[alabama24]

ND scheduled 10 a year with no problems before their ACC scheduling agreement.

We are not ND.

[tyndal23]

ND scheduled 10 a year with no problems before their ACC scheduling agreement.

We are not ND.

No kidding but the dates are available.

[jweaks]

Wherever, I just hope I can go!!!

[Geraldos Mustache]

Projected to be in Boca Raton Bowl against UCF on December 22nd.

This is a very realistic opponent and a great location.
UCF has a huge fan base and is a top tier G5 school. They are where were want to be. Nationally respected program with a recent tradition of winning.

[ballcoach15]

I'd rather play a P5 school than UCF.

[Geraldos Mustache]

I have a vision of Liberty being in ACC, SEC or Big 12, within next 5 years.

That does not seem realistic.
First of all, our stadium only seats 25,000 people.
Liberty would need to make another very expensive stadium expansion before any P5 conference would entertain us. I know Liberty has plans for a Phase 3 expansion to complete the "horseshoe" around the south end zone but that only adds another 5000 seats for a total of 30,000 seats.

We'd be lucky to have Phase 3 built in the next 5 years. We need to fill the 25K seats we've got before another expansion.

Wake Forest = 31,500
Duke = 40,000
Boston College = 44,500

Those are the 3 smallest of the 14 ACC stadium capacities. We'd need to spend a lot of money to be legitimate in this conversation. I don't think there is enough interest in Central Virginia to put 30-40K in a stadium. Enrollment is too small, Lynchburg is too small.

[flameshaw]

Projected to be in Boca Raton Bowl against UCF on December 22nd.

This is a very realistic opponent and a great location.
UCF has a huge fan base and is a top tier G5 school. They are where were want to be. Nationally respected program with a recent tradition of winning.

And we are 1-0 against them, if my memory is correct. But my memory went a long time ago, along with a couple of other things.

[LU 57]

Projected to be in Boca Raton Bowl against UCF on December 22nd.

This is a very realistic opponent and a great location.
UCF has a huge fan base and is a top tier G5 school. They are where were want to be. Nationally respected program with a recent tradition of winning.

And we are 1-0 against them, if my memory is correct. But my memory went a long time ago, along with a couple of other things.

Nah. We played them a bunch back in the 90s before they moved up. Probably a little less than .500 against them I would guess.

Edit: we are 3-8 against them.

https://ucfknights.com/sports/football/ ... ersity/154

[LUDad]

I have a vision of Liberty being in ACC, SEC or Big 12, within next 5 years.

That does not seem realistic.
First of all, our stadium only seats 25,000 people.
Liberty would need to make another very expensive stadium expansion before any P5 conference would entertain us. I know Liberty has plans for a Phase 3 expansion to complete the "horseshoe" around the south end zone but that only adds another 5000 seats for a total of 30,000 seats.

We'd be lucky to have Phase 3 built in the next 5 years. We need to fill the 25K seats we've got before another expansion.

Wake Forest = 31,500
Duke = 40,000
Boston College = 44,500

Those are the 3 smallest of the 14 ACC stadium capacities. We'd need to spend a lot of money to be legitimate in this conversation. I don't think there is enough interest in Central Virginia to put 30-40K in a stadium. Enrollment is too small, Lynchburg is too small.

Lynchburg has 4x as many residents as Clemson S.C. Same goes for many sleepy towns throughout the country whose population swells during various Saturdays in the fall.

[Geraldos Mustache]

LU Dad - your statement is correct. However, the people who fill Clemson's 81,500 seat stadium are not the locals. Clemson is a state university. A large percentage of their students come from SC and remain in SC. Clemson has 162,000 living alumni. Clemson won their first national championship in 1981. This is a school with a national brand for several decades. THATS's how they fill their stadium.

Since Liberty has none of those advantages, I point to the resources we DO have to fill a larger stadium. The town of Lynchburg is one of those resources, but Lynchburg (albeit growing) is not a big enough engine to fill a larger stadium.

