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Yeah, I have been trolling the MEAC board and after reading several of their lengthy threads where they are up in arms. I started a thread last night on their board and then got a message from one of their posters that I ought to come back to the thread. I think this gives you an idea of the mindset of the MEAC alumni right now:
One other side note from this discussion is that many of the alumni from some of the stronger programs like SC State & Florida A&M are making noise that they'd like to form a new league and step up together to I-A. Perhaps they might turn out to be partners in making our move up. You take 3-4 MEAC schools and add in Tennessee State along with some other regional schools considering making the step up (Appy St., JMU, etc.) and then possibly attract some disenfranchised current I-As like ECU and you have the makings of a I-A league that we could afford to join and be competitive in.
PS - Thanks for having my back on that thread, Tally.
SuperJon wrote:I agree that DSU wouldn't be a good fit. We're the Big South. Since when has Delaware been in the South?
Towson and UMBC were members of the Big South back in the 90's. Not an awful fit. Del State is doable... but not something I would encourage. Hampton on the other hand would be great from a facility stand point. Norfolk State isn't that bad either. SCSU and NC A&T are less desirable but if needed to pull the whole thing off... then I guess it would be worth it.
Sly Fox wrote:Yeah, I have been trolling the MEAC board and after reading several of their lengthy threads where they are up in arms. I started a thread last night on their board and then got a message from one of their posters that I ought to come back to the thread. I think this gives you an idea of the mindset of the MEAC alumni right now:
Delaware State has been rumored in about a zillion scenarios. Frankly, they would be the least attractive of the potential MEAC schools. But we're in no position to bargain at this point.
Its only the coaches and they have no vote, but here's a followup article from that Hampton Roads fishwrap:
Reaction mixed on MEAC changes
Most league coaches favor a black college national title game with the SWAC champion, but some don't want to skip the I-AA playoffs.
BY MARTY O'BRIEN
February 16, 2006
VIRGINIA BEACH -- Four in favor, two opposed and one no comment. That summarizes the feelings of Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference football coaches about possible changes to the league's postseason format.
Seven of the conference's nine head coaches reacted to a plan being explored by MEAC commissioner Dennis Thomas. Bethune-Cookman coach Alvin Wyatt and Florida A&M coach Rubin Carter could not be reached for comment.
Thomas said this week that if the MEAC adds a 10th football-playing school, the conference would be split into divisions with the winner of each playing for the title. Nine of the 11 MEAC schools play football, but many expect the conference to add at least two football schools in the next two years.
In the event that happens, Thomas said the MEAC and Southwestern Athletic Conference are discussing a revival of the Heritage Bowl. The bowl would include the conference champions and, in effect, decide the black college national title. The MEAC champ would forego the Division I-AA playoffs to play in the game.
In 2005, Hampton of the MEAC and Grambling State of the SWAC were voted co-black national champions in the Sheridan Broadcasting Network Poll. Thomas confirmed this week that both schools have committed to the season-opening MEAC-SWAC Challenge, set for Sept. 2 in Birmingham, Ala.
The leagues met eight times in the Heritage Bowl during the 1990s, but the MEAC champ skipped the game five times to go to the Division I-AA playoffs. Thomas said that it is essential to lock in both champions to attract sponsorship.
He said that the postseason bowl game, if marketed correctly, would generate at least $500,000 for each conference.
During the past three years, the MEAC has inked deals with Nike, Russell Athletic and ESPN that Thomas said will earn the conference at least $9 million.
Several football coaches said that Thomas's ideas for adding money to the conference coffers though football should be explored.
Joe Taylor, Hampton: "Championship games and revenue-generating bowls are the direction college football is heading. We would just be following the trend."
Al Lavan, Delaware State: "Revenue has to be a significant consideration. Because of the competitiveness of the two conferences, you can't turn a blind eye to the revenue possibilities. I'd like to be in a position to have this option."
Pete Adrian, Norfolk State: "This is still in the preliminary stages, but obviously revenue is the first thing you want to look at in this day and age. If the financial package benefits all of the (MEAC) schools, then you want to look at it."
Ray Petty, Howard: "I think it would be a great idea to have a true black college national championship game. A game between the SWAC and MEAC champions, played in the proper city, would be a great game with great attendance.
"If that's the commissioner's vision, I'm for it."
But Morgan State's Donald Hill-Eley and Lee Fobbs of North Carolina A&T do not share that vision, at least if it means the conference champion will be locked out of the I-AA playoffs.
"Here at A&T, the administration and myself are happy with the way things are," Fobbs said. "Ultimately, it's a goal of ours, and throughout the country, to win the I-AA national championship."
Hill-Eley added, "The I-AA playoffs are an expensive ordeal, with not a lot of return on the money. And athletics are in such a deficit that the possibility of $500,000 is attractive.
