A Sea Of Red

paul b in the burg wrote:Jimmye was going over all the d-1a transfers Liberty has from last year....I guess Jerry decided to do his Steinbrenner impersonation.....they have guys from about 6 D-1a programs, including a couple from that program of immense integrity, Virginia Tech.

I don't believe the rule for transfers was put in, so you could basically stack your team...this was a team that was throughly schooled last year, yet suddenly now thye can hang with a D-1a school? (Wake Forest, yeah they are decent this year).

TribeOL wrote:This is nothing new. Liberty gets a free pass in the court of public opinion because of their "institutional mission" (i.e. they can bring in the dregs from other programs, no matter their history or academic profile, under the guise of saving their souls).

J.T. Morris transferred to Liberty from Penn State in the mid-1990's. A real model citizen, that guy. I think he was arrested for beating up his girlfriend and then striking a police officer.

TribeOL wrote:Academic compromises will be a non-issue for Liberty. It is not a competitive academic institution and graduating will not be difficult for anyone that qualifies under NCAA standards.

As for this year's crop of transfers, at least one has significant behavior-related baggage. Vince Redd (DE - UVA) smoked all of of the dope in Charlottesville last year. Seriously, there is none left.

The scary part is that one can justify almost anything if it helps "further the cause" and the institutional mission of LU.

I predict we will see a lot swept under the rug at LU in coming years in the interest of the "greater good" and rasing LU's profile to that of an evangelical Baptist Notre Dame. Athletics are central to Falwell's mission of saving the country.

paul b in the burg wrote: think the NCAA neds to review the rules on d-1a transfers....we get a kid like Brooks, who wants to play closer to home, and obviously is a good student and individual...meanwhile at Liberty if you are a step away from Ted Bundy it doesn't matter, cause Jerry will forgive you....and the fact you run a 4.4 40 doesn't hurt the "cause"...

What's your point? What if someone like Gomes actually reaches just ONE lost soul? That makes it all worth while.

so they would like the NCAA to change the rules so that their transfers are ok and ours are not. Good idea. You would think a program at their level would have a little more class in a down year. I guess whatever makes you feel better about you team.

just another example of people calling us out because we are a Christian school.....I-AA schools do this all the time, nobody says anything....I am so sick of people in the town fiding every little thing to focus on and hate this school.....they should be happy its LU in town and not some huge party school.....

Thanks for bringing the thread to our attention. I actually rather enjoy these opportunities for us to explain what we are all about (hence my lengthy diatribe in that thread). Most folks have such a distorted view of our school and our football team that it tends to perplex them when facts are brought to light.

Here is the thread over on CAAZone

For the record, frequent poster on our board Tribe4SF did speak up in our defense.

Yea, I meant to post that about Tribe4SF but I was running out the door when I posted it.

i signed up at the CAA zone. sounds like paul b is a hater!

First of all pay no attention to paul_b and his ramblings - I followed his message board posts and behavior prior to our meeting with them last year and that guy has some kind of issue with Jerry and Liberty. I'm not sure his own board mates like him very much. Can someone say "Neidermeyer!".

Secondly, the excuse teams use when they stink is "we have academics". These guys are trying to set the stage and soften the blow for the impending beat down Saturday. I really think LU is going to pound W&M defensively and just flat out "out-physical" them. Duke for years says "we lose because our academic standards are so high". No, Duke loses because they have sorry football players who happen to be good students. W&M is an outstanding school but I find it amusing when schools think they have a monopoly on the "think tank". If you look at the media guide you'll see we have quite a few kids who were outstanding high school students and I think LU has made significant strides academically. We're not exactly a GED clearing house.

Third I doubt anyone is going to care what the average W&M football player SAT is for about three hours on Saturday.
I have no problems with giving kids a second chance. If a second chance at Liberty gives a kid a chance to know Christ and therefore gain eternal salvation - we'll take them - football players or not.

I loved seeing those comments from their fans - it will make Saturday that much sweeter.

Hey Greiser is a example of a Good Liberty Scholar..

