[Ed Dantes]

Killing a person involves a person actually dying while changing political affiliation simply makes matshark type louder.

Yeah... I'd kill someone if it'd make the Matshark-types shut up.

[matshark]

Killing a person involves a person actually dying while changing political affiliation simply makes matshark type louder.

Yeah... I'd kill someone if it'd make the Matshark-types shut up.

My point can be summed up in one question.

If you could go back in time and kill Hitler to prevent the Nazi party from taking power, would you do it?

*note* I'm not advocating killing anyone, but answering the question does provide an answer for the statement in question.

Let's also not forget that God mandated genocide on at least two occasions in the Old Testament. So perhaps think about that before you answer as well.

[mrmacphisto]

Killing a person involves a person actually dying while changing political affiliation simply makes matshark type louder.

Yeah... I'd kill someone if it'd make the Matshark-types shut up.

My point can be summed up in one question.

If you could go back in time and kill Hitler to prevent the Nazi party from taking power, would you do it?

I think he already sort of answered this.

[Libertine]

Let's also not forget that God mandated genocide on at least two occasions in the Old Testament. So perhaps think about that before you answer as well.

You don't often hear an argument for genocide these days. I can only imagine how God must feel about switching political parties.

[matshark]

Let's also not forget that God mandated genocide on at least two occasions in the Old Testament. So perhaps think about that before you answer as well.

You don't often hear an argument for genocide these days. I can only imagine how God must feel about switching political parties.

LOL... we'll I'm not necessarily encouraging genocide, but I WOULD encourage people to consider those types of things before permanently deciding which courses of action may or may not be appropriate.

Further, I would also like to add that anytime a country goes from freedom to servitude, people ALWAYS die. Not just a few people, but a LOT of people. And a lot of GOOD people at that.

Do we as Americans have a responsibility to keep America free? Yes. Do we have a responsibility to encourage our politicians to remain ethical and moral? Yes.

Now as unpopular with Mr. Ed Dantes as I am, Ed, I'd like to pose a question.

Why is it you complain about losing a country, when you aren't willing to match your enemy's level of dedication to victory? They are willing to do (and have done) ANYTHING to win. While I'm not suggesting that Conservatives should cheat at re-counts, stuff ballot boxes or register professional sports teams and cartoon characters as voters - I AM suggesting that if Conservatives are not willing to do what is necessary to utterly crush the other side and eliminate the threat they pose to the continued success and survival of this country as the greatest nation on earth, there is no use in even playing the game because the outcome is already decided. Fighting without being willing to win only delays the inevitable defeat.

The question is whether or not you're willing to actually win? If you aren't, then stop criticizing those of us that are.

[Ed Dantes]

Let's also not forget that God mandated genocide on at least two occasions in the Old Testament. So perhaps think about that before you answer as well.

You don't often hear an argument for genocide these days. I can only imagine how God must feel about switching political parties.

LOL... we'll I'm not necessarily encouraging genocide, but I WOULD encourage people to consider those types of things before permanently deciding which courses of action may or may not be appropriate.

Further, I would also like to add that anytime a country goes from freedom to servitude, people ALWAYS die. Not just a few people, but a LOT of people. And a lot of GOOD people at that.

Do we as Americans have a responsibility to keep America free? Yes. Do we have a responsibility to encourage our politicians to remain ethical and moral? Yes.

Now as unpopular with Mr. Ed Dantes as I am, Ed, I'd like to pose a question.

Why is it you complain about losing a country, when you aren't willing to match your enemy's level of dedication to victory? They are willing to do (and have done) ANYTHING to win. While I'm not suggesting that Conservatives should cheat at re-counts, stuff ballot boxes or register professional sports teams and cartoon characters as voters - I AM suggesting that if Conservatives are not willing to do what is necessary to utterly crush the other side and eliminate the threat they pose to the continued success and survival of this country as the greatest nation on earth, there is no use in even playing the game because the outcome is already decided. Fighting without being willing to win only delays the inevitable defeat.

The question is whether or not you're willing to actually win? If you aren't, then stop criticizing those of us that are.

My theory? America is a democracy (not a true democracy, but a constitutional republic). If have theories and ideas that I believe are right for this country. I believe the opposing side's views on many issues are destructive. It is my job to convince people to support my ideas, so they can go to the ballot box and elect like-minded officials. If they don't see things this way, well, I'm not going to go out and start on illegal, surreptitious activities (a la ACORN) so that I win at the ballot box next time.