"But I'd prefer if we're going to have a conference championship and a Heritage Bowl, that we play just 10 regular-season games and still be able to send our champion to the I-AA playoffs.
"(Black colleges) fought so hard to be included, and recognized nationally, that you don't want to turn back 40 years of progress."
South Carolina State coach Buddy Pough declined comment.
"If (the changes) happen, I'll show up and be there," he said. "I concern myself with X's and O's, and recruiting football players. I let our administration handle policy."
Keep in mind this fishwrap is in the hometown of the MEAC Headquarters:
MEAC considers break from inclusion
Dave Fairbank
Published February 18 2006
Word that the Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference aims to expand, stage a league championship football game and be part of a postseason bowl to determine the black college national champion leads to a deduction:
Inclusion is negotiable.
MEAC commissioner Dennis Thomas sees a possibility to make some money off of football for his conference schools.
Nothing wrong with that. It's darn near the American Way.
But in order to do so, the MEAC and its Historically Black College and University counterpart, the Southwestern Athletic Conference, must bid adios to the NCAA playoff system that crowns a Division I-AA national champion every year.
Thomas and others are banking on the notion that black folks and more importantly, corporations, are willing to invest in Grambling and Hampton and Howard football and the accompanying hoo-ha: bands, parties, step shows, fashion shows, general camaraderie.
They also are banking on the idea that some unspecified amount of money offsets the chance to play for a national championship.
Notice that the MEAC is talking about Division I-AA football and not Division I basketball and the megabucks NCAA tournament.
The MEAC is essentially saying: We're happy to be part of the group when it's financially beneficial to us, but if we think there's a more lucrative deal elsewhere, we're outta here.
Understand that Division I-AA football, funded at the highest level, is a losing proposition. You can count on one hand the number of I-AA programs in the country that make money.
Several HBCUs, Hampton University among them, participate in various "classics" around the country. They take their football teams on the road, usually to NFL cities, for the exposure and for guarantees of varying amounts - though a chunk of the guaranteed money often is eaten up by travel expenses.
Opting out of the NCAA football playoff process isn't unprecedented. The Ivy League does not participate, supposedly for reasons of academics and missed class time (though those concerns somehow disappear during the NCAA basketball tournament).
The SWAC often is not represented in the I-AA playoffs, either, because league members Grambling and Southern play the annual "Bayou Classic" on Thanksgiving weekend, which coincides with the first round of the playoffs.
The game fills the Louisiana Superdome, earns millions in tourist revenue for New Orleans and reportedly gets each school roughly a $1 million payout.
That's what Thomas envisions with the long-range plan he recently floated. He sees a 12- or 14-team MEAC within the next several years split into two divisions.
The league would hold a conference championship between the division winners. The champ then would face the SWAC champ in a resurrected Heritage Bowl for the black college national championship.
"We'll generate significant, significant revenue for the conference and the institutions that participate," Thomas told Daily Press reporter Marty O'Brien.
Again, far be it from us to put the kibosh on another man's cash flow, but the dollars are questionable and the entire venture has an uncomfortably retro feel to it - as in going back to the '40s, '50s and '60s when segregated teams would win championships and then be left to stare at each other across the tracks wondering what would happen if they played.
Granted, integration has eliminated many of those barriers. Blacks and whites compete with and against each other all the time, at all levels, at all schools.
But if the MEAC and SWAC go hand-in-hand down the black college intramural path, it could create some interesting conversations between recruits and HBCU football coaches.
Recruit: Will I get to play for a championship?
Coach: You'll get to play for a conference championship and a Heritage Bowl title.
Recruit: What about the national championship?
Coach: You'll get to play for the Black College National Championship.
Recruit: How many black colleges are there?
Coach: Lots, but only a couple dozen playing Division I football.
Recruit: Why doesn't your school play for the regular national championship?
Coach: Because our commissioners and school administrators decided they could make some money by splintering off and doing it another way.
Recruit: Didn't our parents and grandparents march and struggle and sacrifice to be included, not excluded?
Coach: Look, kid, do you want the scholarship or not?
Hampton coach Joe Taylor, for one, has said that he wanted to upgrade his non-conference schedule to better prepare for postseason. The Pirates are 0-3 in the I-AA playoffs, including a loss last fall.
If the MEAC and SWAC follow through, however, the list of programs against which Hampton and others measure themselves becomes shorter, not longer.
Playoff appearances and championship rings don't pay the light bill, or the track scholarship, for that matter, where I-AA football is concerned.
Thomas and others believe the MEAC has an opportunity. If 5-7 years down the road there isn't the interest or the corporate dollars, the MEAC and SWAC figure to be welcomed back to the NCAA party.
Actually I think that's a rather evenhanded story. Although I don't believe he is realizing the potential backlash among alumni that we see brewing. They are really only hearing the pro-commish side of the story.
