Anything and everything about Liberty Flames football. Your comments on games, recruiting and the direction of the program as we move into new era.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke, Class of 20Something

#616428
Purple Haize wrote: November 26th, 2020, 11:06 am
JK37 wrote: November 26th, 2020, 9:23 am There’s more to becoming P5 equivalent than LU simply choosing to be so. And that more is not in LU’s hands. So to that extent, LU is not entirely in control of its own destiny.

I wouldn’t budge if not for an AAC or P5 invite. But I feel for all the other sports that are stuck.
You can just Name It and Claim It!

I’m with you as well. Although I might look at a CUSA invite as well. Outside of that I don’t see an advantage of jumping into a Conference. Conversely I think LU would be a good fit in the AAC or CUSA
Who said anything about name it and claim it - are you really going to make me lay out the 5 year plan again?
#616437
JK37 wrote: November 26th, 2020, 7:54 pmPlease, God, no.
I think LU is in year 2 of his 5 year plan. But goodness no, we certainly don’t want to hear that nonsense anymore
By tyndal23
Posts
#616452
Purple Haize wrote: November 26th, 2020, 8:32 pm
JK37 wrote: November 26th, 2020, 7:54 pmPlease, God, no.
I think LU is in year 2 of his 5 year plan. But goodness no, we certainly don’t want to hear that nonsense anymore
2-5 year plan to a G5 conference? That is what is nonsense. Complete road to nowhere. And a 25 year set back minimum if fulfilling the “vision”.
#616455
sstaedtler wrote: November 26th, 2020, 10:28 pm The only goals should be AAC or P5 equivalent like BYU. If we can't join AAC, we need to step our schedule in 2025 and beyond. 3-4 P5's and BYU or Army. Sun Belt and Conference USA do little for us.
Those P5’s have to be willing to play LU. LU can’t force anyone to play them. I know one University that’s P5 who would LOVE to play them but the $$ asking price is too high
#616456
sstaedtler wrote: November 26th, 2020, 10:28 pm The only goals should be AAC or P5 equivalent like BYU. If we can't join AAC, we need to step our schedule in 2025 and beyond. 3-4 P5's and BYU or Army. Sun Belt and Conference USA do little for us.
Bingo. If going the C-USA or Sun Belt route was so relevant as some folks still claim, then we would've still been FCS waiting for a hopefully acceptance in order to progress the "vision." It's crazy that some of you guys call the P5 equivalent direction bigus while pointing out getting into the C-USA as more apoealing. You mean the conference(s) that didn't want anything with us even when LU was going to pay more money than most of those schools probably gain for their annual athletic department funding? Yeah that's not ridiculous at all smh. Clearly McCaw is going more in the direction of building a brand, so going the Sun Belt/C-USA route would be going backwards. One thing I'll agree with is that we shouldn't pursue ourselves as a P5 equivalent. We are the lamb surrounded by the wolves. We will never be looked at as one of the other schools, and it's not mainly because of Jr(even though that will always be used as the excuse). We are a christian school that actually wants to pursue the Gospel and that is estranged in our culture. We've always been and will continue to be portrayed as cults, and that is included in the athletic world. So yes, we have to do what we can and take many opportunities as possible. Might sound crazy, but we definitely need to take as many great games as we can in order to grow our brand. Now that we did quite well so far this season, I don't think we should fret about the impossibles. We've had already completed so many impossible purposes that were claimed in these chats. Why stop here? Maybe there's a reason why we are the chatters rambling in forms and not the people making the decisions. Thank the Lord for that. In the end, I believe we can do anything, even playing as an elite squad if we can hopefully add more "P5" schools later on.

