[Purple Haize]

We should make Ron Paul dictator.

And NotAJerbear could be premier.

So Obama said today that he wants ' A new America where prosperity is shared'. Paul Ryan said 'We promise equal opportunity, not equal outcomes.'. Yep. They are the same

[Kricket]

Can't wait to see a Ryan-Biden debate. It will leave many wondering why Obama had picked him in tbe first place.

+1

I'm sick of hearing the Ryan bashing. Ryan is my Congressman up here in Wisconsin and I can tell you he is more conservative than most of Republicans,

That means almost nothing these days. His voting record is exclusively big spending government, loss of civil liberties, and perpetual war. That is not conservative.

Oh yes, I remember when they had that vote for perpetual war . Of course if you want to take all the votes you don't like and none of the other ones you can make him appear to be liberal, but I think even you know you're skewing his record. His budget would lower corporate taxes from 35 to 25%. He wants to fix spending to a certain % of the GDP (I think it was 20% initially and then down to 15%, I believe we're at 24% right now) and hold military spending at or above a certain percentage and social spending to certain percentages (can't remember the specific percentages, but I'm sure you know them) and change the tax code from 6 to 2 brackets. I belive that was 10% and 25%. He wants to help privatize a bunch of things like social security. Compare that to Obama who never has a budget because even liberals know his spending is way too much... Would you define those as conservative NAJ or are you going to continue to chase your tail in search of the perfect libertarian candidate?

[Rooster Cogburn]

This thread is POINTLESS! If you want more of Obama's deliberate destruction of America, than do what you want. If not, get on the Romney/Ryan train and HUSH!

[NotAJerry]

Oh yes, I remember when they had that vote for perpetual war .

He has voted in favor of every single one of the illegal military activities during the Bush or Obama administrations. That's voting for perpetual war as that's the basis of our foreign policy now.

Ryan's voting record is very clear regardless of what he's proposing. He supports massive government involvement in areas it has no Constitutional authority, he supports taking away civil liberties from people through garbage like NDAA, and he supports our constant, illegal military action around the globe. There's nothing good about his record. I'll believe he's changed, and taken legitimate conservative positions on things, when his voting record actually says so.

[NotAJerry]

This thread is POINTLESS! If you want more of Obama's deliberate destruction of America, than do what you want. If not, get on the Romney/Ryan train and HUSH!

There's no difference, in actual voting records and public support on issues, between Obama/Biden and Romney/Ryan. It's a vote between which steaming pile is attracting fewer flies. The lesser of two evils is still evil.

[Rooster Cogburn]

So just stay home, cause Reagan isn't coming back as a Zombie. The reality is that they are all corrupt to some degree. Sorry. However 1 guy's stated goal is to Share everything and to tear down our economy and the county until it's dead. If he get's 4 more years, he will get his wish. So, whether I like Romney/Ryan or not is totally irrelevant to me. I disagree with Mitt on a lot. I will vote for him.

They are totally different by the way. Romney does still believe that it is a government by the people, for the people and that PRIVATE business is important. Mr. Obama believes Government ALWAYS knows best.

[jbock13]

Rooster, you're not going to get anywhere with NotAJerbear. He believes what believes and if you don't agree with it, you're just a "blowhard who wants to argue with everyone."

I know it's difficult to understand his lack of rationality, but there's just no way to convince him.

[Purple Haize]

Oh yes, I remember when they had that vote for perpetual war .

He has voted in favor of every single one of the illegal military activities during the Bush or Obama administrations. That's voting for perpetual war as that's the basis of our foreign policy now.

Ryan's voting record is very clear regardless of what he's proposing. He supports massive government involvement in areas it has no Constitutional authority, he supports taking away civil liberties from people through garbage like NDAA, and he supports our constant, illegal military action around the globe. There's nothing good about his record. I'll believe he's changed, and taken legitimate conservative positions on things, when his voting record actually says so.

Which illegal wars again? Iraq? That would be the country that Administration policy from Clinton to W said should be regime change. The country that defied multiple UN Resolutions, and the country we are now finding out shipped their WMDs to Syria for safe keeping. The Congress did vote for a resolution of force, and could have cut off funding at any time. Don't think they would? You must have forgotten Vietnam and El Salvador
Or do you mean Afghanistan? The country that harbored the Taliban an Al Queda? That's a no brainer there. We should have just shook our finger at them like they were naughty little boys.
We are mustering out of both of those countries so your definition of 'endless' is limited. Of course, you could argue The Cold War was and is endless too. Who knew conflict had an expiration date?

It is a given that the Government has overstepped its Constitutional authority, but that's been the case since AT LEAST FDR. So what do we do now? Because obviously the world has not changed since the 1930's nor or place in it.