Look at it this way. I believe it is wrong to kill abortion doctors. I think any person with a modicum of sanity supports me in this belief. I'm kind of in the "what shall it profit a man, if he gains the whole world, yet lose his own soul?" worldview.

You, on the other hand, have justified murder, and at the very least, alluded to it, several times in this conversation, because it is for the greater good. That pretty much makes you a fascist.

Have fun with that.

[LUconn]

have you started a campaign yet for congress or did you give up on that?

[flames1971]

have you started a campaign yet for congress or did you give up on that?

[Kolzilla41]

Hey remember this thread? http://www.flamefans.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12547 I think we are on there now.

[matshark]

My theory? America is a democracy (not a true democracy, but a constitutional republic). If have theories and ideas that I believe are right for this country. I believe the opposing side's views on many issues are destructive. It is my job to convince people to support my ideas, so they can go to the ballot box and elect like-minded officials. If they don't see things this way, well, I'm not going to go out and start on illegal, surreptitious activities (a la ACORN) so that I win at the ballot box next time.

Look at it this way. I believe it is wrong to kill abortion doctors. I think any person with a modicum of sanity supports me in this belief. I'm kind of in the "what shall it profit a man, if he gains the whole world, yet lose his own soul?" worldview.

You, on the other hand, have justified murder, and at the very least, alluded to it, several times in this conversation, because it is for the greater good. That pretty much makes you a fascist.

Have fun with that.

I believe it's wrong to kill abortion doctors too. However, I certainly don't feel bad for them when bad things happen to them. For example, I thought it was quite fitting that the grandfather of the family that died in the plane crash in Butte, MT was essentially the dealer of death for millions of the unborn in this country.

http://www.lifenews.com/state3989.html

I thought it was quite interesting, fitting even, that the plane went down just yards from a memorial to the unborn.

Interestingly, regarding the greater good, i think you'll find that it's advocated quite strongly at LU. I used to be quite against the "greater good" preferring instead to do only what was explicitly and 100% without a hint of possible reproach by anyone. Boy was I naive. I'm a little bit wiser now having been burned many many times (mostly by fellow "believers"). I've come to the realization that if you aren't willing to win, you shouldn't even be in the game. Otherwise you're just another poor sap of an also ran. Vince Lombardi was pretty correct when he said moral victories are for losers.

Is anybody happy with "moral victories" after the elections in Nov.? How about moral victories after the government interjected itself into the banking and auto industries and let the door wide open for it to interject itself into the rest of the business world and ultimately into every detail of our private lives? Moral victories aren't worth much when the government decides it can tell you what you can and can't teach your kids, and what you can and can't believe.

I'm kind of laughing over here that you've called me a Fascist, considering there's no concise definition of it. Scholar Roger Griffin calls it, "[Fascism is] a genuinely revolutionary, trans-class form of anti-liberal, and in the last analysis, anti conservative nationalism." Am I anti-liberal? You bet. Am I anti-conservative? Um, NO.

What I do support is the Constitution and I oppose any and all threats to it's sovereignty, both foreign and domestic. If that makes me a Fascist, so be it. I'm pretty sure that makes me a Constitutionalist. Call me what you will, but I recognize the fact that there's nowhere to retreat to and our backs are against the wall. I personally refuse to lose on this issue. Whatever that makes me, I recognize that we're in a heck of a pickle, and that if we don't start swinging some hard punches, our kids and grandkids will be saying, tell me about the day's when you could say what you wanted without fear of the government.

Finally, I happen to take many of Mr. Jefferson's views when it comes to government. (along with John Adams and Thomas Paine)
Call me what you will, but (considering he wrote the Constitution) if I'm going to take flack from one side or the other, I'll quite happily take flack standing up for our country as it was originally intended, not the bloody mess it's become, or some convoluted arrangement somewhere in between.

[Libertine]

Just to sum up ...

• You don't advocate stooping to the level of your enemies but you are completely OK with celebrating when they get cancer.
  
  You're against gunning down abortion doctors but you are completely OK with smug joy when their plane goes into the ground.
  
  You're against abortion itself but you are completely OK with murdering someone before they get the chance to commit some evil.