[coolhandluke]

I was using her a a general example of most people who support Obama. The way you interpreted my post was in a negative way unfortunately, but I did not mean to sound like I thought I was better than her, or any other Obama supporter. All I was saying is that its sad that most supporters of Obama cannot actually present a logical argument with concrete reasons as to why to vote for him. I think this has alot to do with media and with his charisma. I was only trying to get BnR to think logically about how having him as a president would ruin our economy and set up the weakest defense this country has ever had.

[thepostman]

I was using her a a general example of most people who support Obama. The way you interpreted my post was in a negative way unfortunately, but I did not mean to sound like I thought I was better than her, or any other Obama supporter. All I was saying is that its sad that most supporters of Obama cannot actually present a logical argument with concrete reasons as to why to vote for him. I think this has alot to do with media and with his charisma. I was only trying to get BnR to think logically about how having him as a president would ruin our economy and set up the weakest defense this country has ever had.

haha...he was joking man...whoever that guy is...he is never serious

[JDUB]

i think you're wrong postie

[coolhandluke]

I was using her a a general example of most people who support Obama. The way you interpreted my post was in a negative way unfortunately, but I did not mean to sound like I thought I was better than her, or any other Obama supporter. All I was saying is that its sad that most supporters of Obama cannot actually present a logical argument with concrete reasons as to why to vote for him. I think this has alot to do with media and with his charisma. I was only trying to get BnR to think logically about how having him as a president would ruin our economy and set up the weakest defense this country has ever had.

haha...he was joking man...whoever that guy is...he is never serious

yeah, I figured that. But I wanted to clear it up anyways. I hate when people think they are better than others and I didn't want people thinking that about me.

[SuperJon]

haha...he was joking man...whoever that guy is...he is never serious

[rogers3]

I have delved into the "real issues" and his stances on what matter most to me are why I am voting for him.

As I was saying, it isn't just about you... or me- it is about our country. As one that contributes at a much higher level than most, I recognize that liberal spending policies such as those that "Obamessiah" (lately, some are suggesting he might be a bit divine) is promising, will continue to shrink the pool of those who are bearing the majority of the country's tax burden. Secondly, Barack has indicated through past votes and through his (short) political history that he will be a president that, if given a chance, will appoint Supreme Ct. Justices that will weaken our Constitution. Yes, Obama's fiscal policies might benefit you, though through nothing more than taking from someone else for your own use; if he can promise this to many, it sure would help his cause, but it sure isn't promising for the future of our country and for our children. I have yet to see Obama present any intelligent direction for our country fiscally or constitutionally. I heard him challenged on those and other difficult issues and he sure stumbles and stammers.
I'm not the biggest McCain supporter, but he definitely has a better grasp on his own platform and his fiscal policies make much more sense than Obama's. Delve into both candidates stand on fiscal policy and you'll understand why I worry about an Obama presidency.

...stupid comments like "an intelligent person would look this up" refering to BNR as an unintelligent idiot that gives republicans a bad name. everyone thinks we think we are better than everyone else. You seriously sounded like you were looking down your nose at her. so please do all of us a favor and speak about the issue and not about the person.

Almost every pro-Democratic blog I've seen is full of comments insinuating that any Republican is no brighter than a burned out light bulb. I guess that is what gives Democrats a bad name!

[thepostman]

haha...he was joking man...whoever that guy is...he is never serious

haha...awesome

[Iwasneverhere]

I was using her a a general example of most people who support Obama. The way you interpreted my post was in a negative way unfortunately, but I did not mean to sound like I thought I was better than her, or any other Obama supporter. All I was saying is that its sad that most supporters of Obama cannot actually present a logical argument with concrete reasons as to why to vote for him. I think this has alot to do with media and with his charisma. I was only trying to get BnR to think logically about how having him as a president would ruin our economy and set up the weakest defense this country has ever had.

haha...he was joking man...whoever that guy is...he is never serious

It was only half joking. but in all seriousness it does come off arrogent to say stuff like that. but as for the rest i was saying in a joking matter. sorry if that wasn't clear enough. And SJ. that was awesome. thanks.

[BarackNRoll08]

This is not directed soley at BARAKNROLL but I find her stance typical of most of Barry's supporters. They usually don't know what he stands for, and very few even throw out his positions on issues. usually if someone says "Hey, this has already been tried and it has failed, why do we think Barry can do it better"? They either DON'T know it has been tried, DON'T know it has failed or simply say "Well because he is Barry Obama, and yes he can" which is basically what the ROLLER is saying. To paraphrase (And YES I am a fan of the Living Bible!) "I don't know anything about a president who has already tried the things Obama has, but I am sure it is going to work even if it failed for the last guy". To me, that is the 2nd most frustrating thing about Barry and his supporters.

I mean, I don't care... you can think what you want to think about "typical Obama supporters." Like I said, you're not going to get me riled up again. I want to be able to post on this forum without anymore drama. I'd rather leave again than have that stuff start again. Although people like HMO would call b-s on that, since I didn't leave last time.

