[El Scorcho]

US demands air passengers ask its permission to fly

Under new rules proposed by the Transport Security Administration (TSA) (pdf), all airline passengers would need advance permission before flying into, through, or over the United States regardless of citizenship or the airline's national origin.

Currently, the Advanced Passenger Information System, operated by the Customs and Border Patrol, requires airlines to forward a list of passenger information no later than 15 minutes before flights from the US take off (international flights bound for the US have until 15 minutes after take-off). Planes are diverted if a passenger on board is on the no-fly list.

The new rules mean this information must be submitted 72 hours before departure. Only those given clearance will get a boarding pass. The TSA estimates that 90 to 93 per cent of all travel reservations are final by then.

The proposed rules require the following information for each passenger: full name, sex, date of birth, and redress number (assigned to passengers who use the Travel Redress Inquiry Program because they have been mistakenly placed on the no-fly list), and known traveller number (once there is a programme in place for registering known travellers whose backgrounds have been checked). Non-travellers entering secure areas, such as parents escorting children, will also need clearance.

Full Article: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/10/12 ... data_hell/

You will now need the government's permission to fly. Make sure your papers are in order before you travel. Don't worry what will be done with the information you provide. Just keep those papers in order and move when you're told.

And if you're rushing to your father's side while he's on his deathbed, forgetaboutit.

[El Scorcho]

Really? Nothing? No one cares?

I'm not asking for acknowledgment. I'm just surprised.

[01LUGrad]

I'm poor, so I don't fly much. Like..not in the past 4 years.

I should probably care more about this. Let me know when I need permission to run. Then we will have some speaks.

[ToTheLeft]

Wow...

[whmatthews]

That's ridiculous.

[mrmacphisto]

From what you've presented, it doesn't look like this has moved beyond the proposal stage. I really hope this isn't approved and put into action. It's just another way the terrorists would win.

[Fumblerooskies]

The terrorists win when we let our guard down and they strike due to our complacency.

[thepostman]

more government...fantastic...

[SuperJon]

I've never been on a plane.

[PAmedic]

I've never been on a plane.

yes- the circus normally transports your kind via rail car.

just need hay, water, and peanuts.

[mrmacphisto]

The terrorists win when we let our guard down and they strike due to our complacency.

So you're saying if these rules are put into effect, the terrorists don't win?

[El Scorcho]

Trust your authorities. Don't ask questions. Just keep those papers in order and move along when you're told.

[flameshaw]

I've never been on a plane.

Count yourself lucky. If you want to know how to screw something up, just look at how the airlines do it.

[mrmacphisto]

I've never been on a plane.

Flying is almost a necessary evil for some of us, especially those who can't always afford to drive to our destinations. It's not particularly enjoyable (in coach at least), but it gets you there faster and oftentimes more cheaply.

[RagingTireFire]

Trust your authorities. Don't ask questions. Just keep those papers in order and move along when you're told.

Trust the media. Don't actually read the proposal. Just read what the British tabs tell you and act appropriately outraged. I'm surprised at you, Scorchy. Did you not read the accompanying .pdf?

Basically, the upshot is that airlines will be required to provide a passenger manifest to the TSA 72 hours in advance so that the TSA can compare it to the no-fly list. It's designed to take some pressure off of the local terminal TSA representatives and, for the everyday passenger, doesn't change anything. You would only need special permission to fly if your name were on the no-fly list which that's already the case now. The 72-hour rule is based on the fact that 90% of airline reservations are solidified 72 hours out but, even so, if someone makes a reservation within the 72-hour limit, there is no additional restriction on the passenger. This rule would only require that the airline send a new passenger list to the TSA ASAP. Again, this rule changes nothing for the everyday passenger.

Honestly, this a tabloid making a big deal out of nothing and you all fell for it.

[El Scorcho]

Trust your authorities. Don't ask questions. Just keep those papers in order and move along when you're told.

Trust the media. Don't actually read the proposal. Just read what the British tabs tell you and act appropriately outraged. I'm surprised at you, Scorchy. Did you not read the accompanying .pdf?

Basically, the upshot is that airlines will be required to provide a passenger manifest to the TSA 72 hours in advance so that the TSA can compare it to the no-fly list. It's designed to take some pressure off of the local terminal TSA representatives and, for the everyday passenger, doesn't change anything. You would only need special permission to fly if your name were on the no-fly list which that's already the case now. The 72-hour rule is based on the fact that 90% of airline reservations are solidified 72 hours out but, even so, if someone makes a reservation within the 72-hour limit, there is no additional restriction on the passenger. This rule would only require that the airline send a new passenger list to the TSA ASAP. Again, this rule changes nothing for the everyday passenger.

Honestly, this a tabloid making a big deal out of nothing and you all fell for it.

It's a change in procedure that, if passed, could become exactly what they painted it as, whether that's what they say it will be now or not. If they wanted to make the cutoff 72 hours after this is passed, the wording is such that they could do that. It gives TSA too much leeway.

And they certainly haven't earned it. The TSA is made up of high-school dropouts harassing airline passengers while they follow the letter of the law rather than the spirit. They've made air travel such an open-ended experience that I think it's downright scary.

But hey, they're a government-run organization. Nothing could go wrong with a few procedural changes, right?

Edit: Also, did you miss all of the information about each passenger being gathered and collected in the TSA database? You go in there whether you're on the no-fly list or not. The whole thing is a huge privacy violation.

[LUconn]

Basically, the upshot is that airlines will be required to provide a passenger manifest to the TSA 72 hours in advance so that the TSA can compare it to the no-fly list.

Why would it take them up to 72 hours to check your name with the names on the no-fly list? Couldn't an excel spreadsheet do that in a matter of seconds?

[RagingTireFire]

So your objection is more Boortz-ian alarm over potential abuse of all things aeronautical. Sorry, but I see this as a good thing. This proposal would take the onus off of the TSA schmos at the gate and put it on the central computing system. I would have assumed -- in fact, I would have hoped -- that the TSA database was already being collected. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that the TSA would have a record of where I've been flying to and from and I don't see it as a privacy violation at all. Just think of the guy diagnosed with raging TB a few months back. They knew what flights he'd been on after he was diagnosed but not before. Sure, that turned out to be a false alarm but it could have been an epidemiological disaster. I'm no big fan of the TSA in general but I have yet to have a truly horrible experience with the "harassing high school dropouts". Like I said, this doesn't bother me.

And, LUConn, I would assume that they want 3 days because you're literally talking about thousands of flights into, out of and within the US every day.

[LUconn]

Come on, do you know how many things happen instantaniously with more occurances per day than people taking a flight? I swipe my credit card and seconds later the transaction is approved. How many other people are swiping that day accross the country? Or even at that moment? Are you telling me that I couldn't show up at the airport, and they don't have a computer that could check my name and SS# and crossreference that with names on a list in less than 3 days? Are they dropping of these lists off at the post office and mailing them to the head of the FAA for his personal approval?


edit: Perhaps I am oversimplifying what takes place in these 3 days?

[El Scorcho]

It doesn't bother me in the slightest that the TSA would have a record of where I've been flying to and from and I don't see it as a privacy violation at all.

As I said before, as long as you haven't done anything wrong, you have nothing to fear.

[jmdickens]

I have no problem with the proposal except.............i shouldn't need permission to spend money from anyone other than my wife