HW Bush

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 2nd, 2018, 12:26 pm

TH Spangler wrote:
Purple Haize wrote:Let’s look at what NAFTA promised at the time as well China to the WTO. Pretty reasonable positions to take in theory. He was Envoy to China and understood what was going on at the time. As for the New World Order narrative, yes. It was. There was no Cold War. No proxy wars between Super Powers. There were no Super Powers, just the US. So yeah, after 50 years, it was a New World Order.
Not saying he planned for things to playout like they did. But he and his friends "reasonable positions" turned out to be very bad for Americans. Over 5 million US jobs offshored to countries we planned to control via trade. Then trillions in American middle class wealth transferred for the same reason. A hand full set themselves up as middle men and policy enablers and become super rich. Then China completely flips the so call New World Order ....“When China joined the WTO in 2000 with 1.3 billion people underemployed, it began pulling them out of the rice paddies, the farms, and rural areas, and putting them to work. The Chinese under-consume. They produce more than they consume, [in] a country that’s four and a half times as big as ours and relying on the American consumer to fund their path to wealth and doing so with a state-directed economy, which is different than communist, it’s a strategic mix of state capitalism with a little bit of private sector in it. We always thought communism would fail, but China found central planning 2.0 and is pretty good at it,”

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018 ... s-america/

History is not looking to good right now, time will tell :dontgetit
See? Even you admit there was a New World Order after the HW Administration. Not once did you reference the Soviet Union. I am going to assume you are old enough to remember waking up every day with the threat of global annihilation. The Warsaw Pact. Communist Rebels in Central America. That was the Post WW2 Order. After the fall of the Soviet Union there was....wait for it ....a New World Order. People believed there would be Peace and Prosperity.
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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 2nd, 2018, 1:11 pm

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TH Spangler
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Re: HW Bush

Post by TH Spangler » December 2nd, 2018, 1:23 pm

I voted for him, nothing but respect for his military service. But I think he made some very bad decisions when it comes to trade. That's where he lost me. Maybe if Trump can right some of that I can forgive and forget.

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 2nd, 2018, 11:00 pm

BuryYourDuke wrote:I’m not going to impugn the man’s character. I didn’t know him. I’ve read some of the things Cruzan posted, and some of them are troubling, others laughable. As a nation, we sacrificed so much to defeat the evil empire we ourselves were responsible for creating.

I tend to believe in my heart that HW was a good man. That being said, purely from a political perspective, his policies were horrific for this country in so many ways. But as I get older, and the nation of our grandfathers dies a permanent death, the legacies of men like Ronald Reagan and GHW Bush lose their shine. The degree to which Simpson-Mazzoli, NAFTA, WTO, and Gulf War I negatively shaped our country forever cannot be minimized. I suppose hindsight is 20/20, but there were a few voices calling out, warning these men of what their actions would bring. History should remember Patrick J. Buchanan as a prophet.

I would definitely contrast GHWB to someone like McCain. While I disagree with many of Bush’s decisions, I do not believe him to be evil. McCain...
I can live with that. I can only say the World was such a much different place then now. Buchanan may be seen as a prophet but at the time his policies would also have been detrimental.
Having said that, HW by every account was a good decent and honorable man. A man of a different era. As I said originally a man whose greatest strength was his greatest political liability. But I know those who knew him. I know their stories. The World would be a better place with more people of the character of George HW Bush.
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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 2nd, 2018, 11:48 pm

BuryYourDuke wrote:No policies are perfect. But if you imagine a Reagan/Bush administration that followed the advice of Buchanan when he was a member of it. Strongly anti-communist, yet firmly against unnecessary military adventurism and intervention that created blowback. Commitment to economic nationalism that would have prevented the destruction of our industrial base, and limited the rise of China as a world power to contend with. And finally, a strong commitment to actually protecting our borders and restoring sane immigration policies that would protect American workers, and American culture.

Surely other issues would have popped up, but It is difficult for me to believe this country wouldn’t be in a much better position had Reagan and Bush listened to their advisor Mr. Buchanan.
I’m with you 100% on this.
The rest we could have nice discussions on. Probably wouldn’t agree, but would not come away enemies. A trait HW would admire I think :D
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Sly Fox
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Sly Fox » December 3rd, 2018, 12:12 am

I was never a fan of 41 as President. But being in Houston I have had numerous occassions to interact with him over the past twenty years and my opinion of him personally is significantly higher. He has always been gracious to everyone with whom he interacts. He was a regular at nearly every sporting event in town since his retirement and made a point of being a real fan. It may be hokey but I respect that in the man.

On a side note, my family lived by the Barbara Bush Library for over a decade and walked by the statue of Robin at least once a week. The way 41 & Barbara approached family life has always been something I have admired. Then again, I got to know 43 fairly well back in his gubernatorial days and genuinely liked him even though I was disenchanted with his days in the White House. You can be a nice guy even if you make bad decisions. Sometimes we have trouble reconciling those concepts.

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TH Spangler
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Re: HW Bush

Post by TH Spangler » December 3rd, 2018, 8:36 am

Politicians are simply puppets for a puppet master. I see the Bush's as good folks, but with a very bad puppet master when it came to trade. Should have listen to Pat.