P.S. Not to go biblical here, but some of y'all remind me of the Israelites. A bunch of doubters, then was rescued or given grace, enjoyed the ride/grace, then went back to doubting again :lol:
Last edited by cruzan_flame13 on November 27th, 2020, 12:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
sstaedtler, aj7 liked this
#616464
I'd have no problem joining Conference USA or the Sun Belt for basketball, baseball, softball, soccer.....the ASUN holds us back in basketball especially. But I think remaining Independent is the right thing in football, or joining the AAC. Either probably gives us a shot at a championship if things break right. In Conf. USA or the Sun Belt, little chance at a championship ever, to even be in the hunt.
By tyndal23
Posts
#616465
cruzan_flame13 wrote: November 26th, 2020, 11:01 pm
sstaedtler wrote: November 26th, 2020, 10:28 pm The only goals should be AAC or P5 equivalent like BYU. If we can't join AAC, we need to step our schedule in 2025 and beyond. 3-4 P5's and BYU or Army. Sun Belt and Conference USA do little for us.
Bingo. If going the C-USA or Sun Belt route was so relevant as some folks still claim, then we would've still been FCS waiting for a hopefully acceptance in order to progress the "vision." It's crazy that some of you guys call the P5 equivalent direction bigus while pointing out getting into the C-USA as more apoealing. You mean the conference(s) that didn't want anything with us even when LU was going to pay more money than most of those schools probably gain for their annual athletic department funding? Yeah that's not ridiculous at all smh. Clearly McCaw is going more in the direction of building a brand, so going the Sun Belt/C-USA route would be going backwards. One thing I'll agree with is that we shouldn't pursue ourselves as a P5 equivalent. We are the lamb surrounded by the wolves. We will never be looked at as one of the other schools, and it's not mainly because of Jr(even though that will always be used as the excuse). We are a christian school that actually wants to pursue the Gospel and that is estranged in our culture. We've always been and will continue to be portrayed as cults, and that is included in the athletic world. So yes, we have to do what we can and take many opportunities as possible. Might sound crazy, but we definitely need to take as many great games as we can in order to grow our brand. Now that we did quite well so far this season, I don't think we should fret about the impossibles. We've had already completed so many impossible purposes that were claimed in these chats. Why stop here? Maybe there's a reason why we are the chatters rambling in forms and not the people making the decisions. Thank the Lord for that. In the end, I believe we can do anything, even playing as an elite squad if we can hopefully add more "P5" schools later on.

P.S. Not to go biblical here, but some of y'all remind me of the Israelites. A bunch of doubters, then was rescued or given grace, enjoyed the ride/grace, then went back to doubting again :lol:
If 3-4 P5 games got us. To P5 Eqivalent status for just one conference - I would be all for it. But it won’t. We need 6-8 P5 games for at least 5 years - hence the Tyndal23 plan. It has to be announced, budgeted and scheduled for - anything else is a failure - we can’t ease our way in to it.
#616470
In my mind Liberty has 3 scheduling options for football:

1) Try to go the BYU route of scheduling 3-5 P5 teams plus a couple top G5 teams every year and fill the rest with mostly cupcakes.

2) Keep the status quo of 2-3 P5 teams plus mostly regional G5 teams and a few weak independents.

3) Attempt to schedule 6+ P5 teams plus the top G5 schools and BYU/Army.

Each option has pros and cons. If we stay on our current path we could establish ourselves as a G5 elite along with Boise St, UCF and appalachian state. This isn't inherently a bad thing. It would allow us to continue to build a fanbase, brand and a winning culture. The biggest problem with this plan is it gives us a very defined ceiling and requires us to wait for conference realignment to go above that ceiling.

Taking the middle ground of 3-5 P5 schools allows us to have a clear path to bowl eligibility while giving us more opportunities at program defining wins like we saw this year. BYU has had mixed success using this strategy. They get solid exposure but have never been able to get the P5 caliber recruits needed to consistently win. We would likely have a clear path to a NY6 bowl if we win out with this schedule but we wouldnt have margin for error.

