[PAmedic]

http://newsadvance.com/servlet/Satellit ... 5186&path=

Seal of disapproval

By Zack Smith
zsmith@newsadvance.com
March 2, 2006

AMHERST - The Confederate battle flag always has been one of the most controversial symbols of the Civil War - and its elimination from Amherst County’s official seal has some residents fighting mad.

Organizers, including several members of the Sons of Confederate Veterans, have gathered hundreds of signatures protesting the flag’s removal, which they say was done without informing the public.

Meanwhile, Leon Parrish of the Board of Supervisors said that the image of the flag was erased without citizen input to avoid controversy.

“Any time you get a subject that broad, you can interrupt the entire county,” Parrish said.The flag’s removal came in August 2004 as the result of a resolution from the Board of Supervisors, according to Interim County Administrator David Proffitt.

The resolution eliminated the flag from newer items featuring the county seal, such as county decals, but did not eliminate it from older items such as the “Welcome to Amherst County” sign, Proffitt said.

A small image of the battle flag was in the center of the seal, which was created in 1961 by architect Charles L. Vail Jr. as part of the county’s 200th anniversary.

While some consider the flag a symbol of southern history, others consider it a symbol of slavery and racism.

“I don’t think that the county should be promoting anything that’s offensive to anyone,” said Parrish. He said he proposed the resolution after receiving requests to do so from residents of District 5, which he represents.

Leah Lovell of Naola said that she first discovered the flag was missing in April when she got her new county decal.

“That’s the first thing I noticed,” Lovell said.

“It’s part of our history. It affects thousands of people in the county.”

Unlike an ordinance, a resolution does not require an advertised public hearing, meaning that most county residents did not know about plans to remove the seal.

Now, some of those residents are trying to get it back.

At Dixie Outfitters, a southern heritage memorabilia store in Madison Heights that prominently displays the flag on its storefront, county residents can sign petitions to Sen. Steve Newman (R-Forest) asking for his help in reinstating the flag on the seal.

Lovell said that about 1,000 residents had signed the petition at locations throughout Amherst County, but that Newman’s office had sent back letters saying it was a county issue.

Brenda Beeton, who runs the shop with her husband, Dennis, said that she felt eliminating the flag from the seal took away a piece of Amherst County’s history.

“When you change history, you burn aa book, just like they did in Nazi Germany,” Beeton said.

“You might as well live in Russia during the Communist regime.”

Brian Giles of the Sons of Confederate Veterans said that it was unfair to view the flag as a symbol of hate because some racist organizations used it.

“You’re taking the old quote, ‘it takes one bad apple to ruin the barrel,’ and applied that to the flag,” said Giles, who works to discover and restore the graves of county Civil War veterans.

Giles also said that some of the soldiers who fought for the Confederacy were black, Jewish and even Indian.

Parrish said that he and the board stood by their decision.“People use the excuse that it’s history, but if I want to know history, I go to the history books, not a symbol or a picture.

“This was not done to hurt anybody, it was done so that peace and harmony may prevail in Amherst County.”

[Sly Fox]

Nobody living in Amherst fought in the war nor did their parents or grandparents. They need to get over this. Why they feel it is necessary to show a Confederate naval battle flag in Amherst County is beyond me.

News Flash! The South lost the war! The sooner some people get over this fact the better. You can honor your ancestors in any number of ways that don't utilize a symbol that now is generally recognized primarily as a tool of the Aryan Nation. That's not something I'd want my ancestors tied to.

[SuperJon]

Pride not prejudice.

I've never had the Confederate flag anywhere on my body or car or anything but I see no problem with old southern towns/counties/etc having the Confederate flag on there.

[Sly Fox]

You can show pride in your heritage without being offensive.

[SuperJon]

I know a ton of black people who have no problem at all with the confederate flag. I've even saw a couple wear the Dixie Outfitters clothing with the flag on it. It's not a big deal anymore.

[Sly Fox]

Its still a big deal to a lot of people. But I know there is no sense in discussing this with a Carolinan.

[ATrain]

My ancestors fought under the Confederate Battle Flag...and my direct line didn't own slaves (other members related to it did) but rather were repelling an invading force (the reason for Virginia's secession: Lincoln wanted to invade South Carolina after Fort Sumter). Therefore, I take pride in the Confederate flag, and just because organizations like the people who wear pointed hoods and run around dressed as ghosts distort its image, that does not mean it shouldn't be flown/displayed/removed from seals or whatever, b/c of what it really stands for. It doesn't matter what type of symbol you display, someone somewhere will find a way to distort its image and unless enough people are willing to stand up for what it really means then controversies like this will have no end...with that:
"I wish I was in Dixie
Hooray, Hooray
In Dixieland I take my stand..."

