This is the definitive place to discuss everything that makes life on & off campus so unique in Central Virginia.

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By thepostman
Registration Days Posts
#600109


Here is what Jon is referring to.

I can't imagine all of philosophy classes would be canned. It seems like an odd move but I don't pretend to ever understand the academic moves in recent years, so why would this be any different.
By Thirdbase
Posts
#600112
This is just part of the first wave. Every school is busy this month converting all courses from Blackboard to Canvas, a massive undertaking decided at the last minute. They have until June 1 to complete it. After that, the heartless and ruthless purge of very fine faculty will be the largest in LU history.
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#600113
This pandemic will change just about everything. My friends in aviation are looking at even larger changes. I only hope we come out the other side with the freedoms we've enjoyed in the past.
By Thirdbase
Posts
#600116
No, we were NOT online ready when classes converted to online delivery in March. There is a HUGE difference between traditional LU online classes (self-study, on your own time, no live instruction or interaction) vs. the new model that was hastily put together in March. That was live delivery, which requires technology most faculty and students had never used, and a distance delivery method that most had never experienced. An enormous learning curve.
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#600117
And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?

And why are our professors finding out at the end of the semester when all the other jobs in the fall are already spoken for? If we knew we were doing this, why didn’t we give those employees a chance to find a new job?
By ATrain
Registration Days Posts
#600120
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:23 pm And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?

And why are our professors finding out at the end of the semester when all the other jobs in the fall are already spoken for? If we knew we were doing this, why didn’t we give those employees a chance to find a new job?
Is that last question one that we don't already know the answer to?
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#600122
ATrain wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:41 pm
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:23 pm And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?

And why are our professors finding out at the end of the semester when all the other jobs in the fall are already spoken for? If we knew we were doing this, why didn’t we give those employees a chance to find a new job?
Is that last question one that we don't already know the answer to?
If you have to find another career path, make sure it's one in the public sector.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600124
This has always been my biggest pet peeve with LU. It could/should be positioned as the preeminent thought leading Christian Evangelical University They should be at the forefront of Evangelical thought, practice, Apologetics, Missions etc. LU should be churning out great Evangelical thought Leaders. I have little problem with the formation of Political Think tanks at the University if there were corresponding Evangelical Think tanks as well. Instead..
By Rubicon
Posts
#600127
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:23 pm And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?
I have no idea, so I'm just thinking out loud here, but can it be that other faculty (maybe from the English department, for example) will continue to teach some philosophy classes at the same time as the department is eliminated? That is, there may still be some few general philosophy classes to fulfill general humanities requirements, but Liberty will no longer grant degrees in philosophy? That would explain eliminating a department.

It could be a practical matter of wanting to trim down Liberty's offerings by eliminating degrees it's hard to be gainfully employed in (other than in academia). What's the old joke? What does an employed Philosophy PhD say to an unemployed Philosophy PhD? Did you want fries and a Coke with your burger?

There are other departments that grant degrees that almost no one gets a job in, but Liberty doesn't have any of those (women's studies, gender studies, Native American studies, Latino studies, etc.). Other hard-to-employ fields, such as English or History, won't ever be eliminated. While there are a lot of unemployed English or History majors, it's not as hard to find work for jobs that pretty much just care that you have a degree. They aren't usually super high-paying, though.
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#600129
Liberal arts universities are under scrutiny for leaving young people in debt for degrees that lead no where. Might that have something to do with it. An engineering degree leading to a career in advanced manufacturing might make more sense soon.
By Yacht Rock
Posts
#600132
I agree with the idea of retaining programs that hold value.

However, I'd think it would be pretty important for Liberty to sustain this department, even if it was reduced, for students who really want to study the intersection of theology and philosophy.

And yeah, the timing stinks. But that's not anything new, from what I've heard from others for years.
By ATrain
Registration Days Posts
#600133
TH Spangler wrote: May 11th, 2020, 8:13 pm
ATrain wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:41 pm
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:23 pm And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?

And why are our professors finding out at the end of the semester when all the other jobs in the fall are already spoken for? If we knew we were doing this, why didn’t we give those employees a chance to find a new job?
Is that last question one that we don't already know the answer to?
If you have to find another career path, make sure it's one in the public sector.
Yes, you've made your feelings towards federal civil servants known already, and you don't even come close to answering Jonathan's question or my rhetorical response.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600134
Rubicon wrote: May 11th, 2020, 8:41 pm
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:23 pm And that’s an entirely (legitimate) separate issue.

I still don’t understand how an entire department - one that every student took a class in - now doesn’t exist. What’s the reasoning?

How did it go from absolutely vital every student took a philosophy class to it’s not worth it for any student to take a philosophy class?
I have no idea, so I'm just thinking out loud here, but can it be that other faculty (maybe from the English department, for example) will continue to teach some philosophy classes at the same time as the department is eliminated? That is, there may still be some few general philosophy classes to fulfill general humanities requirements, but Liberty will no longer grant degrees in philosophy? That would explain eliminating a department.

It could be a practical matter of wanting to trim down Liberty's offerings by eliminating degrees it's hard to be gainfully employed in (other than in academia). What's the old joke? What does an employed Philosophy PhD say to an unemployed Philosophy PhD? Did you want fries and a Coke with your burger?