The "P5 equivalent" path hasn't really been done so it's tough to say how well it would work assuming we could make it happen. If we win out we would have a path to the CFP or at least cause a debate. This option has the highest risk because it would be easy to fall into mediocrity and lose whatever momentum this program currently has.

Would fans rather we go 5-7 against mostly P5 schools or win 9+ games a year against a cupcake schedule? Winning is fun but knowing you have no path to a championship isn't. I prefer somewhere in the middle in the short to medium term. We all know what the long term goal is.
chris leedlelee liked this
#616471
Ill flame wrote: November 27th, 2020, 2:52 am In my mind Liberty has 3 scheduling options for football:

1) Try to go the BYU route of scheduling 3-5 P5 teams plus a couple top G5 teams every year and fill the rest with mostly cupcakes.

2) Keep the status quo of 2-3 P5 teams plus mostly regional G5 teams and a few weak independents.

3) Attempt to schedule 6+ P5 teams plus the top G5 schools and BYU/Army.

Each option has pros and cons. If we stay on our current path we could establish ourselves as a G5 elite along with Boise St, UCF and appalachian state. This isn't inherently a bad thing. It would allow us to continue to build a fanbase, brand and a winning culture. The biggest problem with this plan is it gives us a very defined ceiling and requires us to wait for conference realignment to go above that ceiling.

Taking the middle ground of 3-5 P5 schools allows us to have a clear path to bowl eligibility while giving us more opportunities at program defining wins like we saw this year. BYU has had mixed success using this strategy. They get solid exposure but have never been able to get the P5 caliber recruits needed to consistently win. We would likely have a clear path to a NY6 bowl if we win out with this schedule but we wouldnt have margin for error.

The "P5 equivalent" path hasn't really been done so it's tough to say how well it would work assuming we could make it happen. If we win out we would have a path to the CFP or at least cause a debate. This option has the highest risk because it would be easy to fall into mediocrity and lose whatever momentum this program currently has.