[SuperJon]

But I know there is no sense in discussing this with a Carolinan.

What the heck's that supposed to mean? Just because I'm not from Texas I can't have a valid point on the issue?

[LUconn]

My ancestors fought under the Confederate Battle Flag...and my direct line didn't own slaves (other members related to it did) but rather were repelling an invading force (the reason for Virginia's secession: Lincoln wanted to invade South Carolina after Fort Sumter). Therefore, I take pride in the Confederate flag, and just because organizations like the people who wear pointed hoods and run around dressed as ghosts distort its image, that does not mean it shouldn't be flown/displayed/removed from seals or whatever, b/c of what it really stands for. It doesn't matter what type of symbol you display, someone somewhere will find a way to distort its image and unless enough people are willing to stand up for what it really means then controversies like this will have no end...with that:
"I wish I was in Dixie
Hooray, Hooray
In Dixieland I take my stand..."

Uhh, so do you currently veiw us as an occupation?

[Sly Fox]

SJ - Carolinians tend to be over-the-top in their Confederate pride.

And for the record, I was born in Tennessee (a border state) and grew up north of the Mason-Dixon line where my ancestors proudly defeated the slave states. I currently live in Texas which fought on the Confederate side.

Its amazing they are still blowing over the whole slavery issue in Southern schools. Yeah, slavery had nothing to do with the war.

[SuperJon]

You're right, the war wasn't about slaves. Any history teacher with half a brain knows to teach that. I'm not even big with the Confederate flag but I know a ton of people are and I think it's their right to do what they want with it.

[Baldspot]

True story, I grew up in the general area around Gettysburg, PA. When Duane Carson got married, I took two friends up to the services. One was from NC and the other from TN. In the morning I took them over to the battlefield and we walked across the same path as Pickett's charge. When we got about 10 feet from the Union line of canons, there was a little stone marking the spot where the furtherst Confederate soldier made it. The soldier happened to be from a NC battalion. My friend was none too proud to be standing there until I started looking for traces of tar on the ground. Guess I kinda ruined the moment.

[TIMSCAR20]

The problem is that the confederate flag stands for so much that is negative. The meaning has taken a more sinister meaning with the KKK and Arian Nations adopting all or part of it. There is no doubt that many in the South want to fly this flag as a symbol of the old south. Well the old South was build on the backs of slaves. Slaves. I am not a guy who plays the race card and insists that "the Man" is holding me back or anything like that. But it is naive to say that the confederate flag ONLY symbolizes pride in the old confederacy. It simply goes way deeper than that and that is why it is a lightning rod for controversy. I am proud of my heritage and what my ancestors endured and overcame to provide me opportunities they never had. I am the youngest of 10 and my parents were the age of many of your grandparents so my great grand parents were slaves on my father's side. I also have many reletives that lived in the old "Jim Crow" South where the confederate flag was one of many symbols used to intimidate and keep black folks "in their place." We in 2006 are too willing to gloss over the history of slavery. I am not living in the past but until you understand what slavery really was and how it impacts some blacks even today, yes today, then you are not dealing with all the facts on what the Conferacy and the flag means to some.

[bigsmooth]

i am proud to be a southerner, born in virginia, and have lived in atlanta, and in raleigh for the past seven years. sly, i will take issue with the carolinians being over the top with this. it is not really an issue, and i do not know of any counties that have the confederate flag on their county seals. the issue of the flag seems to be in schools with kids wearing this dixie outfitters stuff, and most recently georgia and south carolina taking the flag off of their statehouses. though it does not bother me personally b/c i do believe in pride not prejuidice, the KKK and other white supremacy groups have adopted that flag for their own, and that perception will not change as long as they continue that. Atrain, congrats to your family members who fought in the war back then, i respect them for their contributions, but as sly said those people are dead. if the sons/daughters of the confederacy want to celebrate their history, no problem. but flying that flag on any statehouse or it being on any county seal does not represent ALL of the poeple of those cities, towns, or states. you can say what you want, but until live in the body of a black person, or have seen a KKK rally where they preach their propaganda and fly the confederate flag and say it is God's will to have a clean aryan race, please dont give me this idea of your ancestors fighting in the war. the united states is a melting pot, and though im not a fan of political correctness, i do believe the confederate should not be flown in state and governmental bldgs. it is sad that the supremacy groups have ruined it for the prideful people, but it is what it is. i will get off my soap box now.

