[olldflame]

How much of 2016 Masha had to do with him looking over his shoulder knowing if he screws up he's done? In 2014, he knew he was our only option and just went out and played football.

Maybe so, but I have to say that would be on him He didn't have the track record to be declared a clear cut presumptive starter In that situation any player, but especially a QB, needs to be mentally prepared to compete for the job

[Purple Haize]

No that'll do PH...given that is your opinion on the matter which is fine by me. that said, I would handle it the way I want to handle it and if that isn't your way...that's fine.

No. It's pretty much fact. Some coaches suck at explaining things. Some coaches tweak other coaches ideas to come up with something better. Not all coaches have the same resources and personnel. Pretty undeniable facts.

[LUnpretty11]

I have a real hard time claiming a coach didn't prepare. These guys work their butts off. I'm okay questioning results and tactics but I draw the line at work ethic.

I'm not saying the coaches didn't prepare. I'm saying, as a player, you don't look over your shoulder unless the coaches give you a reason to look over your shoulder. He clearly never had the confidence from the coaching staff.

Edit: I am in no way questioning work ethic from the coaches or the players.

[Jonathan Carone]

I was talking about Beej's insistence that Dailey didn't do his homework.

[Purple Haize]

I have a real hard time claiming a coach didn't prepare. These guys work their butts off. I'm okay questioning results and tactics but I draw the line at work ethic.

I'm not saying the coaches didn't prepare. I'm saying, as a player, you don't look over your shoulder unless the coaches give you a reason to look over your shoulder. He clearly never had the confidence from the coaching staff.

Edit: I am in no way questioning work ethic from the coaches or the players.

You look over your shoulder if you know someone more talented is back there

[LUnpretty11]

I'm not saying the coaches didn't prepare. I'm saying, as a player, you don't look over your shoulder unless the coaches give you a reason to look over your shoulder. He clearly never had the confidence from the coaching staff.

Edit: I am in no way questioning work ethic from the coaches or the players.

You look over your shoulder if you know someone more talented is back there

That's a very subjective thing to say.

[Purple Haize]

I'm not saying the coaches didn't prepare. I'm saying, as a player, you don't look over your shoulder unless the coaches give you a reason to look over your shoulder. He clearly never had the confidence from the coaching staff.

Edit: I am in no way questioning work ethic from the coaches or the players.

You look over your shoulder if you know someone more talented is back there

That's a very subjective thing to say.

What? Players know. You know if you are being recruited over or if someone just as good or better has entered the program. Of course you are a competitor and want to up your game and prove your worth. Show your strengths and their weaknesses. It's called competition

[LUnpretty11]

.....
What? Players know. You know if you are being recruited over or if someone just as good or better has entered the program. Of course you are a competitor and want to up your game and prove your worth. Show your strengths and their weaknesses. It's called competition

Most of us are very familiar with competition and how it works. What I'm saying is, SM doesn't look over his shoulder unless he's been given a reason to do so. The coaching staff never had trust or confidence in him and that's my point. Calvert isn't so talented as to overtake the starting role this year. Next year? Maybe. But there isn't separation, at all. Calvert has been less than impressive through 4 games. We as fans ooh and ahh at his strong arm, but he has not shown me that he is a better QB than SM to this point in the season. The future is bright, no doubt, but I'm not drooling like you guys.

I believe the coaching staff has mismanaged the entire QB situation, but I get how the business works and you have to keep promises. Calvert was promised playing time. SM wasn't. It is what it is. I just happen to think SM is a wasted talent. I thought the coaching staff was getting it right through the spring/summer, but they haven't done anything to utilize SM and now we are moving on. That's my frustration.