There are other departments that grant degrees that almost no one gets a job in, but Liberty doesn't have any of those (women's studies, gender studies, Native American studies, Latino studies, etc.). Other hard-to-employ fields, such as English or History, won't ever be eliminated. While there are a lot of unemployed English or History majors, it's not as hard to find work for jobs that pretty much just care that you have a degree. They aren't usually super high-paying, though.
Why not have the Film Studies Faculty teach World History? Or the Exercise Science Department pick up the Bible classes?
Their is a unique quality to training the next generation of great Evangelical thought leaders. LU was/is in a rare and ideal position to capitalize on that. Instead it would rather focus on the Earthly Kingdom than the Heavenly Kingdom
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600137
TH Spangler wrote: May 11th, 2020, 8:50 pm Liberal arts universities are under scrutiny for leaving young people in debt for degrees that lead no where. Might that have something to do with it. An engineering degree leading to a career in advanced manufacturing might make more sense soon.
A person interested in understanding the thought process of Christian leaders and how we can best integrate Evangelical thought in the Modern World is not someone who will usually be interested in engineering. The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
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By Ill flame
Posts
#600139
Purple Haize wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:31 pm
A person interested in understanding the thought process of Christian leaders and how we can best integrate Evangelical thought in the Modern World is not someone who will usually be interested in engineering. The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
I don't think it takes a degree in philosophy for a person to understand a Christians place in these changing times. Biblical studies seems to fit the description a lot better. At least that leads to a career.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600140
Ill flame wrote: May 11th, 2020, 10:23 pm
Purple Haize wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:31 pm
A person interested in understanding the thought process of Christian leaders and how we can best integrate Evangelical thought in the Modern World is not someone who will usually be interested in engineering. The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
I don't think it takes a degree in philosophy for a person to understand a Christians place in these changing times. Biblical studies seems to fit the description a lot better. At least that leads to a career.
Yes and no. It’s certainly not a high volume career field that’s for sure. But it does take Philosophers to ask and ponder questions that need to be asked and pondered. If they are not trained from an Evangelical or Christian point of view, where will they be trained? How will future generations “know thyself’ if they have no one to train them?
https://members.classicalconversations. ... philosophy
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#600141
ATrain wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:08 pm
TH Spangler wrote: May 11th, 2020, 8:13 pm
ATrain wrote: May 11th, 2020, 7:41 pm

Is that last question one that we don't already know the answer to?
If you have to find another career path, make sure it's one in the public sector.
Yes, you've made your feelings towards federal civil servants known already, and you don't even come close to answering Jonathan's question or my rhetorical response.
I have no problem civil servants. I was raised by two. Just pointing out they rarely deal with lose of employment, pay or benefit cuts. Great retirement package. A better career path these days.
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By Jonathan Carone
Posts
#600142
Purple Haize wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:31 pm The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
Totally random, but I own a web design business and got an ad for a new ThD from Evangelical that was reeeaallly intriguing. It was all about "social, systemic and relational flourishing, the constituents of meaningful and successful living and the application of the aforementioned to ministry."

So I guess I'm the outlier in your example.
Purple Haize liked this
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By TH Spangler
Registration Days Posts
#600144
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 10:38 pm
Purple Haize wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:31 pm The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
Totally random, but I own a web design business and got an ad for a new ThD from Evangelical that was reeeaallly intriguing. It was all about "social, systemic and relational flourishing, the constituents of meaningful and successful living and the application of the aforementioned to ministry."

So I guess I'm the outlier in your example.
Johnathan not sure what your profit per year is with your private sector business, but a friend with your skill set just did a little research, he said it pays 100k per year in the civil service world in Norfolk. Includes great benefits. Once you get in you're in for life. It's almost impossible to get fired. It's a great career path if you ever need a new one.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600145
Jonathan Carone wrote: May 11th, 2020, 10:38 pm
Purple Haize wrote: May 11th, 2020, 9:31 pm The person who wants to understand a Christians place in these changing times is not someone who will generally be interested in Coding.
Totally random, but I own a web design business and got an ad for a new ThD from Evangelical that was reeeaallly intriguing. It was all about "social, systemic and relational flourishing, the constituents of meaningful and successful living and the application of the aforementioned to ministry."

So I guess I'm the outlier in your example.
Are you going to pursue it? If not then you’re not an outlier. If you were not happy doing what you were doing and did not find fulfillment in it, then pursued it than maybe. But being intrigued by something and actually doing it are two entirely different things
By rogers3
Registration Days Posts
#600148
My guess is that all PHIL classes will be lower level only and will be all online. I'm thinking that some of these canned professors will be offered positions to teach these new online offerings at a substantially discounted pay scale. Bottom line, there is little that is Christian in the leadership at Liberty.
What do you expect when your school is run by a real estate lawyer, a retail petroleum guy and a rather crusty old TV station manager. What a bunch of clowns.
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By Purple Haize
Registration Days Posts
#600161
rogers3 wrote: May 12th, 2020, 8:12 am My guess is that all PHIL classes will be lower level only and will be all online. I'm thinking that some of these canned professors will be offered positions to teach these new online offerings at a substantially discounted pay scale. Bottom line, there is little that is Christian in the leadership at Liberty.
What do you expect when your school is run by a real estate lawyer, a retail petroleum guy and a rather crusty old TV station manager. What a bunch of clowns.
Well for years the fear is that LU would become a school that used to a Christian university like all the others before. Now in 2020....
Just John, phoenix liked this
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