[stokesjokes]

Here’s what I’m seeing:

100s of people pushing past armed guards to get into the capitol building to stop the government from functioning.

They are doing so based on the motivation to bypass the political process and law to install their own guy as leader.

There’s a guy carrying around handfuls of zip-ties. There’s pipe bombs found around the perimeter.
There’s a noose set up outside.

Not everyone there was a bad actor or did anything wrong. More than a small number did.

[olldflame]

Yes. Let’s take over the Government with our Viking helmets. Such an over reaction. If they had wanted to do more they certainly could have. There were A LO
T of people there. Had they all stormed the Capitol Etc id buy into that line. No, these were a bunch of idiots trying to make a point and be Internet famous. I in no way condone what they did but I certainly don’t see this as an attempt to take over the government

In other news, feel free to check out who controls the Capitol Police

https://apnews.com/article/9c39a4ddef0a ... 07e4d03380

I think you pretty well nailed it. I'm not happy at all about what happened, but the comparisons with the blm/antifa riots are simply not valid.

How many buildings were burned down?
How many cops were blinded by lasers?
Were molotov cocktails or commercial fireworks used against police?

Pretty much any of the damage to life, health and property could have been prevented with proper planning by the DC and Capitol police. Looks like "heads have rolled", and rightly so, but too late.

[Jonathan Carone]

Here’s what I’m seeing:

100s of people pushing past armed guards to get into the capitol building to stop the government from functioning.

They are doing so based on the motivation to bypass the political process and law to install their own guy as leader.

There’s a guy carrying around handfuls of zip-ties. There’s pipe bombs found around the perimeter.
There’s a noose set up outside.

Not everyone there was a bad actor or did anything wrong. More than a small number did.

To add:

They were yelling things like "take back our house" and "this is our government" while doing it. Their motivations were quite clear.

[Jonathan Carone]

Yes. Let’s take over the Government with our Viking helmets. Such an over reaction. If they had wanted to do more they certainly could have. There were A LO
T of people there. Had they all stormed the Capitol Etc id buy into that line. No, these were a bunch of idiots trying to make a point and be Internet famous. I in no way condone what they did but I certainly don’t see this as an attempt to take over the government

In other news, feel free to check out who controls the Capitol Police

https://apnews.com/article/9c39a4ddef0a ... 07e4d03380

I think you pretty well nailed it. I'm not happy at all about what happened, but the comparisons with the blm/antifa riots are simply not valid.

How many buildings were burned down?
How many cops were blinded by lasers?
Were molotov cocktails or commercial fireworks used against police?

Pretty much any of the damage to life, health and property could have been prevented with proper planning by the DC and Capitol police. Looks like "heads have rolled", and rightly so, but too late.

There was a pipe bomb found (source) and "a cooler with Molotov cocktails" (source).

A cop was killed after being hit in the head with a fire extinguisher (source).

Rioters said "they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor" (source).

The comparisons are more than valid.

[stokesjokes]

My anger hasn’t really been towards the perpetrators. It’s the inciters.

We’ve known for months that this was a possibility. How many times was the question asked of Trump before the election if he would peacefully transfer power? We knew he wouldn’t and now people are dead. He asked them to come. He told them to March on the capitol. He said he loved them and called them special. In the middle of the whole thing he continued to lambast the VP for doing his job, fueling them further.

Eric Metaxas encouraging people in the name of Christ to fight and die.

Al Mohler saying it’s a Christian moral imperative to support this guy.

We knew this was what was going to happen, and what, we support him so that we can have the temporary power to enact policies we liked? The evangelical church is in need of mass public repentance. God help us.

[olldflame]

Looks like I may have unknowingly hit on something when I suggested buffalo horn guy should get an agent. Turns out he has done acting and voiceovers, so he may already have one. His primary affiliation seems to be with Qanon, and he has participated in Trump rallies in Arizona.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_Angeli

[TH Spangler]

I wish you had helped call out those burning and looting all summer? The MSM/left reminded me of the kid poking a stick at the chained dog. What could possibly go wrong.

[TH Spangler]

Looks like I may have unknowingly hit on something when I suggested buffalo horn guy should get an agent. Turns out he has done acting and voiceovers, so he may already have one. His primary affiliation seems to be with Qanon, and he has participated in Trump rallies in Arizona.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_Angeli

That's what happens to you if you watch nonsense like, "The Masked Singer".

[stokesjokes]

I wish you had helped call out those burning and looting all summer? The MSM/left reminded me of the kid poking a stick at the chained dog. What could possibly go wrong.

Those burning and looting were wicked. They weren’t doing it in the name of Jesus.

[paradox]

Wait a second, what are you suggesting?

[stokesjokes]

I’m saying people claiming the name of Jesus both participated in the direct action as well as stoked the flames leading to it.

[olldflame]

Yes. Let’s take over the Government with our Viking helmets. Such an over reaction. If they had wanted to do more they certainly could have. There were A LO
T of people there. Had they all stormed the Capitol Etc id buy into that line. No, these were a bunch of idiots trying to make a point and be Internet famous. I in no way condone what they did but I certainly don’t see this as an attempt to take over the government

In other news, feel free to check out who controls the Capitol Police

https://apnews.com/article/9c39a4ddef0a ... 07e4d03380

I think you pretty well nailed it. I'm not happy at all about what happened, but the comparisons with the blm/antifa riots are simply not valid.