[flamehunter]

.....
What? Players know. You know if you are being recruited over or if someone just as good or better has entered the program. Of course you are a competitor and want to up your game and prove your worth. Show your strengths and their weaknesses. It's called competition

Most of us are very familiar with competition and how it works. What I'm saying is, SM doesn't look over his shoulder unless he's been given a reason to do so. The coaching staff never had trust or confidence in him and that's my point. Calvert isn't so talented as to overtake the starting role this year. Next year? Maybe. But there isn't separation, at all. Calvert has been less than impressive through 4 games. We as fans ooh and ahh at his strong arm, but he has not shown me that he is a better QB than SM to this point in the season. The future is bright, no doubt, but I'm not drooling like you guys.

I believe the coaching staff has mismanaged the entire QB situation, but I get how the business works and you have to keep promises. Calvert was promised playing time. SM wasn't. It is what it is. I just happen to think SM is a wasted talent. I thought the coaching staff was getting it right through the spring/summer, but they haven't done anything to utilize SM and now we are moving on. That's my frustration.

I don't disagree with your statement that the situation has been mismanaged to an extent, but I think Stephon has not taken advantage of the opportunity given to him, however brief it was.

[Jonathan Carone]

It's on the coaches and it's on Masha. Laying blame completely one way or the other isn't correct.

[Purple Haize]

.....
What? Players know. You know if you are being recruited over or if someone just as good or better has entered the program. Of course you are a competitor and want to up your game and prove your worth. Show your strengths and their weaknesses. It's called competition

Most of us are very familiar with competition and how it works. What I'm saying is, SM doesn't look over his shoulder unless he's been given a reason to do so. The coaching staff never had trust or confidence in him and that's my point. Calvert isn't so talented as to overtake the starting role this year. Next year? Maybe. But there isn't separation, at all. Calvert has been less than impressive through 4 games. We as fans ooh and ahh at his strong arm, but he has not shown me that he is a better QB than SM to this point in the season. The future is bright, no doubt, but I'm not drooling like you guys.

I believe the coaching staff has mismanaged the entire QB situation, but I get how the business works and you have to keep promises. Calvert was promised playing time. SM wasn't. It is what it is. I just happen to think SM is a wasted talent. I thought the coaching staff was getting it right through the spring/summer, but they haven't done anything to utilize SM and now we are moving on. That's my frustration.

Calvert has shown that he is at least as good as Masha is at this point. I have no idea what they show in practice but I can guess.
Masha has had years to work on what he needed to do to give the coaches confidence. He obviously didn't or was unable to do to skill level. No shame in that. No 'fault' in that.
Masha was given his chances. He didn't make the most of them. But apparently you blame the coaching staff for going out and recruiting over Masha. Which is absolutely crazy. If DeShaun Watson wanted to transfer to play at LU I'm sure the coaches would sit Calvert because he's better.
It was a competition. One that Masha had a head start on. He lost. Life goes on. And who knows. Calvert could get knocked out Saturday and Masha will be right back in it.

[Purple Haize]

It's on the coaches and it's on Masha. Laying blame completely one way or the other isn't correct.

The coaches recruited a player who is better than the one currently at the position.
Masha didn't do what he needed to do to keep them from looking

[LUnpretty11]

I have no problem with the coaching staff going after the best talent for every position. You cannot convince me Calvert is better than SM right now. He will be in due time, but he's not now. SM has been put in an unorganized situation where he hasn't been trusted to play a style that he is comfortable with playing even though the offense was supposed to be redone to fit his skill-sets.

That's my frustration. Recruiting "the best" is not my frustration.

[Purple Haize]

I have no problem with the coaching staff going after the best talent for every position. You cannot convince me Calvert is better than SM right now. He will be in due time, but he's not now. SM has been put in an unorganized situation where he hasn't been trusted to play a style that he is comfortable with playing even though the offense was supposed to be redone to fit his skill-sets.

That's my frustration. Recruiting "the best" is not my frustration.