[PAmedic]

http://newsadvance.com/servlet/Satellit ... 4459&path=

Sensitivity needed in redesigning seal

Lynchburg News & Advance
March 7, 2006

A remnant of the Confederate battle flag does not belong on a county seal in Virginia in the 21st century. But its hasty removal from Amherst County’s seal could have been handled in a better way and with the same degree of care that the creators of the seal took back in 1961.

The center of the seal, until last year, was a tiny piece of the familiar Confederate battle flag. It was superimposed on a red, white and blue shield, meant to symbolize the Union. The Civil War was much on everyone’s mind in 1961, when Virginia observed the Civil War Centennial on the 100th anniversary of the start of the war.

Turns out 1961 also marked the 200th anniversary of Amherst County. The way the late county historian Alfred Percy tells it in his book, “The Amherst County Story,” the seal was created at that time, specifically for the cover of the book.

Architect Charlie Vail Jr. designed the seal. Each component has a natural, agricultural, or historic significance, from the tobacco leaf at the top to a portion of the coat of arms of Lord Jeffrey Amherst, a colonial governor for whom the county was named.

Back in 1961 in Amherst, commemorating the Civil War with symbols of the North and South likely stirred little controversy. But the county and the state and the South have come a long way since then, and the Confederate battle flag unfortunately represents slavery and racism to many citizens.

Speaking of slaves, the county seal lacks any recognition of their contributions to Amherst County. Nor does it recognize the native Americans who were the county’s first residents. Perhaps some more changes to the seal are in order. Some image to represent the Monacan Indians? A small cabin that would represent the contributions of not only the slaves but also all the first settlers?

The county supervisors opted out of any public debate over the seal and all its inherent symbolism. They simply removed the battle flag quietly, to avoid controversy.

But avoiding controversy also cheated the public out of a chance to discuss and perhaps agree why the change was needed. It’s not too late for the supervisors to re-open this issue, not from the point that the flag should be returned, but from what should replace it.

Symbols are important. The supervisors ought to take a look at other aspects of the county’s history and update the seal to reflect a vision for the future that embraces all the people.

[Ed Dantes]

Brenda Beeton, who runs the shop with her husband, Dennis, said that she felt eliminating the flag from the seal took away a piece of Amherst County’s history.

“When you change history, you burn aa book, just like they did in Nazi Germany,” Beeton said.
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The odd thing is that Germany now prohibits displays of the swastika.

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Here's the opinion from one ignorant Northerner. Undeniably, there are people who are offended by displaying the confederate flag. And sure, it is a symbol of pride, and heritage. And the swastika used to be a symbol for good luck. The problem is that racist rednecks such as the KKK hijacked the Confederate flag years after the Civil War. Those same people who are angry at legislatures for removing it should have voiced a similar outrage when the racists adopted it. But, they didn't. So, sorry guys, you missed your chance.

[Flamesfanva]

I wonder how many people who regard the confederate flag as history and proudly display it, would also proudly display a rainbow being that it's God's symbol of a covenant, although it has been hijacked by the gay pride movement, just as the confederate flag was hijacked.

[TIMSCAR20]

Ok, lets just say that the Confederate Flag wasn't associated with the KKK. It is still associated with the old South. I know the Civil War was not just a bout slavery but if the South had won I know that the abolition of Slavery would have been far less likely. It would be like Exxon giving up 80% of its profits or Phillip Morris not manufacturing cigarettes. It just wouldn't have happened. Slavery made up a good deal of the economy in certain southern states and you know human interest almost always loses to the almighty dollar all throughout our history. I have a hard time supporting a cause that would have me and my relatives be considered 3/5ths of a human, work for free, get abused physically and sexually and not allow me to learn how to read, count or vote. Believe me, I would like to forget about slavery as much as any white person but we can't forget because it has not been made right. I am not calling for reparations or anything but we can't deny the struggles blacks have had during slavery and since. The Confederate flag symbolizes the old south and I don't ever want to live in a place that glorifies the old south. Sorry for the editorial.