Anything and everything about Liberty Flames football. Your comments on games, recruiting and the direction of the program as we move into new era.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke, Class of 20Something

By rogers3
Registration Days Posts
#530075
ballah09 wrote:He's throwing crap against the wall hoping something will stick. IF anything he should go after the NCAA and their BS title IX rules.
LU Law education at work. Dumb a**.
By LUconn
Registration Days Posts
#530081
Jackson is seeking up to $50 million from LU, up to $50 million from the former student athlete who accused him of sexual assault, $1 million from Mullin, $500,000 from Dufort, $250,000 from Ignacio, $250,000 from Stevens and $100,000 from Bucci — for a total of $102.1 million.
I feel for the guy and believe he does have recompense due to him... from his accuser. So it makes sense to sue her but, that amount is just to justify what he's trying to get from the school. I'd like to see him try to collect.

As Duke said "the amount should be punitive to the institution". Is she ultra wealthy?
User avatar
By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#530085
thepostman wrote:I think where liberty went wrong was going public with it. Other then that I have zero problem with what they did. Better be safe than sorry and indirectly send the message that kind of behavior is ok.

I wasn't a fan of how liberty handled it publicly but that's kind of par for the course.
We have a winner
User avatar
By flameshaw
Registration Days Posts
#530091
flameshaw wrote:Here is what I got from reading the complaint:
1. Tons of hearsay, he said, she said, looks like a pretty weak case.
2. Claiming gender discrimination against a male is pretty much a non-starter in today's world.
3. Not going to the Disciplinary Committee meetings is not going to be helpful for his defense.
4. The schools only legal mistake was probably to release the guys name.
5. This had absolutely zero to do with hiring McCaw. Trying to connect the two will probably hurt the case.
6. The idea mentioned here several times that LU did a 4-7 day vetting of McCaw is/was ludicrous. It was way over a year.
7. LU needs to hold it's student athletes to a higher standard.
8. We should have a lot less players on the team than we do. These activities should not be tolerated under any circumstances, regardless of the standing of the athletes involved.
9. Personally I am very disappointed that these kind of actions seem to be so prevalent in the LU community. This kind of stuff happened even in the old days, but was dealt with much more direct. I can assure you that there would have been much stricter consequences and rightly so. I am personally going to have to re-think some things.
10. I reserve the right to change my mind at any time for any reason based on the time of day, I might be under the influence of sleep meds . :)
11. I would reward the guy $1, based on the complaint. Bullied............what a joke.
User avatar
By thepostman
Registration Days Posts
#530092
Athletes at liberty, mainly football players, have been living under double standards for as long as I've been associated with LU. The public image and what really goes on are 2 totally different things. "Football parties " were well known around campus and everybody known what went on there. People were more outraged when the team sucked which kind of speaks volumes.

I was never closely tied to the football team and even I knew what went on. I can only imagine what the people know that are closely tied to the program.