Would fans rather we go 5-7 against mostly P5 schools or win 9+ games a year against a cupcake schedule? Winning is fun but knowing you have no path to a championship isn't. I prefer somewhere in the middle in the short to medium term. We all know what the long term goal is.
I'm for #1. Having 3 P5's gives you more chances at program defining wins and it effects people's perceptions. As for the rest being cupcakes, some will be, but not if you can App. State, UCF or other AAC schools, Marshall, BYU Army, or solid teams from the MAC, Sun Belt, or Conf. USA. Regarding UMass, UConn, and NMS, I'd keep it to 2 per year, not all 3. We already have 2 P5's scheduled every year from 2025 on. Certainly I don't think it is asking a ton of add another one. I think playing 3 P5's is attractive to some recruits who want to prove themselves against top teams. Many G5 schools only play one Power 5 team.
#616578
Logic wrote: November 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm Laughable that people are still talking about the SBC and CUSA after the season we’ve had. Folks, we’ve left them far, far behind. AAC or independent - hard no on the Sun Belt or CUSA!
How many teams with a winning record did LU beat this year? A .500 record? Due to “circumstances” LU has capitalized on a tremendous opportunity. I’m enjoying this season and LU will go Bowling again, which is the goal of being FBS. But let’s not get carried away here. I’m not sure the SBC is a good place for LU, totally agree. CUSA would absolutely be worth taking a look at if invited though. Lots of regional tie ins and a nice fit for all sports. Maybe not ideal for Football, but better than SBC. AAC is a no brainer Yes. People saying we should go right into the Big 12 or SEC or ACC.....need therapy
#616581
Coming from the same person who was “potentate of the dark side” saying Liberty would never succeed in FBS without FCS success. That we needed a better FCS conference before we could even consider being worthy of Sun Belt etc etc. maybe you should just take the L and join the optimistic crowd for awhile, see how you like things :lol:
TallyW, TH Spangler, LUOrange and 1 others liked this
#616585
Purple Haize wrote: November 28th, 2020, 2:09 pm
Logic wrote: November 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm Laughable that people are still talking about the SBC and CUSA after the season we’ve had. Folks, we’ve left them far, far behind. AAC or independent - hard no on the Sun Belt or CUSA!
How many teams with a winning record did LU beat this year? A .500 record? Due to “circumstances” LU has capitalized on a tremendous opportunity. I’m enjoying this season and LU will go Bowling again, which is the goal of being FBS. But let’s not get carried away here. I’m not sure the SBC is a good place for LU, totally agree. CUSA would absolutely be worth taking a look at if invited though. Lots of regional tie ins and a nice fit for all sports. Maybe not ideal for Football, but better than SBC. AAC is a no brainer Yes. People saying we should go right into the Big 12 or SEC or ACC.....need therapy
Orrrrr....these people are optimistic and are just suggesting the possibilities. Like those who discussed us going to FBS because we were stagnated in the Big South. That craziness wasn't crazy after all. Oh I know the response would be that it was luck that we are in this position right now. Now we may not have known that we would be in this position, but it was obvious that we would improve from what we did last year. I hope you would stop telling people need therapy for making a suggestion (even though it may not come into play) because you kind of don't have any reason to talk. But hey that's what threads are for right? Glad you're enjoying the ride like the rest of us, but I don't mind folks discussing the possibilities. Although I disagree with us getting involved with The Big XII or even the ACC, I do believe that we can expand our brand even more than what we're experienced now. Notre Dame began the same way with an amazing coach, so why can't we do something similar with the advantages that we have that they didn't nearly a century ago? Btw, they were looked at similarly to how people see Liberty now. When they beat the best team in the land (Army), people started talking. For us we beat two ACC teams and that is making people talk about us. Not so crazy after all. Enjoy the ride my friend 8) ; AAC in 2024 :lol: .
#616586
Liberty22 wrote: November 28th, 2020, 2:40 pm Coming from the same person who was “potentate of the dark side” saying Liberty would never succeed in FBS without FCS success. That we needed a better FCS conference before we could even consider being worthy of Sun Belt etc etc. maybe you should just take the L and join the optimistic crowd for awhile, see how you like things :lol:
Based on previous LU actions prior to the FBS move I still agree with my stance. No one knew LU was going to sink the amount of money into the program that they did. That’s traditionally not something they have done. I didn’t know they would threaten to sue to be FBS either. But they did and it proved me wrong. I’m ok with that.
As I said, LU has taken full advantage of these unique times and situations and I’m thrilled to be a part of it. Someone said this is the “Golden Age” of LU Athletics and I’m not sure they are wrong. However, none of what I said is factually inaccurate. You might not like it but you can’t dispute them
ATrain liked this
#616589
cruzan_flame13 wrote: November 28th, 2020, 2:59 pm
Purple Haize wrote: November 28th, 2020, 2:09 pm
Logic wrote: November 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm Laughable that people are still talking about the SBC and CUSA after the season we’ve had. Folks, we’ve left them far, far behind. AAC or independent - hard no on the Sun Belt or CUSA!