Chris Rocco was recruited by Ivy League schools as well as the Patriot League. I have worked with a lot of different folks over my 15 years from many different schools. I have been unimpressed with some folks from the "think tanks" and others that have gone to "ordinary" schools are brilliant. It is not that important in the grand scheme of things. Plus those schools with the big reps are really hard to get into but their academics are not so difficult that it is impossible to get through. I played semi pro ball with 5 guys from Harvard and one from Brown and they all have said that their schools were more difficult to get into than out of.

SCAR - I mentioned on the CAA board a simple fact. I transferred into the LU MBA program from PSU. The program is almost the same - same text, same outside readings, etc. I think "name" recognition plays a fact when you are an Ivy or when you are fresh out of school with no professional work experience. But I am a firm believer if you apply yourself you can get a good education anywhere. I have met quite a few "stumps" with pretty diplomas!

"Stumps with Pretty Diplomas". Thanks for crystalizing my thoughts HBF That is what I was trying to say. Also conversely I have met Brilliant people that have not gone to the fancy schools.

HarrisburgFlame wrote: Duke for years says "we lose because our academic standards are so high".

Good point. They're not yelling that during basketball season.

While there is a lot of hyperbole there is truth to this haters post Does it honestly suprise anyone that we would have rather flexible rules in this regards? I for one am not an "opportunity costs" evangelist (If we save just one the other 19 won't matter)
I like this team. I like the fact they focus on winning and the players brought in were brought in to help us win. THAT is what JERRY wants. If we want to focus on our "mission" then we should bring in players that will help us do that. What does annoy me is when we do one but say the other.

I personally think outsiders should let Liberty worry about who Liberty brings in to play football. If they cause us problems, it's going to disgrace OUR name, not anyone else's. If someone is a problem player, that's not good for our school no matter how good they are on the field. That being said, if someone is a problem they'll be dealt with accordingly because we're not trying to tear the school down over, despite the wishes of some of the locals. On top of that, I don't like anyone pretending to care about our evangelistic practices or methods. The fact of that matter is that even saying we care about these kids' lives on a deeper level than athletics is more than other schools would ever do. And, of course, anyone who knows Ed Gomes knows that it's more than just talk.

W&M have a message board. Who runs it? Mary?

El Scorcho wrote:That being said, if someone is a problem they'll be dealt with accordingly.

I think that is what others have alluded being an issue. Not all LU students are created equal.

I love my man Ed Gomes and NO one cares about ANYONE more then he does. My only point is that when we look at marginal players (those who do not fit the Liberty Way) I guarantee you that our first thought isn't "Hey I hope we can save this kid". If we are looking at them it is because they have talent. Now the debate could rage whether or not we should look at SA who do not fit the LU mission statement, but that is for another thread. We make exceptions because these people are good at what can bring notice to our school: Sports! There has not been the emphasis on the teams spirituality this year as in years past, and there is most likely a reason for that. There IS a much greater emphasis on the performance on the field and there is a reason for THAT. However, as I said, if we want to debate the opportunity cost of brining one to Christ that is another thread. (As a primer: How many SA's who flaunt the LU rules etc. are worth one getting saved? Ergo, how many people would stray b/c of the former then would come the Christ b/c of the former? Talk amongst yourselves, I am feeling vaklempt!)

I guess this all goes back to the debate I've had with friends for years now.

Does LU concentrate on being a school to "train young Christian champions" or to "train young champions for Christ". In other words, do we focus on being a training ground for Christian kids or do we wholeheartedly welcome non-Christians and try to reach them while they're here?

I've heard it all on both sides, and I don't think it'll ever be settled, but that seems to be the same question we're asking here, only in this case, athletic abilities are thrown into the mix.

El Scorcho wrote:I guess this all goes back to the debate I've had with friends for years now.

Does LU concentrate on being a school to "train young Christian champions" or to "train young champions for Christ". In other words, do we focus on being a training ground for Christian kids or do we wholeheartedly welcome non-Christians and try to reach them while they're here?

I've heard it all on both sides, and I don't think it'll ever be settled, but that seems to be the same question we're asking here, only in this case, athletic abilities are thrown into the mix.

Absolutely agreed on that. However, I would go further and say athletic ability is the TRUMP card in the mix

auntieann wrote:Hey Greiser is a example of a Good Liberty Scholar..

YEAH

That does not mean everyone that comes from that high school is a scholar...

eerie coincidence though

actually I transferred while still in junior high- but I claim dual-alumniship (?)