[ballcoach15]

Playing most P5 schools will bring fans.(ACC, SEC or Big 12)

[Purple Haize]

Playing most P5 schools will bring fans.(ACC, SEC or Big 12)

How did that work out playing a Top 25 ACC team last year

[Sly Fox]

Let's be frank ... we are not going to be a P5 addition in this decade barring some crazy turns of events. So making comparisons to how the most elite programs fill their stadiums is folly at the moment. We haven't even filled our 25k stadium yet. Granted we have been peaking when that was no longer an option.

To be clear, we are primarily handicapped by the fact that we have been a national university since our founding. While I was on campus in the '80s, it was rare to find Virginians on a campus full of Ohoians, Michiganders, Pennsylvanians, Georgians, Floridians and Texans a large portion of which went into ministry. The diaspora of our alumni and supporters makes us more attractive as a road team than as a home team. Over the past few decades after the OTGH went off the air, our resident student population has blossomed closer to campus where folks within a few hours can see the campus and its impact.

The truth of the matter is that attendance at Death Valley was pretty unenthusiastic and sparse after the Danny Ford era ((shoutout to Woody!) until Dabo built the prgram into a powerhouse. Winning changes everything. We are well on our way to building a fanbase among those not directly connected to our campus. And then you have 100k or so folks who have LU Online experience who might not consider us their #1 school but who all seem to be racing to church on Sunday after another victory to tell everyone, "That's my Flames!" And don't let anyone fool you, posted attendances in most of FBS were down in recent years for a multiple number of reasons just like with college basketball. Many of the schools with 100k cribs have been "selling out" with ghosts in large swathes of seats for a number of years.

Here in Texas, the amount of folks who have been coming up to me about my Liberty gear has gone through the roof. Most of them don't even make the Falwell connection. They just know that sleepy little Christian college suddenly has burst onto the national scene in football and mens hoops (don't forget the latter). We are actually planting seeds for Evangelical kids across the country to give us a serious look. Suddenly they now feel like they don't have to sacrifice serious college fandom in order to go to a school that fits their worldview.

[ballcoach15]

Playing most P5 schools will bring fans.(ACC, SEC or Big 12)

How did that work out playing a Top 25 ACC team last year

I knew someone would bring up Syracuse. ( I should have mentioned the Orange in original post).

Syracuse is one of those schools that doesn't "move the needle", in Lynchburg or anywhere but New York,regardless of record or ranking. They could be 0-10 or 10-0 and ranked #1, they will not bring many fans anywhere, other than maybe up north.

Attendance wise, Syracuse was the worst ACC school we could have scheduled in Lynchburg.

[Geraldos Mustache]

Let's be frank ... we are not going to be a P5 addition in this decade barring some crazy turns of events. So making comparisons to how the most elite programs fill their stadiums is folly at the moment. We haven't even filled our 25k stadium yet. Granted we have been peaking when that was no longer an option.

To be clear, we are primarily handicapped by the fact that we have been a national university since our founding. While I was on campus in the '80s, it was rare to find Virginians on a campus full of Ohoians, Michiganders, Pennsylvanians, Georgians, Floridians and Texans a large portion of which went into ministry. The diaspora of our alumni and supporters makes us more attractive as a road team than as a home team. Over the past few decades after the OTGH went off the air, our resident student population has blossomed closer to campus where folks within a few hours can see the campus and its impact.

The truth of the matter is that attendance at Death Valley was pretty unenthusiastic and sparse after the Danny Ford era ((shoutout to Woody!) until Dabo built the prgram into a powerhouse. Winning changes everything. We are well on our way to building a fanbase among those not directly connected to our campus. And then you have 100k or so folks who have LU Online experience who might not consider us their #1 school but who all seem to be racing to church on Sunday after another victory to tell everyone, "That's my Flames!" And don't let anyone fool you, posted attendances in most of FBS were down in recent years for a multiple number of reasons just like with college basketball. Many of the schools with 100k cribs have been "selling out" with ghosts in large swathes of seats for a number of years.

