought process and rationale for joining CUSA, even in it's soon-to-be state. As others have pointed out, scheduling 4 is much easier than scheduling 12. Hopefully, being in CUSA and being consistently good will alleviate both political and athletic concerns that regional P5's and the upper tiered G5's would have with scheduling us. Although, I'm still baffled by UVA not wanting to play us.

[Sly Fox]

We were being compelled to join a league under the 12-team proposal that obviously now looks like it won't be happening any time soon. I agree that if we play oru cards right we will be in better position under current structure to work toward top tier bowls outside of the playoff. When even tyndal23 is adjusting to the new realities you know it is settling in.

[tyndal23]

We were being compelled to join a league under the 12-team proposal that obviously now looks like it won't be happening any time soon. I agree that if we play oru cards right we will be in better position under current structure to work toward top tier bowls outside of the playoff. When even tyndal23 is adjusting to the new realities you know it is settling in.

Top Tier Bowl Games outside of Playoffs are rapidly becoming an oxymoron. CUSA bowl tie ins will be probably worse than our previous partnership with ESPN. If your belief is that winning % builds your program to get to wherever stated goals are, then play 1 weak G5 max. Brag on Twitter about how many wins LU has acquired over a decade and then complain in 2032 when Sunbelt still won’t take us. OR schedule 3 P5’s and have a little more credibility in the football world, a little better recruits, and complain in 2032 when Sunbelt still won’t take us. Then reevaluate and go Independent again. Schedule harder like BYU did when they left G5, do what we should have done day 1 of FBS - and avoid G5 at all costs. But since we are G5 - picking one scheduling poison over another really doesn’t do much in the overall scheme of things. Regardless, it is looking more like the “breakaway” will happen and D1 will be “reset” with 80-90 teams. I believe there will still be an appetite and fan following ( much more than current G5 ) and a percentage of America will prefer it over “semi pro” Super League and LU can thrive in that scenario.