Have you seen Masha in practice? I know I haven't. But he obviously is not showing the the type of progress that the coaches were hoping/looking for in practice. And he's had years to show it. I think Calvert is just as good as Masha right now. I think he will be far and away better by the end of the year. So if they are even and 1 guy has more upside, it becomes an easy decision

[LUnpretty11]

Have you seen Masha in practice? I know I haven't. But he obviously is not showing the the type of progress that the coaches were hoping/looking for in practice. And he's had years to show it. I think Calvert is just as good as Masha right now. I think he will be far and away better by the end of the year. So if they are even and 1 guy has more upside, it becomes an easy decision

That's a fair perspective.

[Purple Haize]

Have you seen Masha in practice? I know I haven't. But he obviously is not showing the the type of progress that the coaches were hoping/looking for in practice. And he's had years to show it. I think Calvert is just as good as Masha right now. I think he will be far and away better by the end of the year. So if they are even and 1 guy has more upside, it becomes an easy decision

That's a fair perspective.

No. Disagree with me. We CANNOT have unity on this topic. What am I supposed to do now while I wait between meetings?
I hate you a little bit right now

[Jonathan Carone]

This is anecdotal but it may speak to what Pretty's been trying to say.

Brandon Streeter was an incredible quarterbacks coach for us. He was very demanding on the quarterbacks but you could see the results of it in Brock Smith's improvement under his three years with Street being hands on with him.

When Streeter was promoted to offensive coordinator, his hands on quarterback coaching took a step back. I remember Brock telling me the year after he graduated that had he done some things that Colin and Mike were doing in practice that he would've been reemed out and that Streeter wouldn't have accepted it. It's why you didn't see the big leaps year to year in Mike that you saw in Brock.

I wonder if the same thing happened with Dailey since last year. That could've be a factor in Masha's (lack of) development and, quite frankly, Calvert is the better natural quarterback. His mechanics and throwing ability is already there.

This post isn't a criticism of Dailey. It only makes sense for there to be changes in coaching style/technique when responsibilities are shifted.

[LUnpretty11]

This is anecdotal but it may speak to what Pretty's been trying to say.

Brandon Streeter was an incredible quarterbacks coach for us. He was very demanding on the quarterbacks but you could see the results of it in Brock Smith's improvement under his three years with Street being hands on with him.

When Streeter was promoted to offensive coordinator, his hands on quarterback coaching took a step back. I remember Brock telling me the year after he graduated that had he done some things that Colin and Mike were doing in practice that he would've been reemed out and that Streeter wouldn't have accepted it. It's why you didn't see the big leaps year to year in Mike that you saw in Brock.

I wonder if the same thing happened with Dailey since last year. That could've be a factor in Masha's (lack of) development and, quite frankly, Calvert is the better natural quarterback. His mechanics and throwing ability is already there.

This post isn't a criticism of Dailey. It only makes sense for there to be changes in coaching style/technique when responsibilities are shifted.

Absolutely. Factor in a 6-5 season last year, a warm seat under HCTG and poor O-line and you have a recipe for lack of production.
There is no doubt or argument from me that Calvert is the most natural QB between the two. I think he will be better than Woodrum. He just hasn't been stellar or near as good as he should be to this point to "win" a starting role. It's a shift from poor production to poor production with potential upside.

PH, you couldn't be more wrong in hating me. We are Liberty family and God doesn't want you to hate your brother. You are wrong in this instance.

[Purple Haize]

Awesome. Back to disagreeing. And I just got blown off!
Your story would actually prove the opposite. It would show vast improvement in Masha and no need to go out looking for someone like Calvert We haven't seen Masha do anything different or better than he has in years past. So losing the QB coach he's been working with wouldn't matter.

[LUnpretty11]

Awesome. Back to disagreeing. And I just got blown off!
Your story would actually prove the opposite. It would show vast improvement in Masha and no need to go out looking for someone like Calvert We haven't seen Masha do anything different or better than he has in years past. So losing the QB coach he's been working with wouldn't matter.

Masha's production has been way off compared to "years past" and that's shocking. IMO, that's also an indication of lack of development.
Also, you're off in your thinking about getting over recruited. There should be a QB recruited in every class. You should go after the absolute best possible at the QB position every time. Gill skipped a year and had to get 2 guys this last year. I'll be a Buckshot Believer when he produces at a comparable or higher level than Woodrum.

