[rogers3]

Anyone know the story? The news didn't give any details at all and the school didn't release any.

[Schfourteenteen]

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/local/a ... 0f31a.html

Some troubling details, including this tidbit below

.....said Johnnie Moore, spokesperson for LU.

[Purple Haize]

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/local/a ... 0f31a.html

Some troubling details, including this tidbit below

.....said Johnnie Moore, spokesperson for LU.

'There is no safety concern'
Somebody got shot but there is no safety concern. We don't know if the shooter was in custody, but there is no safety concern. I can think of at least 1 person who would take grave exception to that analysis

[jcmanson]

Liberty releases a statement - http://www.liberty.edu/index.cfm?PID=18 ... um=twitter

"Liberty University confirms initial reports that there was an altercation between a Liberty University Emergency Services Officer and a male student that led to a shooting last night at a women’s-only residential hall (Residential Annex II) that is under investigation by the Lynchburg Police Department. The entire campus, including Annex I & II, are open and operating as normal. This appears to be an isolated incident and there is not any ongoing concern for the safety of students or the community."

[prototype]

6 or 7 shots? Hope that student had a gun and was firing too. Not many situations would justify that many shots unless the other guy had a gun too. End of the day - you have to respect an officer and I have no problem with them using force to protect themselves.

[jcmanson]

It was a male in a female dorm at 4am.

[Purple Haize]

It was a male in a female dorm at 4am.

Exactly. And there was a shooting recently in that neighborhood.

I have no problem with the number of shots fired. In those situations it's nearly impossible to control how often you shoot. It's why the military teaches short controlled bursts because most people just pull and hold the trigger. Also, it's not the movies, you don't hit the person on every shot and even when you do they don't just fall down after the first hit.
Then there's the entire 9mm v .45 caliber discussion.
Finally, an eye witness who got startled out of bed, let alone someone fully awake isn't going to be able to accurately describe the number of shots they heard.

[ATrain]

There are definitley details that need to be sorted out here...why was the male in the dorm in the first place and what was he doing there? How did he get in? Was he armed? How long had he been in there? Who else is involved?

Definitely prayers for all involved though. This is a sad tragedy to have happened at our school

[makarov97]

...

[Purple Haize]

6 or 7 shots? Hope that student had a gun and was firing too. Not many situations would justify that many shots unless the other guy had a gun too. End of the day - you have to respect an officer and I have no problem with them using force to protect themselves.

That is simply not true. When one is faced with an imminent threat of deadly force, the appropriate response is to stop the threat. There is no magic formula for the response. If someone is on top of you choking your or bashing your head into the ground, you would be perfectly justified in pulling a gun and shooting until the threat ceased.

Unlike what is shown in the movies, handguns are notoriously bad for stopping threats immediately. People often do not stop even after receiving multiple rounds.

There was a shooting involving a South Carolina Highway Patrolman in the early 90s. The Trooper was attacked by a very large man on a traffic stop. The suspect pulled a .22 NAA pistol from his pocket. The Trooper managed to get up and shot the suspect center mass 5 times with his .357 Magnum revolver. Not only did the suspect not die, but he was able to return fire and hit the Trooper under the armpit with a single shot from his .22. The round from the .22 missed the Trooper's vest, went between two ribs and hit the Trooper's aorta.

The Trooper did not live. The suspect is currently serving life in prison.

Another example is the FBI Miami Shootout in 1986 one of the suspects in the shooting, Michael Lee Platt, managed to kill 2 FBI agents and wound multiple others before he was finally brought down after absorbing multiple rounds from the agents.

Hmm. Sounds like a post I made earlier. HA

[jcmanson]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/edu ... ingtonpost

"The university said it had received reports that the student attacked the officer with a sledgehammer."

[Purple Haize]

Removed for sensitivities sake
See, I'm not too unreasonable

[PAmedic]

Prayers for all involved and their families.

God bless my brothers and sisters on the job who walk dark streets at 0 dark thirty keeping the good guys/girls safe.

I've got midniters all week this tour and $%^ jumps off quick- no joke.

FYI: we don't count rounds we eliminate a threat.

