[Purple Haize]

This talk of the FCS dying is completely overstated and, quite frankly, unfounded. Coastal Carolina moving is not some sort of apocalyptic moment. More than 120 schools play at the FCS level, and probably no more than a dozen have any intentions of trying to play at the FBS level. There will always be a place for it as long as the current Division I model exists. For the doomsday scenario to happen, you'd have to have the power 5 split completely from the NCAA, and I just don't see that happening.

How dare you contradict SLY!! He has inside sources that he can't tell us about! Besides, what do you know, you cover golf!

[ATrain]

I look for Big South to die as a conference, especially in football. There are too many non football playing schools in conference. Sometimes I think it would be good if all the BSC football schools left the conference.

You do realize there would not be a Big South Conference if that happened, right?

[forbidden]

Guess it may be time to change that future schedules tab there Sly...SMH

[Sly Fox]

In spite of the assumptions that I am being reactionary, my mention of the possible demise of FCS has nothing to do with Coastal getting an invitation or us being left in the Big South. It has everything to do with economics that have developed over the course of the past decade. FCS football is proving to be less and less financially viable. The costs of operating at a 63-scholie level are growing more overwhelming by the day. If the NCAA were to redact the Dayton Rule, at least half of the division would slip away practically overnight. And if the P5 were to completely shut off the money games to FCS opponents, a slew more would lose their primary motivation to stay at FCS level.

While far from a likelihood, it remains a legitimate concern over the next decade. But even if the division continues to exist it doesn't change the economics. We need to find any way possible to climb out of our FCS mess or risk being left in the shambles.

There's my doomsday quote of the day. On a lighter note, winning is clearly the answer to get a FBS call-up. NDSU's phone has been ringing off the hook.

[LUGrad2000]

Now we will only have 5 conference games a year. I assume coastal will still play us next year? After that we will have 6 OOC games a year. We are half independent now!

[Chris Lang]

And that's the rub there, re: the P5. That would be the game changer. It doesn't seem that anyone outside of the Big 10 is going the no-FCS route, but another year of playoff snubs for a Big 12 champ could certainly force action. And again, you're exaggerating re: The Dayton Rule. You'd lose the Pioneer and Georgetown and the Ivies, but that's a group of FCS programs that sort of flies on its own anyway. The Dayton Rule will always be in play unless there's a meteoric shift where the P5 breaks from the NCAA, eliminating the idea of a 350-school Division I altogether.

[SuperJon]

To everyone saying we should sue to get in:

What grounds would we base our lawsuit on?

[Purple Haize]

To everyone saying we should sue to get in:

What grounds would we base our lawsuit on?

We are Liberty
#fbsready

[Yacht Rock]

To everyone saying we should sue to get in:

What grounds would we base our lawsuit on?

From a business perspective there is likely an antitrust angle to it due to Liberty meeting established benchmarks to compete at FBS level (like it or not) and possible collusion to keep Liberty out.

[bluejacket]

This talk of the FCS dying is completely overstated and, quite frankly, unfounded. Coastal Carolina moving is not some sort of apocalyptic moment. More than 120 schools play at the FCS level, and probably no more than a dozen have any intentions of trying to play at the FBS level. There will always be a place for it as long as the current Division I model exists. For the doomsday scenario to happen, you'd have to have the power 5 split completely from the NCAA, and I just don't see that happening.

I agree in part. The FCS isn't dying because Coastal is going FBS.

But the FCS is dying. It has morphed into something completely different from what it was in the 1980s and 1990s. Aside from what Sly said, the composition of the schools is significantly different and the overall competitiveness and parity of FCS has suffered. In 2003, 34 schools out of 121 averaged over 10,000 in attendance. In 2014, 25 out of 130 averaged more than 10,000.

[SuperJon]

Antitrust maybe. Collusion isn't provable.

[Purple Haize]

Antitrust maybe. Collusion isn't provable.

I think both would be difficult if not impossible. We don't HAVE to play at the NCAA level. We can play at the NAIA or NCCAA level (where we've actually won a national championship).

[ATrain]

Antitrust maybe. Collusion isn't provable.

Maybe, maybe not...what if a FOIA request was made on the UL-U Pick em', Arkansas State and other publics in the SunBelt regarding all documents (including e-mails) pertaining to Liberty.

[LUDad]

I have to vent!! Conferences do not want us, and it is not about winning.

Realize this,

We've been surpassed by Elon twice.
Remember when Elon was in the Big South.
We wanted into the SoCon...and Elon was added.
Then Elon was added to the CAA.

How about VMI? VMI did terrible in the Big South, so the SoCon takes them back.

Stony Brook joins the Big South, and keeps us out of the playoffs with a last minute bomb...and now they are in the CAA.

Coastal tries to get into the SoCon, gets rejected and is picked up by the Sunbelt.

My hope is that the Big South adds a couple of football schools at the end of the year.

Good points. I would not be suprised to see KSU getting the next Big South FBS invite. They are a large public university in a large TV market. Yes, their stadium only seats a little over 8,000 but that and lack of football tradition didn't hurt Charlotte with Conference USA.

Most of the liberal public secular universities are very open minded and inclusive except went it come to associating with a conservative private religious institution. Football is not, and never will be the real issue with getting a FBS invite.

[bluejacket]

Good points. I would not be suprised to see KSU getting the next Big South FBS invite. They are a large public university in a large TV market. Yes, their stadium only seats a little over 8,000 but that and lack of football tradition didn't hurt Charlotte with Conference USA.