Like I said, and this is also for everyone else, I have chosen my candidate, I know why I am supporting him, and that's enough for me. In this election, it's only adding fuel to the fire to try to get people to vote for one's candidate. I mean, most people have made up their minds anyway. I'd rather enjoy life instead of dramatizing it with this political bull anymore.

Besides, there are far better things to do with our time... like ostracize Edwards on the thread about him. ;)

[4everfsu]

As a younger man who didn't care about politics, once I had to start waiting in line for gas during Carter's presidency, I quickly got involved in politics. Needless to say I see Obama as nothing new except the 2nd coming of JC, Jimmy Carter that is.
Get ready to stand in line for gas,etc

[Realist]

As a younger man who didn't care about politics, once I had to start waiting in line for gas during Carter's presidency, I quickly got involved in politics. Needless to say I see Obama as nothing new except the 2nd coming of JC, Jimmy Carter that is.
Get ready to stand in line for gas,etc

Um, the president has very little to do with gas prices and shortage/overproduction of oil. If there is a shortage in the next 4/8 years, blame a lot of former leaders, but not either McCain or Obama.

[JDUB]

i blame AL GORE

[coolhandluke]

As a younger man who didn't care about politics, once I had to start waiting in line for gas during Carter's presidency, I quickly got involved in politics. Needless to say I see Obama as nothing new except the 2nd coming of JC, Jimmy Carter that is.
Get ready to stand in line for gas,etc

Um, the president has very little to do with gas prices and shortage/overproduction of oil. If there is a shortage in the next 4/8 years, blame a lot of former leaders, but not either McCain or Obama.

not true... look at history. Carter's economic policy led directly to the gas shortage. I think we are going to see similar problems with Obama in office.

[thepostman]

Carter can be blamed for a lot of things...but I am not sure if it is fair to put the gas shortage of the 70's completely on him...as with all economical aspects there is always much blame to go around...a president can only do so much..

[flamesbball84]

and expect the quality of health care to go down the drain too with his national health care policy that would remove patent protection for pharmaceuticals amongst other things. i guess he doesn't understand that the pharmaceuticals need the patent protetion in order to be able to make their money back from all of red tape involved with FDA approval. remove the patents, and it wont be affordable for companies to make new medicines.

also wants to raise taxes on the rich. there are articles published out there about local and state governments who heavily raised taxes on the rich and the governments tax income decreased bevcause the rich were finding more ways to get out of paying taxes than they did before so they weren't paying as much taxes despite the rate increases. also, companies are continually leaving the US because of high taxes and it being cheaper to operate overseas. raising taxes could very well lead to an increase in companies going overseas, leaving more Americans without jobs. if the cocmpanies dont go overseas and stay here in america, the companies will either take less profits (which isn't going to happen) or they will cut jobs and raise prices to accomodate for the higher taxes. so less jobs and higher prices, how does that help the middle and lower classes? oh and nationalized health care, yeah that will send taxes through the roof too.

apparently obama doesn't believe in self-defense eitehr. "As state senator, he voted against a 2004 measure that allowed self-defense as an affirmative defense to those charged with violating local laws making it otherwise unlawful for such persons to possess firearms.[198] He also voted against allowing persons who had obtained domestic violence protective orders to carry handguns for their protection.[197]"

Apparently cant make up his mind on Guantanomo bay either. he is an advocate of closing the detention camp there, but has never voted to close it.

[RagingTireFire]

As a younger man who didn't care about politics, once I had to start waiting in line for gas during Carter's presidency, I quickly got involved in politics. Needless to say I see Obama as nothing new except the 2nd coming of JC, Jimmy Carter that is.
Get ready to stand in line for gas,etc

Um, the president has very little to do with gas prices and shortage/overproduction of oil. If there is a shortage in the next 4/8 years, blame a lot of former leaders, but not either McCain or Obama.

not true... look at history. Carter's economic policy led directly to the gas shortage. I think we are going to see similar problems with Obama in office.

I'm guessing you didn't actually look at history before you typed that. Carter's economic policy actually saved the country and can't be blamed for lines at the pump. Here's why:

The energy crisis of '79 started when the massively corrupt and completely US-backed government of Iran got tossed in favor of the Islamic Revolution -- which is still a thorn in our side -- and western oil workers fled the country in droves, setting off a panic and cutting oil production throughout the Middle East. This led directly to the gas shortage. Carter's economic policy concerning oil was actually fairly free-market in nature -- Carter removed the price controls set in place by Nixon -- and pretty much saved the American oil industry. Also, as an aside, Carter's economic policy kept the country from descending into chaos. Sure, there were lines but, at least, there was still gas in the pump when you got there.

[Baldspot]

The gas shortage of the 70's had to do with the Arab Oil Embargo of '73 and was intended to punish the west for its support of Israel.