Here's another rather non-eventful interview in the Raleigh fishwrap:
MEAC building a future
Triangle key part of overall plan
Dennis E. Thomas is in his fourth year as commissioner of the Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference. He has more than 30 years of athletics and higher education experience. He is the former athletics director at Hampton University.
Q: How important is the change in venue from Richmond to Raleigh?
A: It's very important. We are at a critical juncture in terms of the growth of the basketball tournament and we feel that Wake County and the city of Raleigh is the best place for our tournament to grow.
Q: What would you consider a successful tournament?
A: We want to have better attendance than we had last year. We had over 40,000 for the whole week last year. That's the major barometer [of success]. We want our local fans and fans coming from out of town to not only enjoy basketball but to have a good experience in the city of Raleigh. We have a host of activities going on, and we want them to experience all that Wake County has to offer, from fine dinning to shopping.
Q: What is your expectation from Raleigh and Wake County?
A: They have been tremendous. We think the mayor and county commissioner and others have really provided strong and visionary leadership for the citizens of Wake County. The MEAC family is very appreciative of that.
Q: How do you distinguish the MEAC from the CIAA?
A: People want to draw comparisons, but really, I don't draw comparisons. They are doing what they have to do and we are doing what we have to do. There is a clear and distinct dichotomy between the CIAA and the MEAC: We are Division I and they are Division II, and we are part of March Madness. Commissioner [Leon] Kerry has done a phenomenal job with the CIAA Tournament and we wish them well, but there is enough market place out there for both tournaments to be successful.
Q: Do do you expect to add new members to the conference?
A: I'm not able to comment on that. We have not made a decision yet. Winston Salem has applied. So has Savannah State University, and N.C. Central has expressed written interest.
Q: There is talk about the MEAC leaving Division I-AA football and going straight Division I. Can you comment on that?
A: That's not true. That originated from comments made for a Q&A I had with a local newspaper here [in Virginia]. What I indicated is we are investigating all of our options, and if there was enough financial resources on the table, then we would have to consider it.
Q: You just moved to Virginia Beach, Va., but have there been any discussions of moving the headquarters to Raleigh?
A: Right now, Raleigh is one of the best places to live. And Wake County for that matter. And that's not my opinion but some of the best magazines and organizations have indicated that. We just moved to Virginia Beach and will be here for a few years, but you never know what the situation might hold in the future. I'm not going to put that option on the side. That is a possibility in the future.
Not that their vote counts, but the MEAC coaches don't want to opt out of the I-AA playoffs:
MEAC coaches' recommendations include conference title game
BY MARTY O'BRIEN
March 19, 2006
Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference football coaches like the idea of a conference championship game, with the winner going to a bowl game to decide the black college national title. But the coaches still want the opportunity to compete in the Division I-AA playoffs.
That was the consensus reached by seven (of nine) MEAC head coaches who met during last week's conference basketball tournament in Raleigh, N.C., Hampton coach Joe Taylor said. Taylor said the coaches plan to forward their recommendations to MEAC commissioner Dennis Thomas.
Thomas is exploring a different plan. He said recently that if the MEAC expands from nine to 10-or-more football schools - which could happen as early as May - the conference will be split into divisions, with the winner of each playing for the title. The MEAC champ would then forgo the I-AA playoffs to face the Southwestern Athletic Conference champ in the Heritage Bowl. Thomas said he believes the game could net each conference at least $500,000.
Taylor said the coaches will ask Thomas to explore the following plan:
MEAC teams play a 10-game regular season, starting the season a week earlier than it does now.
The MEAC division winners play each other for the conference championship on the final weekend of the Division I-AA regular season.
The MEAC champ and any at-large selection from the conference compete in the four-week I-AA playoffs in late-November and December.
After the completion of the I-AA playoffs, the MEAC champ plays the SWAC champ in the Heritage Bowl in January.
The viability of the plan hinges on whether the NCAA passes legislation allowing I-AA schools to play 12 (non-playoff) games annually. Currently, I-AA schools are allowed a maximum of 12 regular-season games only when there are 14 Saturdays from the first permissible playing date through the last playing date in November (2008, 2013, 2014 and 2019).
"We want the commissioner to investigate all possibilities," Taylor said. "Young people want to go through the season with the idea of playing for the highest honor."
well i think this hurts us b/c of scheduling OOC opponents, if the MEAC cuts back to a 10 game regular season. im hoping that they stick with the original plan and hampton and sc state will want to leave and come to the big south.
This would be precedent-setting territory if the NCAA were to change their by-laws.
Basically, they want to have their cake and eat it too. You can't blame them for asking. But really its not a likely scenario.
I have a feeling this summer at the conference meetings there will have to be some sort of sitdown where they decide the direction of the league. I suspect at that time we'll finally learn whether or not certain schools are serious about walking if they are required to miss the I-AA playoffs.
- By LUOrange
- By ECC29