Kennesaw St. doesn't have anywhere to go in FBS. C-USA would add Georgia St. and Georgia Southern before adding them and the Sun Belt already has two teams nearby.

But I wouldn't be surprised if they push for another FCS conference for football, like the CAA.

[Yacht Rock]

Antitrust maybe. Collusion isn't provable.

It happens all the time in business. I'm not sure why you think it's not provable.

It just depends on what the universities were saying to each other.

I'm not saying it would fly in court or has LU has legal standing to bring a case from that perspective but just that is the angle I could imagine.

[SuperJon]

I don't doubt that it may have happened. I'm talking about having legal standing that we could prove in court.

[LUDad]

Good points. I would not be suprised to see KSU getting the next Big South FBS invite. They are a large public university in a large TV market. Yes, their stadium only seats a little over 8,000 but that and lack of football tradition didn't hurt Charlotte with Conference USA.

Kennesaw St. doesn't have anywhere to go in FBS. C-USA would add Georgia St. and Georgia Southern before adding them and the Sun Belt already has two teams nearby.

But I wouldn't be surprised if they push for another FCS conference for football, like the CAA.

Georgia St & Georgia Southern are already the two Sunbelt teams that are nearby...now they may pay the exit money to go to Conference USA but I don't know that it would be financial feasible to do it in the near future. EDIT* your point about another FCS conference is very possible.

[Yacht Rock]

I don't doubt that it may have happened. I'm talking about having legal standing that we could prove in court.

You'd be surprised what a FOI request or subpoena can prove in court.

[Sly Fox]

I honestly don't believe it will come down to an actual suit being filed. The NCAA recognizes its precarious position in regard to Anti-Trust and even the mere possibility of a lawsuit will encourage them to open up a path for us as well as possibly some others. But colllusion is somewhat evident by the set-up regardless of our candidacy based on rules that state that member schools who meet all other qualificiations are being denied access. That in itself is institutional collusion at least from this non-legal expert. No one has challenged it up until this point.

And I wouldn't rule out Indianapolis giving the CAA an exemption to host an FBS league as a replacement for WAC football dissolving. The latter would offer a path for most of the eastern schools with FBS ambitions to make the transition while maintaining their olympic sport auto bids. Yeager hinted at that possibility during the last major round of realignment. It might make more sense today from the NCAA's perspective.

[Purple Haize]

I honestly don't believe it will come down to an actual suit being filed. The NCAA recognizes its precarious position in regard to Anti-Trust and even the mere possibility of a lawsuit will encourage them to open up a path for us as well as possibly some others. But colllusion is somewhat evident by the set-up regardless of our candidacy based on rules that state that member schools who meet all other qualificiations are being denied access. That in itself is institutional collusion at least from this non-legal expert. No one has challenged it up until this point.

And I wouldn't rule out Indianapolis giving the CAA an exemption to host an FBS league as a replacement for WAC football dissolving. The latter would offer a path for most of the eastern schools with FBS ambitions to make the transition while maintaining their olympic sport auto bids. Yeager hinted at that possibility during the last major round of realignment. It might make more sense today from the NCAA's perspective.

I like this as an option. Much more desireable than suing to be Independent or creating a new Conference. On the whole CAA aren't big LU fans BUT individually there are a couple of schools we can work with behind the scenes to make it happen

[flameshaw]

I hope we don't sue over this. Have we been discriminated against for several reasons, sure. However, I still believe there will be a path for us to get to FBS without going down the legal road.
Again, I am trusting the administration to do the correct thing and make the right decisions to make this a reality. You have to admit, they have done a good job so far with out athletic program and know more about the internals on this than all of us put together. If they sue, I would not like the optics of it, but respect that this will be the right thing to do for the university.

[ATrain]

I honestly don't believe it will come down to an actual suit being filed. The NCAA recognizes its precarious position in regard to Anti-Trust and even the mere possibility of a lawsuit will encourage them to open up a path for us as well as possibly some others. But colllusion is somewhat evident by the set-up regardless of our candidacy based on rules that state that member schools who meet all other qualificiations are being denied access. That in itself is institutional collusion at least from this non-legal expert. No one has challenged it up until this point.

And I wouldn't rule out Indianapolis giving the CAA an exemption to host an FBS league as a replacement for WAC football dissolving. The latter would offer a path for most of the eastern schools with FBS ambitions to make the transition while maintaining their olympic sport auto bids. Yeager hinted at that possibility during the last major round of realignment. It might make more sense today from the NCAA's perspective.

I thought Yeager retired? Also, was that hint before or after ODU moved up and VCU and GMU jumped ship? The only two schools from the CAA who could likely pull of a move to FBS are Delaware and JMU.

[rmiller1959]

Here is President Falwell's statement on the Coastal Carolina invitation to the Sun Belt and its impact on Liberty's FBS plans:

http://www.newsadvance.com/sports/liber ... e067d.html

"Falwell said he texts regularly with Sun Belt commissioner Karl Benson. He also noted that Liberty has 'more than one option' in terms of a path to FBS, though he wouldn’t elaborate. LU has not been in contact with any other conferences recently, and when asked if suing to become an FBS independent has been discussed among the administration, he said, 'no, it hasn’t.'"

[SuperJon]

I'm glad to see Jerry say on the record we aren't looking to sue. I had heard from a few different places we weren't planning on it, but didn't know if he'd come out and say it. I'd say I hope that ends the speculation about suing to be an independent but if I know Liberty fans, it won't.