How many buildings were burned down?
How many cops were blinded by lasers?
Were molotov cocktails or commercial fireworks used against police?

Pretty much any of the damage to life, health and property could have been prevented with proper planning by the DC and Capitol police. Looks like "heads have rolled", and rightly so, but too late.

There was a pipe bomb found (source) and "a cooler with Molotov cocktails" (source).

A cop was killed after being hit in the head with a fire extinguisher (source).

Rioters said "they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor" (source).

The comparisons are more than valid.

So, they found a cooler full of stuff that was never used. You could fill a warehouse with the stuff antifa/blm did use and another with confiscated things they didn't get to. Threats to the VP by a few extremists are not protected by the 1st amendment, and those making them should be pursued and prosecuted. Pretty small potatoes IMHO when compared to huge crowds chanting "down with America" and threatening Trump's life. One cop dead is too many, but we also don't know exactly how that went down yet. Not even close to the numerous LE deaths and countless injuries as a result of blm/antifa.

So no, I don't believe the comparisons are valid.

[rtb72]

I think you pretty well nailed it. I'm not happy at all about what happened, but the comparisons with the blm/antifa riots are simply not valid.

How many buildings were burned down?
How many cops were blinded by lasers?
Were molotov cocktails or commercial fireworks used against police?

Pretty much any of the damage to life, health and property could have been prevented with proper planning by the DC and Capitol police. Looks like "heads have rolled", and rightly so, but too late.

There was a pipe bomb found (source) and "a cooler with Molotov cocktails" (source).

A cop was killed after being hit in the head with a fire extinguisher (source).

Rioters said "they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor" (source).

The comparisons are more than valid.

So, they found a cooler full of stuff that was never used. You could fill a warehouse with the stuff antifa/blm did use and another with confiscated things they didn't get to. Threats to the VP by a few extremists are not protected by the 1st amendment, and those making them should be pursued and prosecuted. Pretty small potatoes IMHO when compared to huge crowds chanting "down with America" and threatening Trump's life. One cop dead is too many, but we also don't know exactly how that went down yet. Not even close to the numerous LE deaths and countless injuries as a result of blm/antifa.

So no, I don't believe the comparisons are valid.

At least those calling out the inciters in the most recent case were as equally as vocal last summer when cops were being demonized. Oh....wait....

"Pigs in a blanket, fry'em like bacon"..."what'a we want, dead cops, when do we want them, now". Politicians FAILED to reduce the tension and even added to it. This resulted in cops getting ambushed and killed. It continues in some areas with folks taking pop shots at cops.....and the media is all crickets. Taking over PDs and trying to over run federal courthouses, and NOW folks are mad. Back then, many of the same folks were saying "is police action against protesters just to protect property really necessary" All this "chest beating" and outrage NOW by many who were silent before. Get outta here!

You want to blame Trump for some stoking of the flame...sure, that's fair. Make sure you do the same with other sides last summer that heaped vitriol on another side and LEOs in general, thereby resulting in death and destruction. I don't think some were quite as.....shall we say, "passionate" back then as they are now. Why the change?

[stokesjokes]

I don’t understand why we are even talking about BLM/Antifa.

Are we so broken that we can’t reflect and lament on our own stuff and must always bring it around to someone or something else?

[paradox]

...because It goes without saying, since it's so pervasive with Antifa...that is, if they even exist. You know, passing judgments with a log in the eye.

[paradox]

Levin's general thesis is correct, however, Trump never seems to know where the real threat is. Instead, he focused on nonsense like CNN, Morning Joe conspiracies, silly virus briefings, and odd tweets. He only delivered empty threats about mail-in voting fraud, instead of doing something about it.

Seems like he falls into the same trap time after time. Imagines that Dems are his friends and not his enemies.

Trump had several months to organize something with these state legislators and set proper parameters. It never happened. And now it's too little, too late.

[olldflame]

Leave it to the Bee to put things in perspective.

[paradox]

I’m saying people claiming the name of Jesus both participated in the direct action as well as stoked the flames leading to it.

Ok, so these actions were performed by religious fanatics? Specifically "Christian" terrorists? Who, exactly, are these extremists?

[stokesjokes]

You’re right, I’m assuming some of those who went inside were claiming Christ based on signs and statements made from people outside. It may be so, but I shouldn’t assume without proof.

[paradox]

John Earl Sullivan is a radical BLM activist who entered the capital during the break-in. Seems like he wasn't alone either. His twitter is Jayden X. He posted footage from inside the Capital.

The guy uses the F-word and other expletives repeatedly and then says "be blessed" at the end of one vid. Just wondering if he might be counted as one claiming to be a Christian by some people's estimation?

I think it's safe to say that most people wouldn't entertain much thought regarding any serious religious affiliation with any of that.