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Jonathan Carone
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Jonathan Carone » December 3rd, 2018, 9:12 am

Sly Fox wrote:You can be a nice guy even if you make bad decisions. Sometimes we have trouble reconciling those concepts.
This is how I feel about 41, 43, and 44. I disagree with many things each did, but I believe them to be quality men who did what they thought was best. I can respect that even if I don’t agree with it.

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Re: HW Bush

Post by thepostman » December 3rd, 2018, 10:45 am

What about 42 and 45??? ;)

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Re: HW Bush

Post by ballcoach15 » December 3rd, 2018, 11:36 am

President Bush is only President I have had opportunity to shake hands with.

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 3rd, 2018, 12:12 pm

ballcoach15 wrote:President Bush is only President I have had opportunity to shake hands with.
Well, did you take the opportunity?
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Re: HW Bush

Post by ballcoach15 » December 3rd, 2018, 1:25 pm

Yes.

(I also saw Carter, Reagan and Trump in person.)

Worked with Secret Service on Security Detail in 1985 on a Reagan visit to Fort Myer, VA

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 5th, 2018, 2:47 pm

What an incredible ceremony. HW has continued in death what he did in life. My respect for him was high before but is only higher now. Looking back at all the anecdotes on his life....wow. The people who visited him at the rotunda. Wow. The people who were helped by the ADA Wow. My top 3 take away images are Sully at the casket. Dole saluting the casket. W and Laura Bush with the Trumps at Blair house with all being gracious and kind. Just as HW wished.
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Re: HW Bush

Post by RubberMallet » December 5th, 2018, 2:58 pm

this is absolutely not how i expected this thread to be. that was pretty amazing. John Lear over here just made it gold.
Formerly ishbox.

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TH Spangler
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Re: HW Bush

Post by TH Spangler » December 5th, 2018, 3:06 pm

He has many good legacies. Unfortunately Danville Virginia and many more cities just like it are as well :cry:

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Re: HW Bush

Post by thepostman » December 5th, 2018, 7:12 pm

I use to work with some older guys who spent time at Camp David during George HW Bush's presidency and out of every president they had the honor to serve under, HW was the one who still to this day they remember. He constantly went out of his way to talk with the jr enlisted who kept the grounds clean and was often inviting people to play wallyball with him and the family. Working in an environment where you often brush shoulders with some pretty powerful people it was always refreshing to hear these stories. Just watching all of the coverage just cements what I believed after talking to these guy, HW was a great and decent man. That is why so many on the left and right have gone out of their way to pay their respects.

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 5th, 2018, 8:01 pm

Watching W and James Baker break down and cry hit me right in the Feelz today
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Re: HW Bush

Post by thepostman » December 5th, 2018, 8:11 pm

Yes, that was pretty powerful stuff

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 5th, 2018, 10:24 pm

After watching this I couldn’t believe how dusty my house was. Darn allergies

[youtube]RrRzED2vOHA[/youtube]
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Jonathan Carone » December 5th, 2018, 10:27 pm

I want to know what Jeb said to him as he sat down that made him crack up.

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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 5th, 2018, 10:31 pm

Jonathan Carone wrote:I want to know what Jeb said to him as he sat down that made him crack up.
I heard on the news tonight that one of them said “You almost made it” referring to him breaking down. The Bush’s were big on not being emotional in public. My wife pointed out that I made it to just about the same spot when I eulogized my dad in October :)
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Purple Haize
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Re: HW Bush

Post by Purple Haize » December 5th, 2018, 10:40 pm

Looking at the Presidents Row you could tell Bill Clinton was really engaged. He was reminiscing with W. Trump was really moved by the sincerity of it and I think appreciating the new level of detante between them. Carter. Man talk about a forgotten man. But he was openly weeping and you could tell he was feeling every word
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Re: HW Bush

Post by ElmersTwin » December 6th, 2018, 12:53 am

Purple Haize wrote:What an incredible ceremony. HW has continued in death what he did in life. My respect for him was high before but is only higher now. Looking back at all the anecdotes on his life....wow. The people who visited him at the rotunda. Wow. The people who were helped by the ADA Wow. My top 3 take away images are Sully at the casket. Dole saluting the casket. W and Laura Bush with the Trumps at Blair house with all being gracious and kind. Just as HW wished.
There is a slight possibility I teared up a smidge when I saw Dole salute the casket, and the look on his face when he sat back down. The last few days have been remarkable, and a nice break from the usual junk happening in politics.

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Re: HW Bush

Post by rogers3 » December 12th, 2018, 10:18 pm

Purple Haize wrote:Looking at the Presidents Row you could tell Bill Clinton was really engaged. He was reminiscing with W. Trump was really moved by the sincerity of it and I think appreciating the new level of detante between them. Carter. Man talk about a forgotten man. But he was openly weeping and you could tell he was feeling every word
I really appreciate the shared feelings about this man. I feel sorry for the people who have become so jaded by the wackjobs on the radio, TV, and in political office today that they think all people in poluu22Andrew3Andrew,Andrew


Aaa.....itics are suspect. I thank Rush and all the wingnuts who have tried to imitate him. Just my opinion, of course, but I felt that we lost one of the last good leaders when he passed.

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