A Sea Of Red

Is anyone else sick to their stomach in watching what these idiots are getting away with? This whole circus has been incredible, and they're doing whatever the heck they want. I know this crap has gone on for decades, but they've taken it to another level this time, much like the elections last year.

not any different than the patriot act the repubs rushed through years ago....it jsut so happens they were alot better at doing it than the clowns pelosi and reid.

I'd say it's completely different in terms of motive and effect on the country.

Actually, it's nothing like the Patriot Act, other than it being somewhat controversial. But the Patriot Act was not pushed through in the dark of night or behind anyone's back, and it was approved almost unanimously.

I'm not sure what's worse, the trillion dollars that they're trying to spend or the fact that conservatives won't vote for it unless there's more tax cuts. I'm all for not voting for it, and I'm all for tax cuts, but if you're gonna vote for it, somebody has to pay for it somehow. I'm so sick of tax cuts without budget cuts. It puts a stigma on the idea of tax cuts because they obviously don't do anything if you don't also cut spending.

ALUmnus wrote:I'd say it's completely different in terms of motive and effect on the country.

so essentially its ok sometimes.

and yes the patriot act was rushed through. regardless of unanimity, it was introduced and then voted into law in a matter of 72 hours.

dark of night? we've all had much of the info for weeks give or take a few numbers... none of us even had a clew

look i'm not happy about it either....just making sure we put it into perspective.

whats hilarious is that we were told this wouldn't happen and that things would "be different" and they are completely the same. so while we should still ponder tlearn from past actions dems can't use those actions as an excuse which they will, the "well the repubs' did it too" retort holds no water...as are any "well so and so did it too" arguements...

did you really just say "clew".

LUconn wrote:did you really just say "clew".

i apparently did.

We're screwed. You could pay a million dollars a DAY for 2000 years and not pay off what the Democrats are about to spend in ONE day.

This just as the number of baby boomers going off the payrolls and collecting gov't checks is about to double. O'bama is about to take the number of citizens that pay no tax from the mid 30% range up to around 57% thus creating a working majority of voters that will continally vote for their welfare status.

Tax cuts that stimulate the economy do increase tax revenues as evidenced during the Reagan years.

The bottom line is that our kids are up a creek. They are the ones that will be the most effected.

Baldspot....at least we can thank Arlen "majic bullet" Specter for his help with this one

scuzdriver wrote:The bottom line is that our kids are up a creek.

When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

I'm just sayin'.

Good luck with that. I'd suggest teaming up with Makarov. He's probably got anti aircraft weapons stashed somehwhere.

To be honest, I don't think it is that far-fetched to think there could be some sort of pseudo-civil war in the next 5-20 years.

LUconn wrote:Good luck with that. I'd suggest teaming up with Makarov. He's probably got anti aircraft weapons stashed somehwhere.

I was referring to the predicament scuzdriver says our kids will be in.

I am with Realist, though I think the timeline is slightly longer before the government becomes belligerent enough to actually get a rise out of modern Americans.

Baldspot wrote:We're screwed. You could pay a million dollars a DAY for 2000 years and not pay off what the Democrats are about to spend in ONE day.

I AM SOOO WITH YOU! WE ARE SO DOOMED!!

Realist wrote:To be honest, I don't think it is that far-fetched to think there could be some sort of pseudo-civil war in the next 5-20 years.

Or at least a war against China. It's a matter of when, not if, I'm afraid.

mrmacphisto wrote:

Realist wrote:To be honest, I don't think it is that far-fetched to think there could be some sort of pseudo-civil war in the next 5-20 years.

Or at least a war against China. It's a matter of when, not if, I'm afraid.

ANd China will "whip us" to use Billy Gillespie's favorite phrase when UK loses...

lol at China whipping us. When was the last time we even got to use the air force in a war? It's easy to forget.

LUconn wrote:lol at China whipping us. When was the last time we even got to use the air force in a war? It's easy to forget.