And nice cop out with the voting for the lesser of two Quote. I heard Jerry Garcia, Jerry Fisher and Penn Gilette say it. It was misleading then and even moreno now. Point one being I don't think EITHER is evil

[Kricket]

There's no difference, in actual voting records and public support on issues, between Obama/Biden and Romney/Ryan. It's a vote between which steaming pile is attracting fewer flies. The lesser of two evils is still evil.

There's no difference at all, but then one is more evil than the other? If A=B then can A > B possibly be true?

[Covert Hawk]

Here is you choice for 2012: Rombama!

Your choice for TARP/Bailouts, Stimulus, Individual-mandated healthcare, belligerent foreign policy, Federal reserve inflation, the Patriot Act, the NDAA, and every other big government policy that tickles your fancy!

[youtube]

[/youtube]

[Purple Haize]

Glad to see you are not paying attention. Are your tin foils hats one size fits all?

[NotAJerry]

They are totally different by the way. Romney does still believe that it is a government by the people, for the people and that PRIVATE business is important. Mr. Obama believes Government ALWAYS knows best.

Romney's voting record does not believe those things. He's pandering to get votes and nothing more. Romney the campaigner, and Romney the politician, have almost nothing in common...just like Obama.

[Purple Haize]

They are totally different by the way. Romney does still believe that it is a government by the people, for the people and that PRIVATE business is important. Mr. Obama believes Government ALWAYS knows best.

Romney's voting record does not believe those things. He's pandering to get votes and nothing more. Romney the campaigner, and Romney the politician, have almost nothing in common...just like Obama.

Keep saying that if it makes you sleep better at night. To say that there is no difference between Obama and Romney is just ignorant.

[jbock13]

Any of you staying up for Coast to Coast tonight? I know at least two of you are!!!

[Purple Haize]

Any of you staying up for Coast to Coast tonight? I know at least two of you are!!!

It just isn't the same since Art Bell left. I always like the West of the Rockies line.

[Covert Hawk]

Paul Ryan was brilliant when thrashing of Obama over Obamacare. Isn't it strange, however, that he didn't make any of those same arguments against President Bush over his massive expansion of the socialist Medicare program? I guess it isn't socialism when a Republican president expands entitlements.

Is everyone here just OK with TARP now? In case you haven't seen it here is video of Paul Ryan begging to pass the TARP/Bailout program:

[youtube]

[/youtube]

Don't you love the way the government is redefined as "the taxpayers"? Money going to the feds is going to the taxpayers, according to Paul Ryan.

As for the Republican Budget he presided over as committee chairmen. It posited an 833 Billion Dollar debt. How can any Republican, who loves to talk about limited government, balanced budgets, and fiscal conservatism even introduce a budget that wasn't balanced?

Also, if history is any indication the actual deficit probably would have been much higher.

Of course they have claimed that it will put us on the path to a balance budget by the year 2030. How many current members of the House will still be in the House in the year 2030 to ensure that happens?

Of course, it is brilliant posturing on the part of Paul Ryan himself, by throwing the burden of fiscal restraint on some future Congress while getting to play "hero of the day"

The Republican budget authorizes spending for things not authorized in the Constitution. So much for that 2010 Republican pledge to "adhere to the constitution"

So when Paul Ryan promised to adhere to the constitution when he ran for the house. He lied. But, somehow were are supposed to believe he is now telling the truth when he is running for a more powerful position?

[Covert Hawk]

They are totally different by the way. Romney does still believe that it is a government by the people, for the people and that PRIVATE business is important. Mr. Obama believes Government ALWAYS knows best.

Romney's voting record does not believe those things. He's pandering to get votes and nothing more. Romney the campaigner, and Romney the politician, have almost nothing in common...just like Obama.

Keep saying that if it makes you sleep better at night. To say that there is no difference between Obama and Romney is just ignorant.

Can you even articulate a fundamental difference?

[jbock13]

Cause I say so!

[Purple Haize]

I did earlier but you probably missed it watching the most recently updated version of Loose Change:
Obama: I want a new America where prosperity is shared
Romney (and Ryan): America is the land of equal opportunity not equal out comes.

Obama: move America closer to a single payer system
Romney: Repeal Obamacare. And if youdont know the difference between a State and Federal Mandateyour intellectually dishonest

Obama: GM type bailouts for other industries.
Romney: we have to let industries bottom out before they can be fixed

Obama: no budget. Plans on adding Trillions more to deficit
Romney: at least has a plan to slow run away spending.

As for TARP there are a lot of people who thought it was a good idea at the time, but after the 'bait and switch' felt it was a horrible idea. Looking back it was a horrible idea, but I understand the thought process in those uncertain times. Speaking of which,why exactly did ALLthe financial markets go hay wire at the same time? And how fortuitous for Candidate Obama.....now THAT is tinfoil hat worthy

Medicare D was not a bad idea in theory, butim not a fan.
And show me ANY budget since the 1800's that didn't have Congress spending money on things notin the Constitution.