[Sly Fox]

I don't say this often, but in this case I agree with PAmedic's position. The facts are still trickling out.

Regardless of the circumstances, there are a ton of folks needing prayer right now. From the family of the guy who died to his friends and to the likely witnesses and finally to the guy who had to pull the trigger. There are no winners in a tragedy such as this one. Everyone suffers.

[thepostman]

Makarov must have some kind of alert setup for when guns get mentioned on flamefans.

This is just sad all around.

[Rooster Cogburn]

I echo Sly's statement that it's a sad mess all the way around. And PA I thank you and all the officers for your service. Unless you are in a situation like this it's hard to say what you would do. We may never have all the facts. Just Pray!

And Haize, I respect you and your first amendment rights and all, but that is out of bounds. A young man is dead and an officer wounded emotionally and maybe physically. Just MHO.

[Purple Haize]

I echo Sly's statement that it's a sad mess all the way around. And PA I thank you and all the officers for your service. Unless you are in a situation like this it's hard to say what you would do. We may never have all the facts. Just Pray!

And Haize, I respect you and your first amendment rights and all, but that is out of bounds. A young man is dead and an officer wounded emotionally and maybe physically. Just MHO.

A man attacking an officer is dead and people are questioning the amount of shots fired by the officer and I'm out of bounds?
I pray for the officer and hope he doesn't get reprimanded. As PA said, you eliminate the threat.
I mock the attacker for being an idiot.

[ATrain]

I also agree that an officer (or anyone for that matter), when defending oneself, needs to do whatever is necessary in order to protect their own life...if that means 6, 7 or 600-700 rounds, then thats what it means.

[bballfan84]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/edu ... ingtonpost

"The university said it had received reports that the student attacked the officer with a sledgehammer."

Too soon?

yes too soon, not really something to joke about

[Rooster Cogburn]

A video posted as a joke in a not funny situation is kinda wrong, NO?

Anyway, I totally agree that the officer had to use the force he deemed necessary to stop the situation. None of us know exactly what happened, but I trust that if it was a sledgehammer then the officer did what he had to do.

And by the way, can we pause at the 6 or 7 shots for a while. All we have is a kid in the annex across the street (hundreds of yards away) saying he heard 6 or 7 bangs.

[Rooster Cogburn]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/edu ... ingtonpost

"The university said it had received reports that the student attacked the officer with a sledgehammer."

Too soon?

yes too soon, not really something to joke about

Thank you!

[Purple Haize]

The officer could have totally been in the right...or he could have totally been in the wrong. No one knows anything yet. Do our officers carry non or less lethal weapons like tasers?

I will be honest. I am a little bit bothered by statements like "eliminate the threat". The police aren't the military. They aren't fighting a war. They exist to protect the citizens, and that includes those that are breaking the law. The amount of force used should be the minimum necessary to protect the lives of everyone involved in an incident. I know what comes next...the "until you are in that situation yada yada yada" speech. That's the thing, just like I took an oath to do my job, and got trained for bad situations, so do the police. No one forced them to become cops, and they should be held to a much higher standard than the lay person.

Like I said earlier, I hope that this is exactly what occurred, that the officer did exactly what had to be done, and nothing more.

If a man is coming at me with a sledgehammer, I would rather use too much force than not enough. Tasers are very over rated. Adrenalin, bulky clothes and drugs can greatly diminish their effectiveness. Granted, if you get taxed in a training exercise its a painful experience but in the real world their failure rate is significant.
I'm not sure where it states that you should use the minimum amount of force needed in the Police Code. It might, I'm just saying I haven't heard of it. Necessary force I've heard, but not minimum.

[alabama24]

Student ID'd as Joshua Hathaway, 19, of Lubbock, Texas. I don't know if this is the same student or not, but he is from somewhere in TX:

http://www.kcbd.com/story/22732360/head-of-the-class

[makarov97]

...

[ATrain]

Student ID'd as Joshua Hathaway, 19, of Lubbock, Texas. I don't know if this is the same student or not, but he is from somewhere in TX:

http://www.kcbd.com/story/22732360/head-of-the-class

And now WSET with the link:

http://www.wset.com/story/24013282/new- ... by-officer