• 1. Operation Desert Storm (Gulf War): 1991
  2. Operation Deliberate Force (Bosnia): 1995
  3. Operation Allied Force (Yugoslavia): 1999
  4. Operation Iraqi Freedom: 2003

ie: pretty much every 4 years.

Saudi Arabia


Bosnia

LUconn wrote:lol at China whipping us. When was the last time we even got to use the air force in a war? It's easy to forget.

ever heard of an e-bomb? it would essentially render useless virtually every single advantage we'd have.

There is a range of possible attack scenarios. Low-level electromagnetic pulses would temporarily jam electronics systems, more intense pulses would corrupt important computer data and very powerful bursts would completely fry electric and electronic equipment.

In modern warfare, the various levels of attack could accomplish a number of important combat missions without racking up many casualties. For example, an e-bomb could effectively neutralize:

* vehicle control systems
* targeting systems, on the ground and on missiles and bombs
* communications systems
* navigation systems
* long and short-range sensor systems

U.S. forces are also highly vulnerable to EMP attack, however. In recent years, the U.S. military has added sophisticated electronics to the full range of its arsenal. This electronic technology is largely built around consumer-grade semiconductor devices, which are highly sensitive to any power surge. More rudimentary vacuum tube technology would actually stand a better chance of surviving an e-bomb attack.

A widespread EMP attack in any country would compromise a military's ability to organize itself. Ground troops might have perfectly functioning non-electric weapons (like machine guns), but they wouldn't have the equipment to plan an attack or locate the enemy. Effectively, an EMP attack could reduce any military unit into a guerilla-type army.

You don't want to have to rely on guns, grenades, etc. and hand to hand combat with the Chinese...

if China tried to attack us right now we would kick the crap out of them....after this presidency...who knows....its still hard to tell what Obama's plans are with the military...downsizing seems very likely though

thepostman wrote:if China tried to attack us right now we would kick the crap out of them....after this presidency...who knows....its still hard to tell what Obama's plans are with the military...downsizing seems very likely though

If China uses an e-bomb on the US we wouldn't stand a chance.

we would know it before it even came to that

you underestimate the power and the reach of our military

I am not saying it couldn't happen in the future...because its impossible to tell what could happen...but right now, there is no way

flamesbball84 wrote:

LUconn wrote:lol at China whipping us. When was the last time we even got to use the air force in a war? It's easy to forget.

ever heard of an e-bomb? it would essentially render useless virtually every single advantage we'd have.

There is a range of possible attack scenarios. Low-level electromagnetic pulses would temporarily jam electronics systems, more intense pulses would corrupt important computer data and very powerful bursts would completely fry electric and electronic equipment.

In modern warfare, the various levels of attack could accomplish a number of important combat missions without racking up many casualties. For example, an e-bomb could effectively neutralize:

* vehicle control systems
* targeting systems, on the ground and on missiles and bombs
* communications systems
* navigation systems
* long and short-range sensor systems

U.S. forces are also highly vulnerable to EMP attack, however. In recent years, the U.S. military has added sophisticated electronics to the full range of its arsenal. This electronic technology is largely built around consumer-grade semiconductor devices, which are highly sensitive to any power surge. More rudimentary vacuum tube technology would actually stand a better chance of surviving an e-bomb attack.

A widespread EMP attack in any country would compromise a military's ability to organize itself. Ground troops might have perfectly functioning non-electric weapons (like machine guns), but they wouldn't have the equipment to plan an attack or locate the enemy. Effectively, an EMP attack could reduce any military unit into a guerilla-type army.

China's military was pretty outdated even 10 years ago. We've advanced so much since then it's not even funny. Not only that, but they've sent their navy after Ethiopian pirates just so they have something to do. They haven't been in combat in who knows how long. The only thing they really have going for them is their enormous number of soldiers, and unfortunately for them this is not 1st century combat.
You don't want to have to rely on guns, grenades, etc. and hand to hand combat with the Chinese...