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By cruzan_flame13
Posts
#626983
stokesjokes wrote: June 3rd, 2021, 11:19 am Is that a shot at Giboney for reading? :roll:

One of the most surprising (and encouraging) things Liberty did last year was a host a book study for the faculty and staff working through a book on the gospel and racism, I don’t remember the name of the book. My wife got to hear from faculty and staff members who shared first-hand experience with this problem and was able to really expand her understanding of what our black brothers and sisters go through and have been through.

Of course the folks at Falkirk didn’t appreciate this brazen liberalizing of the school, so they strong-armed the next study to be a book from an economic theorist that had absolutely nothing to do with the gospel 🤷‍♂️
It's no shot at anyone, but just common sense. The term racism that we have accepted in our vocabulary did not exist in the old world 8) . The isssue is that people do not see these issues as what they truly are, business opportunities. While the massages divide through quarrels ir even violence, those who promote it get their pockets fatter. Crazy how how a term that meant humanity or the human being is now defined based on skin tones (even though there's different backgrounds in that). Skinfolk are not always kinfolk. The bible describes issues with different tribes clashing together at times because of conquest. Just as the elites at that time indoctrinate their people and those they've conquered while distracting them with drama (entertainment or other operations), it's the same thing is applied in this country. Oh wait...that can't happen here though because it's America and we are free. Get out of the hillucination and one will see how draconian it actually is and how liberty is replace by authoritative security. Oh and also, that authority has be involved with the church just like past tyrannical governments in religion. To each his /her own.
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#626984
cruzan_flame13 wrote: June 3rd, 2021, 1:16 pm
stokesjokes wrote: June 3rd, 2021, 11:19 am Is that a shot at Giboney for reading? :roll:

One of the most surprising (and encouraging) things Liberty did last year was a host a book study for the faculty and staff working through a book on the gospel and racism, I don’t remember the name of the book. My wife got to hear from faculty and staff members who shared first-hand experience with this problem and was able to really expand her understanding of what our black brothers and sisters go through and have been through.

Of course the folks at Falkirk didn’t appreciate this brazen liberalizing of the school, so they strong-armed the next study to be a book from an economic theorist that had absolutely nothing to do with the gospel 🤷‍♂️
It's no shot at anyone, but just common sense. The term racism that we have accepted in our vocabulary did not exist in the old world 8) . The isssue is that people do not see these issues as what they truly are, business opportunities. While the massages divide through quarrels ir even violence, those who promote it get their pockets fatter. Crazy how how a term that meant humanity or the human being is now defined based on skin tones (even though there's different backgrounds in that). Skinfolk are not always kinfolk. The bible describes issues with different tribes clashing together at times because of conquest. Just as the elites at that time indoctrinate their people and those they've conquered while distracting them with drama (entertainment or other operations), it's the same thing is applied in this country. Oh wait...that can't happen here though because it's America and we are free. Get out of the hillucination and one will see how draconian it actually is and how liberty is replace by authoritative security. Oh and also, that authority has be involved with the church just like past tyrannical governments in religion. To each his /her own.
Not you, Spangler said “ Would be interesting listen to. Dr. Baucham most likely would not need notes to read from,” which was clearly a shot at Giboney for reading.
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#627005
Maybe not a split, but you’ll see a lot of people leave the denomination. They’ve been losing members for years and seem intent on making the SBC tent smaller and unappealing for many.
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#627007
It's starting to remind me a little of what the Methodists were going through back in 2013 with ordaining gay marriage. It's like one day you had moderates, conservatives, and liberals all getting along and unified. And the next day deep division with everyone labeling one another.
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#627013
There seems to be an identity crisis within the church in general. Christians appear to be in retreat. Not sure where we are headed, but Reinhold Niebuhr may have said it best: "A God without wrath, brought men without sin, into a kingdom without judgement, through the ministrations of a Christ without a cross." We may already be there, subconsciously.
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#627014
While that element is there, specifically within the SBC it seems that the hyper-conservative wing is the rotten element that’s hastening its demise.
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#627016
From my perspective, it seems to have less to do with the theology and more to do with the mindset. Of course, it probably wouldn’t be too difficult to draw a line between the two, but I don’t think being theologically conservative is inherently the problem here. In my mind, someone like Russell Moore is the picture of theological conservatism. He would affirm basically any doctrine a theological conservative would have: inerrancy and sufficiency of scripture, anti-abortion, traditional sexual-ethic, complementarianism, etc. Yet since he wants accountability for sexual abuse and racial transgressions, this ultra-conservative faction of the SBC wants to wage psychological warfare against him. It actually kinda links back to your Neihbur quote. In practice, Moore is acting like he believes in sin, judgment, and repentance, while these “ultra-conservatives” seem to deny these doctrines pretty flatly with their behavior, even though I’m sure they preach on them often.
User avatar
By Jonathan Carone
Posts
#627017
Here’s the quote from Moore’s letter that stood out to me:

My concern about such issues is not because I believe in “social justice” (although, in the literal meaning of those words, of course I do, as the major and minor prophets tell us), but because I believe in the doctrine of hell. I believe in standing against racism not just because I love our African-American and Hispanic and Asian-American and immigrant brothers and sisters in Christ (although I certainly do), but also because I love bigots. And I believe that unrepentant sin, not brought to the light of Christ and cleansed by the blood of Christ, through the gospel, leads to hell. I really believe in hell. That’s why I’ve been clear for twenty-five years on abortion, on sexual chastity and morality, and on racism.
While he’s motivated to do these things because he believes so strongly in the wrath of God, he’s also motivated to show compassion and forgiveness to those who mess up where this ultra-conservative sect wants to heap shame and guilt onto people who make mistakes.
By paradox
Registration Days Posts
#627019
I see where you guys are coming from on that. Apparently, and from what I've been told, Baptists were all one prior to the split over slavery. That's supposedly how the SBC was formed. Moore's position would simply be the original Baptist position prior to that split. Is that how you guys see it?
User avatar
By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#627024
Just John wrote: June 4th, 2021, 2:04 am
TH Spangler wrote: June 3rd, 2021, 1:47 pm It was meant as a compliment to Dr Voddie Baucham
Do you have a man crush on this Voddie Baucham guy by any chance? :wink:
Just alot of respect for Dr Baucham. :wink:

Sad situation for OU athlete.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/former-u ... ical-views

"Although (McLaughlin) supports equality, social justice, and finds racism despicable, she disagreed with the WOKE culture and critical race theory advocated and practiced by two of her coaches who are the Defendants in this action," the lawsuit stated.

McLaughlin was told that she didn’t fit the culture at Oklahoma and coaches gave her three options.
User avatar
By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#629741
stokesjokes wrote: August 2nd, 2021, 10:30 am *bump*

Kicking a hornet’s nest, I know, but this is an important development in this conversation, especially knowing that “Fault Lines” has been relied on by many for their objections against CRT:

https://www.lambsreign.com/blog/voddies ... plagiarism
Reading about the author joel mcdurmon is more interesting than what he thinks about Dr Voddie Baucham. His theology was as twisted in 2010 as it is today?
By stokesjokes
Registration Days Posts
#629749
It’s not about what he *thinks* about Voddie Baucham, there’s textual and video proof that Baucham is willfully misrepresenting the original CRT sources and plagiarizing from James Lindsay. This has been corroborated by many others, but aside from that, you can look at the evidence for yourself.

I don’t care at all who Joel McDurmon is, that’s not relevant to the facts presented.
User avatar
By FlamesHighontheTide
Registration Days Posts
#629752
No offense to you stokesjokes, but I call strong LIES to this so called proof that Dr. Baucham willfully misrepresented the original CRT sources or plagiarized James Lindsay.
By JK37
Registration Days Posts
#629754
I appreciate the pains McDurman takes to make his case.

Why does he spend half his “conclusion” predicting the responses of others to his claims? Could it be he hopes to stem those responses before they happen, or at least to be able to say “I told you so!”?

@stokesjokes I am glad you don’t care who McDurman is, and I agree that wouldn’t be relevant to any facts presented. But relevant to this topic, what do you care about?

If Baucham did plagiarize Lindsay, do you toss aside Baucham and disregard everything else about Lindsay except truth as he presents it, same as you did for McDurman?

If McDurman is right that Baucham misrepresented Delgado and plagiarized Lindsay, what’s next?
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