It's not right but there seems to be a lot of people shocked by what is in the lawsuit. It just confirms the kinds of things many people already assumed were going on at these parties.
User avatar
By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#530093
flameshaw wrote:Here is what I got from reading the complaint:
1. Tons of hearsay, he said, she said.
2. Claiming gender discrimination against a male is pretty much a non-starter in today's world.
3. Not going to the Committee meetings is not going to be helpful for his defense.
4. The schools only legal mistake was probably to release the guys name.
5. This had absolutely zero to do with hiring McCaw. Trying to bridge the two will probably hurt the case.
6. The idea mentioned here several times that LU did a 4-7 day vetting of McCaw is/was ludicrous. It was way over a year.
7. LU needs to hold it's student athletes to a higher standard.
8. We should have a lot less players on the team than we do. These activities should not be tolerated under any circumstances, regardless of the standing of the athletes involved.
9. Personally I am very disappointed that these kind of actions seem to be so prevalent in the LU community. This kind of stuff happened even in the old days, but was dealt with much more direct. I can assure you that there would have been much stricter consequences and rightly so. I am personally going to have to re-think some things.
10. I reserve the right to change my mind at any time for any reason based on the time of day, I might be under the influence of sleep meds . :)
11. I would reward the guy $1, based on the complaint. Bullied............what a joke.
#9 :rofl
By ALAFlamesFan
Registration Days Posts
#530095
I am very sympathetic to college guys like this who are accused of rape after a night of consensual sex. They can't win. Just the accusation is enough to condemn in the court of public opinion. That said, this lawsuit is ridiculous. The only thing he denies is the consensual/non-consensual. His issue is with the woman. The university was right to expel him. LU was caught in a no win as far as the public statement. Don't name names and it's a cover up. It is sad that the woman is always assumed to be the victim and men do sometimes get the short end BUT you put yourself at risk of this by engaging in this behavior with someone you should have been able to identify as having some deep issues. No one goes around giving every guy in sight a bj under normal circumstances.
User avatar
By BJWilliams
Registration Days Posts
#530096
ALAFlamesFan wrote:I am very sympathetic to college guys like this who are accused of rape after a night of consensual sex. They can't win. Just the accusation is enough to condemn in the court of public opinion. That said, this lawsuit is ridiculous. The only thing he denies is the consensual/non-consensual. His issue is with the woman. The university was right to expel him. LU was caught in a no win as far as the public statement. Don't name names and it's a cover up. It is sad that the woman is always assumed to be the victim and men do sometimes get the short end BUT you put yourself at risk of this by engaging in this behavior with someone you should have been able to identify as having some deep issues. No one goes around giving every guy in sight a bj under normal circumstances.
And this is precisely why I have moved away from using my nickname in my work interactions...
#530097
BJWilliams wrote:
ALAFlamesFan wrote:I am very sympathetic to college guys like this who are accused of rape after a night of consensual sex. They can't win. Just the accusation is enough to condemn in the court of public opinion. That said, this lawsuit is ridiculous. The only thing he denies is the consensual/non-consensual. His issue is with the woman. The university was right to expel him. LU was caught in a no win as far as the public statement. Don't name names and it's a cover up. It is sad that the woman is always assumed to be the victim and men do sometimes get the short end BUT you put yourself at risk of this by engaging in this behavior with someone you should have been able to identify as having some deep issues. No one goes around giving every guy in sight a bj under normal circumstances.
And this is precisely why I have moved away from using my nickname in my work interactions...
:BS
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#530098
flameshaw wrote:Here is what I got from reading the complaint:
1. Tons of hearsay, he said, she said.
2. Claiming gender discrimination against a male is pretty much a non-starter in today's world.
3. Not going to the Committee meetings is not going to be helpful for his defense.
4. The schools only legal mistake was probably to release the guys name.
5. This had absolutely zero to do with hiring McCaw. Trying to bridge the two will probably hurt the case.
6. The idea mentioned here several times that LU did a 4-7 day vetting of McCaw is/was ludicrous. It was way over a year.
7. LU needs to hold it's student athletes to a higher standard.
8. We should have a lot less players on the team than we do. These activities should not be tolerated under any circumstances, regardless of the standing of the athletes involved.
9. Personally I am very disappointed that these kind of actions seem to be so prevalent in the LU community. This kind of stuff happened even in the old days, but was dealt with much more direct. I can assure you that there would have been much stricter consequences and rightly so. I am personally going to have to re-think some things.
10. I reserve the right to change my mind at any time for any reason based on the time of day, I might be under the influence of sleep meds . :)
11. I would reward the guy $1, based on the complaint. Bullied............what a joke.
I agree with pretty much all of this, but I'm not sure where you are going with #8. We cannot compete with fewer players. Fact is we will now need to have more to be competitive at the FBS level. Now if you meant we need less PLAY-AHS, that I can agree with. Some of these guys should not be representing LU on the athletic field. We have heard about the "covenant" every player signs, agreeing to abstain from extra-marital sex. Unless we are using the Bill Clinton definition, if that statement is anywhere close to the truth, a significant part of our team is in violation.
User avatar
By flameshaw
Registration Days Posts
#530135
Purple Haize wrote:
flameshaw wrote:Here is what I got from reading the complaint:
1. Tons of hearsay, he said, she said.
2. Claiming gender discrimination against a male is pretty much a non-starter in today's world.
3. Not going to the Committee meetings is not going to be helpful for his defense.
4. The schools only legal mistake was probably to release the guys name.
5. This had absolutely zero to do with hiring McCaw. Trying to bridge the two will probably hurt the case.
6. The idea mentioned here several times that LU did a 4-7 day vetting of McCaw is/was ludicrous. It was way over a year.
7. LU needs to hold it's student athletes to a higher standard.
8. We should have a lot less players on the team than we do. These activities should not be tolerated under any circumstances, regardless of the standing of the athletes involved.
9. Personally I am very disappointed that these kind of actions seem to be so prevalent in the LU community. This kind of stuff happened even in the old days, but was dealt with much more direct. I can assure you that there would have been much stricter consequences and rightly so. I am personally going to have to re-think some things.
10. I reserve the right to change my mind at any time for any reason based on the time of day, I might be under the influence of sleep meds . :)
11. I would reward the guy $1, based on the complaint. Bullied............what a joke.
#9 :rofl
Say or believe what you will. I can name names of guys that got in bigger trouble for less, back in the day. While punishments were too severe back then, it seems to me, things have now swung too far the other way. This is an inherit danger in going to "big time" sports programs. There is not a bigger supporter of LU sports than me, but I would rather see the whole place shut down, than to see things like this continue to go on unabated. Again, have some serious introspection to do in the near future.
User avatar
By flameshaw
Registration Days Posts
#530137
thepostman wrote:Athletes at liberty, mainly football players, have been living under double standards for as long as I've been associated with LU. The public image and what really goes on are 2 totally different things. "Football parties " were well known around campus and everybody known what went on there. People were more outraged when the team sucked which kind of speaks volumes.

I was never closely tied to the football team and even I knew what went on. I can only imagine what the people know that are closely tied to the program.