[Purple Haize]

Awesome. Back to disagreeing. And I just got blown off!
Your story would actually prove the opposite. It would show vast improvement in Masha and no need to go out looking for someone like Calvert We haven't seen Masha do anything different or better than he has in years past. So losing the QB coach he's been working with wouldn't matter.

Masha's production has been way off compared to "years past" and that's shocking. IMO, that's also an indication of lack of development.
Also, you're off in your thinking about getting over recruited. There should be a QB recruited in every class. You should go after the absolute best possible at the QB position every time. Gill skipped a year and had to get 2 guys this last year. I'll be a Buckshot Believer when he produces at a comparable or higher level than Woodrum.

Woodrums records are Career stats. So I have to wait 4 years to say I told you so? Man I wait around a lot but that might be a bit too long!

[LUnpretty11]

Woodrums records are Career stats. So I have to wait 4 years to say I told you so? Man I wait around a lot but that might be a bit too long!

Hopefully nobody, yourself include, is actually ignorant enough to think that's what I was saying.

Woodrum's first start stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 34-44-1Int 322yds 2TDs

Woodrum's first year stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 11GP-9GS 183-267-9Ints 68.5% 1966yds 11TDs 178.7/yds per game

My point is, I won't be a Buckshot Believer if he keeps throwing <50% <150yds <2TDs
I'd love to see him throw >60% >200yds >2TDs on Saturday. Expectations are high, but efficiency is the only thing I care about from the QB position. Calvert has not been efficient yet.

[A Sea of Red]

A statistical comparison of Liberty's QB play through the first 4 games

http://www.aseaofred.com/a-statistical- ... e-qb-play/

[Purple Haize]

Woodrums records are Career stats. So I have to wait 4 years to say I told you so? Man I wait around a lot but that might be a bit too long!

Hopefully nobody, yourself include, is actually ignorant enough to think that's what I was saying.

Woodrum's first start stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 34-44-1Int 322yds 2TDs

Woodrum's first year stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 11GP-9GS 183-267-9Ints 68.5% 1966yds 11TDs 178.7/yds per game

My point is, I won't be a Buckshot Believer if he keeps throwing <50% <150yds <2TDs
I'd love to see him throw >60% >200yds >2TDs on Saturday. Expectations are high, but efficiency is the only thing I care about from the QB position. Calvert has not been efficient yet.

A statistical comparison of Liberty's QB play through the first 4 games

http://www.aseaofred.com/a-statistical- ... e-qb-play/

See?!? I'm right. You're wrong. So suck it!!!!!
Now for my drive home !!!!

[LUnpretty11]

Woodrums records are Career stats. So I have to wait 4 years to say I told you so? Man I wait around a lot but that might be a bit too long!

Hopefully nobody, yourself include, is actually ignorant enough to think that's what I was saying.

Woodrum's first start stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 34-44-1Int 322yds 2TDs

Woodrum's first year stat line:
WOODRUM, Josh 11GP-9GS 183-267-9Ints 68.5% 1966yds 11TDs 178.7/yds per game

My point is, I won't be a Buckshot Believer if he keeps throwing <50% <150yds <2TDs
I'd love to see him throw >60% >200yds >2TDs on Saturday. Expectations are high, but efficiency is the only thing I care about from the QB position. Calvert has not been efficient yet.

A statistical comparison of Liberty's QB play through the first 4 games

http://www.aseaofred.com/a-statistical- ... e-qb-play/

See?!? I'm right. You're wrong. So suck it!!!!!
Now for my drive home !!!!

Numbers are a misrepresentation of the season and 4 games is far too small a sample size, although I totally appreciate the research. Also, A Sea of Red definitely has a bias toward Calvert. I'm calling you guys out!

Thanks for ruining the end of my day, PH. What a waste.