[jbock13]

In fairness though, Romney wants to replace Obama health care with his own. In other words: more government intrusion into an already over regulated sector.

Plus, he was also a big fan of the bailouts. He can say perhaps he's changed, but to my knowledge, he hasnt yet.

That, and you're a resident blowhard if you don't agree with me!!!

[Covert Hawk]

I did earlier but you probably missed it watching the most recently updated version of Loose Change:

Never heard of it.

Obama: I want a new America where prosperity is shared
Romney (and Ryan): America is the land of equal opportunity not equal out comes.

Haize, please tell me that you can distinguish political rhetoric from reality. These are not policy specifics, but quotes meant to pander to constituencies.

Obama: move America closer to a single payer system
Romney: Repeal Obamacare. And if youdont know the difference between a State and Federal Mandateyour intellectually dishonest

So, your going to put your hope in a guy who instituted the same reforms at the state level while occasionally speaking positively about the Federal bill when it was politically expedient who then suddenly found the error in his ways when he decided to run for President. Well, good luck with that.

Obama: GM type bailouts for other industries.
Romney: we have to let industries bottom out before they can be fixed

Um... Please re-watch the video posted above. Romney supported to GM bailouts, TARP and the stimulus package.

Obama: no budget. Plans on adding Trillions more to deficit
Romney: at least has a plan to slow run away spending.

Of course, there is this:

Taking a trillion dollars out of a $15 trillion economy would cause our economy to shrink [and] would put a lot of people out of work.

Click here to read the rest

Yeah, I'm not that optimistic about the Romney Plan. If he believes reducing government spending hurts the economy, then why should he reduce any spending?

As for TARP there are a lot of people who thought it was a good idea at the time, but after the 'bait and switch' felt it was a horrible idea. Looking back it was a horrible idea, but I understand the thought process in those uncertain times. Speaking of which,why exactly did ALLthe financial markets go hay wire at the same time? And how fortuitous for Candidate Obama.....now THAT is tinfoil hat worthy

Anyone who understands how the free market works, like for instance the Austrian economists would have opposed that from the beginning. Do I even need to mention which recent Presidential candidate opposed TARP from the beginning?

Medicare D was not a bad idea in theory, butim not a fan.

Yes, it was. But I guess it's 730 Billion dollar cost isn't as sexy and Obamacare's trillion dollar price tag.

And show me ANY budget since the 1800's that didn't have Congress spending money on things notin the Constitution.

So, that makes unconstitutional spending OK?

[Purple Haize]

In fairness though, Romney wants to replace Obama health care with his own. In other words: more government intrusion into an already over regulated sector.

Plus, he was also a big fan of the bailouts. He can say perhaps he's changed, but to my knowledge, he hasnt yet.

That, and you're a resident blowhard if you don't agree with me!!!

Ha! Actually he said that he would have let GM go bankrupt and be broken up. He also said all of the mortgage bail out schemes would just prolong the 'agony'
As for the bank bailouts, that's a different story. Considering that there was a goo possibility that the crises on Friday would have meant people couldn't get money out of an ATM or Bank on Monday, something had to be done. Do I agree with what all the banks did with the money or some were FORCED to take the money? No. But other then GM that money has been paid back. Plus, there is precedent for it with the Chrysler bail out.
And I find it difficult to believe a Lew Rockwell/Alex Jones believer has never heard of Loose Change.

[ATrain]

In fairness though, Romney wants to replace Obama health care with his own. In other words: more government intrusion into an already over regulated sector.

Plus, he was also a big fan of the bailouts. He can say perhaps he's changed, but to my knowledge, he hasnt yet.

That, and you're a resident blowhard if you don't agree with me!!!

Ha! Actually he said that he would have let GM go bankrupt and be broken up. He also said all of the mortgage bail out schemes would just prolong the 'agony'
As for the bank bailouts, that's a different story. Considering that there was a goo possibility that the crises on Friday would have meant people couldn't get money out of an ATM or Bank on Monday, something had to be done. Do I agree with what all the banks did with the money or some were FORCED to take the money? No. But other then GM that money has been paid back. Plus, there is precedent for it with the Chrysler bail out.
And I find it difficult to believe a Lew Rockwell/Alex Jones believer has never heard of Loose Change.

People would've been able to get there money. There's this thing called the FDIC, which insures bank deposits up to $250,000.

[Purple Haize]

Yes they would have. But they wouldn't have been able to get it on Monday. The crash was so immediate and deep there were serious concerns of loss of confidence and a run. It was a very dicey (and suspicious) situation.

[jbock13]

The FDIC has $4 billion dollars to insure against $4.4 trillion dollars. I'm not a math major, but there's nowhere near enough money to cover that.