Here in Texas, the amount of folks who have been coming up to me about my Liberty gear has gone through the roof. Most of them don't even make the Falwell connection. They just know that sleepy little Christian college suddenly has burst onto the national scene in football and mens hoops (don't forget the latter). We are actually planting seeds for Evangelical kids across the country to give us a serious look. Suddenly they now feel like they don't have to sacrifice serious college fandom in order to go to a school that fits their worldview.

Sly Fox - this is such an excellent post.
Your observation that we are a National University with a dispersed student/alumni audience is well noted. Makes it hard to pack a large stadium when a small percentage of our alumni live within 2 hours of Lynchburg.

Marketing Idea...

Premise - Liberty is to Evangelical Christians as Notre Dame is to Catholics.
Solution - Develop a market of Christians close to Lynchburg.

Our Athletic Marketing Department should identify every Christian church within 60 minutes of Lynchburg and develop a Fan Club. Sell blocks of tickets 25, 50, 100 etc. at very affordable rates and encourage churches, youth groups, Men's ministry groups etc. to attend Liberty games. We have a winning product. Christians from age 8 to 80 don't need to be alumni of Liberty to become fans of Liberty football. Our common faith is the tie-in. Create a marketing video which can be shared with all of these churches and their attendees.

"Finally - a team I can get behind" says a father.
"It's a great family experience" says a mother.
"Go Flames - It's HOT" says a teenager.
"When I grow up I want to go to Liberty!" says the grade schooler.

Have special parking accommodations for church buses. Offer a tailgating tent for groups of 100. So many opportunities. With a comprehensive marketing plan and consistent messaging, we could realistically put another 1500 - 3000 people in our stadium for home games that have no current affiliation with Liberty. Our faith is the common denominator. Leverage that with Christians within 60 minutes of Lynchburg.

[Jonathan Carone]

That idea has been suggested many times over the years. We do a good job selling group tickets, but church groups often expect such steep discounts that it's not sustainable to do what it would take to get those people to the games. In theory it's a great idea, but in practice it hasn't worked the way you'd think it would.

[soccer7]

I would like to see how many more applicants LU is receiving this year. That should be an interesting number to look at. Especially if the guys find a way to win this weekend and basketball gets into the tourney again.

[Geraldos Mustache]

I would like to see how many more applicants LU is receiving this year. That should be an interesting number to look at. Especially if the guys find a way to win this weekend and basketball gets into the tourney again.

Very good question.
Our current on-campus undergraduate enrollment is about 15,000.
Is Liberty interested in boosting on-campus undergraduate enrollment? Or do they prefer to remain at 15,000?
I would love to see Liberty add an additional 500 students per year over the next 10 years and plateau at 20,000 students on-campus. I believe there is a market for that - no doubt. Just don't know what the leadership of the University is thinking.

[Sly Fox]

The public goal prior to the events of the past 6 months was to work toward 25k residential students. I am not sure how the interim administration views these goals. There will have to be continued infrastructure improvements to move up to that size of an enrollment.

[jimflamesfan]

As far as marketing. Remember when Spirit FM did the VBS express and would go and give out mini frisbees at churches for one day of VBS. I still don't see why LU marketing doesn't offer have someone dressed up as Sparky going to different churches handing out freebees and promoting the flames kids club. It would be an easy summer workstudy job....and an easy way to get families connected to the sports programs.

[Jonathan Carone]

Because as was stated before - church groups aren't the audience you think it is. They want discounted tickets at $5/ticket, not $15-$20/ticket. The return on investment in those marketing efforts isn't there.