How many teams with a winning record did LU beat this year? A .500 record? Due to “circumstances” LU has capitalized on a tremendous opportunity. I’m enjoying this season and LU will go Bowling again, which is the goal of being FBS. But let’s not get carried away here. I’m not sure the SBC is a good place for LU, totally agree. CUSA would absolutely be worth taking a look at if invited though. Lots of regional tie ins and a nice fit for all sports. Maybe not ideal for Football, but better than SBC. AAC is a no brainer Yes. People saying we should go right into the Big 12 or SEC or ACC.....need therapy
Orrrrr....these people are optimistic and are just suggesting the possibilities. Like those who discussed us going to FBS because we were stagnated in the Big South. That craziness wasn't crazy after all. Oh I know the response would be that it was luck that we are in this position right now. Now we may not have known that we would be in this position, but it was obvious that we would improve from what we did last year. I hope you would stop telling people need therapy for making a suggestion (even though it may not come into play) because you kind of don't have any reason to talk. But hey that's what threads are for right? Glad you're enjoying the ride like the rest of us, but I don't mind folks discussing the possibilities. Although I disagree with us getting involved with The Big XII or even the ACC, I do believe that we can expand our brand even more than what we're experienced now. Notre Dame began the same way with an amazing coach, so why can't we do something similar with the advantages that we have that they didn't nearly a century ago? Btw, they were looked at similarly to how people see Liberty now. When they beat the best team in the land (Army), people started talking. For us we beat two ACC teams and that is making people talk about us. Not so crazy after all. Enjoy the ride my friend 8) ; AAC in 2024 :lol: .
Oh LU can and absolutely should capitalize on its brand. Continue to build on this seasons notoriety No doubt. Beating Tech is an absolute hallmark win for the Program, no “ifs or buts” about it. I would add with UVA not playing much either it’s giving LU even more air time.
However, likening LU beating the dumpster fire that is Syracuse football and VT to ND beating Army is a bit much. LU would have to beat Alabama or Clemson when at this point they can compete with but not beat a middle of the road ACC team. Hopefully beating teams like NC State etc can happen regularly in the near future
. It took a long time for ND to be ND, to expect that level of success to happen faster for LU is fantasy. AAC in 2024? I’d be happy for the AAC in 2022
phoenix, LUOrange liked this
#616729
I leave to fish for a week on the beach and I come back to this gem of a thread awoken again. Its amazing to me how much nuance is lost on people nowadays. Is this the best season LU's ever had in football? absolutely. Beating two (granted one of the two is awful) ACC schools, capitalizing on everything they have while putting money into the program to make it successful, getting a head coach (yes I know I was against it for the optics but the more I watch him the more I think he's a changed man and I'm happy to be wrong about that) that can recruit guys that succeed here. Its all coming together. HOWEVER. one season of success does not make us a BYU much less capable of being on the same plane as ND. Those programs have a history of sustained success. Yes we have had an incredible season but talk of joining the big 12 is just insanity. A. what a terrible travel schedule for all sports that would be. B. the AAC still makes the most sense long term for us unless you guys are willing to go the BYU rout but honestly sustained success as an independent vs. Sustained success in the AAC I'm not sure which one gets you a call from a P5 conference first. Again nuance. Which I think what Purple has been preaching the whole time in his own curmudgeon way :). He and I have also admitted when we were wrong on multiple occasions. So I don't know why everyone gets so defensive when we voice differing opinions. Ya'll have forgotten that its ok to disagree with someone and still have quality dialog.
#617305
I’m guessing this is a good place to put this. I know Sly and I have talked about this for years. It’s the best reason for having moved up to FBS. This could provide the giant shake up in Conferences or even the paradigm OF Conferences. But LU has put themselves in possibly the best position the can. Will it be enough? Let’s see how things shake out

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenh ... ad9b826e9c
By LUDad
Posts
#617318
FCS LU could and would hang with a number of middle of the pack P5's till about the middle of 3rd qtr. Then we would give out. We can now compete and win some of games now, despite still having fcs recruits in the stable. A lot of credit goes to coaching staff in managing these games so that personal can get off the field. However, I believe a huge difference is the fitness guys. They have remolded a lot of bodies that can now better compete. With this staff and higher level recruits coming in, it can only get better. I think as long as we stay away from top tier p5 teams, and mix in a lot of low level tier p5 teams, 3 p5 games a year could be manageable without destroying the record and wearing out the team.
ballcoach15 liked this
  • 1
  • 33
  • 34
  • 35
  • 36
  • 37
  • 39

Technically, he did say the “University of […]

Gay Marriage Discussion

I do expect a split. Our church family is around 7[…]

I think it would be cool if we had Jon as Chanc[…]

Men's Soccer- What is needed?

I realize it will never get the attention while […]