It's not right but there seems to be a lot of people shocked by what is in the lawsuit. It just confirms the kinds of things many people already assumed were going on at these parties.
In defense of the players, there are also a lot of instances where players are accused of things, just because they are athletes. A lot of students are jealous of the free education, attention, etc. that are provided to athletes. It was prevalent even in the dark ages when I played football at LU. Sad situation all the way around.
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#530142
Not saying our other athletes are all angels, and we have had more than a couple of buns in the oven followed by "shotgun marriages" in other sports, but this kind of thing has always been mostly a football problem. I guess the sheer numbers involved along with the alpha-dog mind set you almost have to have to play football combine to make it really hard for a coaching staff to keep a handle on things. It may take some very painful steps to right the ship, but if what is talked about in that complaint can be verified, I would hope we will see several more players serve suspensions next season as a result of their actions of commission or omission. I realize some were suspended last year, but apparently not all of them. I think we also need to rethink one of our captains. He may or may not have "participated", but his "leadership" consisted of leaving early. Better than staying I guess, but not by much.
User avatar
By cruzan_flame13
Posts
#530143
flameshaw wrote:
thepostman wrote:Athletes at liberty, mainly football players, have been living under double standards for as long as I've been associated with LU. The public image and what really goes on are 2 totally different things. "Football parties " were well known around campus and everybody known what went on there. People were more outraged when the team sucked which kind of speaks volumes.

I was never closely tied to the football team and even I knew what went on. I can only imagine what the people know that are closely tied to the program.

It's not right but there seems to be a lot of people shocked by what is in the lawsuit. It just confirms the kinds of things many people already assumed were going on at these parties.
In defense of the players, there are also a lot of instances where players are accused of things, just because they are athletes. A lot of students are jealous of the free education, attention, etc. that are provided to athletes. It was prevalent even in the dark ages when I played football at LU. Sad situation all the way around.
When did you play football at LU?
User avatar
By flameshaw
Registration Days Posts
#530145
cruzan_flame13 wrote:
flameshaw wrote:
thepostman wrote:Athletes at liberty, mainly football players, have been living under double standards for as long as I've been associated with LU. The public image and what really goes on are 2 totally different things. "Football parties " were well known around campus and everybody known what went on there. People were more outraged when the team sucked which kind of speaks volumes.

I was never closely tied to the football team and even I knew what went on. I can only imagine what the people know that are closely tied to the program.

It's not right but there seems to be a lot of people shocked by what is in the lawsuit. It just confirms the kinds of things many people already assumed were going on at these parties.
In defense of the players, there are also a lot of instances where players are accused of things, just because they are athletes. A lot of students are jealous of the free education, attention, etc. that are provided to athletes. It was prevalent even in the dark ages when I played football at LU. Sad situation all the way around.
When did you play football at LU?
73-75
User avatar
By R i
Registration Days Posts
#530165
oldflame wrote: It may take some very painful steps to right the ship, but if what is talked about in that complaint can be verified, I would hope we will see several more players serve suspensions next season as a result of their actions of commission or omission.
I believe this is what we are going through with this situation. We are at a pivotal turning point with athletes getting preferred treatment in terms of discipline.

Jeremy Peters should be a captain in my opinion. He was at a party and left early back in the summer of 2015. If I remember correctly, he was voted a team captain last year and declined, wanting another year to mature.
User avatar
By R i
Registration Days Posts
#530166
R i wrote:
oldflame wrote: It may take some very painful steps to right the ship, but if what is talked about in that complaint can be verified, I would hope we will see several more players serve suspensions next season as a result of their actions of commission or omission.
I believe this is what we are going through with this situation. We are at a pivotal turning point with athletes getting preferred treatment in terms of discipline.

Jeremy Peters should be a captain in my opinion. He was at a party and left early back in the summer of 2015. If I remember correctly, he was voted a team captain last year and declined, wanting another year to mature.

Correction: I know Peters was selected as a captain last year as well, but I am a little unclear on reasons given for him dropping out of that roll.
By olldflame
Registration Days Posts
#530202
R i wrote:
R i wrote:
oldflame wrote: It may take some very painful steps to right the ship, but if what is talked about in that complaint can be verified, I would hope we will see several more players serve suspensions next season as a result of their actions of commission or omission.
I believe this is what we are going through with this situation. We are at a pivotal turning point with athletes getting preferred treatment in terms of discipline.

Jeremy Peters should be a captain in my opinion. He was at a party and left early back in the summer of 2015. If I remember correctly, he was voted a team captain last year and declined, wanting another year to mature.
Correction: I know Peters was selected as a captain last year as well, but I am a little unclear on reasons given for him dropping out of that roll.
Peters and Juwan Wells were both elected as captains by their teammates in the Spring of 2016 while they were still Freshmen (which is highly unusual). I believe it was Gill who decided to make the change. This year I'm pretty sure Gill and his staff picked the captains themselves. If the incident was a factor in the decision on Jeremy last year, I can only assume he has since said and done all the right things to show TG he is now ready.

I plead guilty to losing perspective on how long ago this actually happened. The night of that party Jeremy was a Freshman in his first Summer workouts and had not yet participated in an official practice, let alone a college football game. In that light, surrounded by veteran players who were active participants, I guess you can say his leaving the party early was admirable.
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