[lynchburgwildcats]

Where was this sentiment and anger when this man was murdered last summer? Were these not domestic terrorists also? Or was it the action of the few that should not demonize a whole group? Both incidents and the subsequent collateral injury and deaths were abhorrent, but there is no room or privilege for the self-righteous rhetoric presently coming from either party.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -Dorn.html

Some folks were silent or simply said we need to look at the deeper issue, the "root cause". They said leaders were not "hearing" the grievances and thus, tried to justify the events that transpired last summer through the lens of this frustration. Is that different than what some on the otherside are saying now? In my opinion, there is NO justification of what happened this week or this past summer. If I'm not mistaken, both examples are the antithesis of what Dr. King stood for, even as he was sacrificing so much in regards to the very root cause of some very ingrained grievances. But let's not pretend either side has sound ground to stand on here, and I include ALL media, when it comes to the social unrest we are witnessing. Maybe it was "white supremacy". I haven't heard that and would be interested where the basis for that application came from. I would assert that position, short of proof, is one with little traction toward reconciliation, and quite contrary to any future uniting the country presently needs if only speculation and conjecture.

Problem with the current side’s grievances (election stolen) is that it’s based on a bunch of confirmed lies because they can’t accept the fact that one of their gods, Donald Trump, got blown out in the election and their other god, Q Anon, was lying to them for 5+ years with all their conspiracy theory BS.

Add...."in your opinion", and you'd be right. Many on one side feel YOUR position is a farce and simply hyperbole, much like you feel there was no election fraud. Whether your position or the other side's....both have validity, and to suggest otherwise is simply ignorant or intentional political bias. Not going to get in the weeds....but we could go back and forth all day finding "news references" to support either position, so to continue in such a way is really useless.

One has to be careful they don't reflect the very thing they sermonize against.....which in many cases is already happening.

Where is the stolen election validity? They’ve lost every single court case. Even Rudy Giuliani admitted in court he wasn’t litigating fraud.

[lynchburgwildcats]

I don’t understand why we are even talking about BLM/Antifa.

Are we so broken that we can’t reflect and lament on our own stuff and must always bring it around to someone or something else?

Because people don’t like seeing their own commit the same crimes they vilified and said they don’t do.

[stokesjokes]

John Earl Sullivan is a radical BLM activist who entered the capital during the break-in. Seems like he wasn't alone either. His twitter is Jayden X. He posted footage from inside the Capital.

The guy uses the F-word and other expletives repeatedly and then says "be blessed" at the end of one vid. Just wondering if he might be counted as one claiming to be a Christian by some people's estimation?

I think it's safe to say that most people wouldn't entertain much thought regarding any serious religious affiliation with any of that.

His Twitter took me on a rabbit hole, from November:

[stokesjokes]

As bad as it was, this could have been so much worse.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/202 ... pitol.html

Thread to show some planning out in the open:

[rtb72]

Problem with the current side’s grievances (election stolen) is that it’s based on a bunch of confirmed lies because they can’t accept the fact that one of their gods, Donald Trump, got blown out in the election and their other god, Q Anon, was lying to them for 5+ years with all their conspiracy theory BS.

Add...."in your opinion", and you'd be right. Many on one side feel YOUR position is a farce and simply hyperbole, much like you feel there was no election fraud. Whether your position or the other side's....both have validity, and to suggest otherwise is simply ignorant or intentional political bias. Not going to get in the weeds....but we could go back and forth all day finding "news references" to support either position, so to continue in such a way is really useless.

One has to be careful they don't reflect the very thing they sermonize against.....which in many cases is already happening.

Where is the stolen election validity? They’ve lost every single court case. Even Rudy Giuliani admitted in court he wasn’t litigating fraud.

Not debating it, we can go back and forth, like I said. If you believe everything the pundits and talking heads say...you aren't coming away with full accurate information. I can show references and data that systemic racism does not manifest in policing...just like I'm sure you can you can show it does through other mediums. There are references to both. Was their some issues with voting...to suggest there wasn't is ignorant, again, references all day long. I also know there is racism in policing (and most any other profession), and it goes in multiple directions. It's not just black and white. To put your head in the sand definitively is to ignore that there are multiple sides. Wide spread voter fraud...who knows, neither do you. Systemic racism....that's what you believe based on your intake of different mediums and experiences. I can say in my agency, I have not seen it manifest. I can speak to my experiences and analysis of data that would not support systemic racism. But sure...it happens and should be completely flushed out. So again....here we are. That's the exact place you don't start with unity. Marginalizing other sides or points of view. Of course, we can always go back to the hypocrisy piece and the larger point of.....regardless of ideology or beliefs, violence and rioting...no place for it. Self righteous sermonizing at one point, when the exact same situation, even worse, happened before with like minds and it's justified as frustration....hypocrisy.

Addendum: No, they weren't arguing voter fraud. They took the seemingly more obvious route of dealing with violations of state constitutions. Which happened. The SCOTUS never took up the arguments or heard any evidence. Many of the cases were similar, in they were bounced around or tossed based on technicality, not merit. SCOTUS put it back to the states, which was probably the easy way out...but also, probably the right thing to do based on state legislature's jurisdiction over elections.