[LUOrange]

I do think our Athletic Department needs to do more community outreach and advertising, beyond billboards. Such as having the players and coaches go out to schools, Churches, youth leagues, and participating in local parades. I think being involved in the community really helps. I know a few years ago, a few football players read to my wife's 3rd grade class and that was a hit for most of the year. It also wouldn't hurt if they gave away tickets sometimes to youth and school teams and their families, especially for games they know they won't have the students like Thanksgiving weekend. Last fall, they did a great thing with the Bedford Boys helmets for Military weekend, but no one knew about it. However, this goes for all sports. I think the worst thing we could do is raise ticket prices.

However, I'm curious to see what next season's attendance will look like. We'll be returning a Top 25 team (hopefully an undegeated NY6 Bowl winner ) and most folks will have been without in person college football for over a year. Unfortunately, our top draws are ODU and ARMY on Thanksgiving weekend. I think we'll really see how much work we'll need to do to build our local fan base.

[flameshaw]

Having a good product and winning will solve all of the concerns regarding attendance. We have already kinda proved that. It would have been interesting to see how big the crowds would have been, if the virus didn't occur. No need to cheapen our product giving away free/deeply discounted tickets as Jon said. Being an activity for a local yewt group is not the answer.
I drive 3 hours one way and haven't missed a game in donkey's years. That drive is a lot easier to make when we win games and go to the playoffs or a bowl game.
I missed several games in the 1-10 era, can't remember the coaches name now.

[Liberty22]

I do think our Athletic Department needs to do more community outreach and advertising, beyond billboards. Such as having the players and coaches go out to schools, Churches, youth leagues, and participating in local parades. I think being involved in the community really helps. I know a few years ago, a few football players read to my wife's 3rd grade class and that was a hit for most of the year. It also wouldn't hurt if they gave away tickets sometimes to youth and school teams and their families, especially for games they know they won't have the students like Thanksgiving weekend. Last fall, they did a great thing with the Bedford Boys helmets for Military weekend, but no one knew about it. However, this goes for all sports. I think the worst thing we could do is raise ticket prices.

However, I'm curious to see what next season's attendance will look like. We'll be returning a Top 25 team (hopefully an undegeated NY6 Bowl winner ) and most folks will have been without in person college football for over a year. Unfortunately, our top draws are ODU and ARMY on Thanksgiving weekend. I think we'll really see how much work we'll need to do to build our local fan base.

These things get brought up every year on these boards. The thing is our athletics dept already does most of these things. Seasons like this are the biggest game changer in attendance. That’s one big downside of Covid, could you imagine some of our crowds if we could have people? My father in law, a big tech fan who’s super annoying (Thank God we won!) loves to tell the story of how his other grandchild saw Sparky at a local parade 2 years ago and said “look it’s the Hokie bird”. What’s really annoying is that kids mom is a LU grad . So they’re at parades and 5ks and reading at schools etc. could they do more, possibly. Also, anyone who suggests giving free tickets has never worked in athletics because the only loyalty you get off free tickets is those people expecting free tickets every time they come. Ahem, ball coach..

[BJWilliams]

Having a good product and winning will solve all of the concerns regarding attendance. We have already kinda proved that. It would have been interesting to see how big the crowds would have been, if the virus didn't occur. No need to cheapen our product giving away free/deeply discounted tickets as Jon said. Being an activity for a local yewt group is not the answer.
I drive 3 hours one way and haven't missed a game in donkey's years. That drive is a lot easier to make when we win games and go to the playoffs or a bowl game.
I missed several games in the 1-10 era, can't remember the coaches name now.

Karcher...ugh! I remember that season. I think the band outnumbered the students by the last home game that year...
I think that there needs to be a balance between group tickets and regular ticket sales. While I think it would be good to have some church groups, Scouting groups, etc., we can't make that more than maybe 10 percent of ticket sales, especially as we are starting to really get things rolling in the win column. Someone made a point about community involvement, and maybe it isn't publicized as much, I'm sure LU athletics is in the community in Lynchburg and the surrounding area.