[RagingTireFire]

The gas shortage of the 70's had to do with the Arab Oil Embargo of '73 and was intended to punish the west for its support of Israel.

The Arab Oil Embargo of '73 ended in '74. We're talking about the Oil Crisis of '79 when Carter was in office.

[Sly Fox]

That's interesting perspective on the Carter administration. It seems somewhat unfair to paint the Shah and his government under such broad strokes of derision. Was he currupt? Absolutely but the same could be said of nearly every nation on the globe ... especially the monarchies. But he was a capitalist and a rare friend for the US in the Middle East back then. The same could be said for our new friends today in the Arabian peninsula.

Also, as an aside, Carter's economic policy kept the country from descending into chaos. Sure, there were lines but, at least, there was still gas in the pump when you got there.

Having lived through this time period I am having a tough time recollecting what Jimmy did to help the economy other than promote Billy Beer. Please enlighten me.

[RagingTireFire]

That's interesting perspective on the Carter administration. It seems somewhat unfair to paint the Shah and his government under such broad strokes of derision. Was he currupt? Absolutely but the same could be said of nearly every nation on the globe ... especially the monarchies. But he was a capitalist and a rare friend for the US in the Middle East back then. The same could be said for our new friends today in the Arabian peninsula.

All I said was that the Shah's government was corrupt. That's not derision, that's fact.

Having lived through this time period I am having a tough time recollecting what Jimmy did to help the economy other than promote Billy Beer. Please enlighten me.

I lived through it as well and, while it was certainly unpleasant at the time, one of the benefits of historical hindsight is a better appreciation for cause and effect.

In this case, I was referring specifically to Carter's removal of Nixon's price controls which had kept prices at the fuel pump artificially low. Removing the price controls caused the per gallon cost to rise which, in turn, caused gas shortages. Had he not done so, however, fuel companies would have simply shut down since they would not have been able to recoup their costs and, at that point, there would have been no fuel available at all and the nation's economy could have descended into chaos.

I'm not saying Carter was a great president -- or even an average president -- but its unfair to characterize him as an economically disastrous president, as conservatives love to do. He was just a guy thrust onto the worldwide stage at a really bad time in history and he never really stood much of a chance. He could not inspire people and did nothing remarkable for good or ill. In the long term,it turned out that he was really just warming the seat for Ronald Reagan.

[4everfsu]

Yep Carter was a genius

During Carter's administration, the economy suffered double-digit inflation, coupled with very high interest rates, oil shortages, high unemployment and slow economic growth. Productivity growth in the United States had declined to an average annual rate of 1 percent, compared to 3.2 percent of the 1960s. There was also a growing federal budget deficit which increased to 66 billion dollars.

The 1970s are described as a period of stagflation, meaning economic stagnation coupled with price inflation, as well as higher interest rates. Price inflation (a rise in the general level of prices) creates uncertainty in budgeting and planning and makes labor strikes for pay raises more likely.

In the wake of a cabinet shakeup in which Carter asked for the resignations of several cabinet members (see "Malaise speech" below), Carter appointed G. William Miller as Secretary of the Treasury. Miller had been serving as Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board. To replace Miller, and in order to calm down the market, Carter appointed Paul Volcker as Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board.[36] Volcker pursued a tight monetary policy to bring down inflation, which he considered his mandate. He succeeded, but only by first going through an unpleasant phase during which the economy slowed and unemployment rose, prior to any relief from inflation.

Led by Volcker, the Federal Reserve raised the discount rate from 10% when Volcker assumed the chairmanship in August 1979 to 12% within two months.[37] The prime rate hit 21.5% in December 1980, the highest rate in U.S. history under any President.[38] Investments in fixed income (both bonds and pensions being paid to retired people) were becoming less valuable. The high interest rates would lead to a sharp recession in the early 1980s[39]

[Realist]

I wish you guys had basic understanding of the economy and would realize the President does not directly control it. The President mostly just reacts to things that happen in the macroeconomy, and usually those are reactions to things that were beginning to take shape way before the sitting President took office.

[4everfsu]

Just like anything in life whoever is in charge good or bad, gets the blame or credit.

[coolhandluke]

That's not completely accurate. A president institutes his policy and it affects the way our economy works, whether you believe it or not. Its just that most presidents do not change the way our economy works, with the exception of a few minor changes. We are in some serious trouble if a president "CHANGES" our economy. For instance, if Obama becomes our next president, his very socialistic policy will mess up our economy and ruin the value of the already nearly depleted dollar, if he actually has the guts to institute it.

[Baldspot]

There's some truth to what Realist says but President Reagan's efforts to reduce the marginal tax rate, lower gov't restrictions on private business and his no nonsense dealings with the airtraffic controllers had dramatic effects on the economy and greatly increased the federal revenue as well.

Carter on the other hand was so bad, the democrats didn't even invite him to appear at their convention for a couple decades. I think only diehard revisioninsts would give him kudos on the economy.