This is the definitive place to discuss everything that makes life on & off campus so unique in Central Virginia.

Moderators: jcmanson, Sly Fox, BuryYourDuke

#578842
Not all things are expanding. This has always been a source of interest of mine because I’ve always felt that the amount of money LU has brought in could help propel the Divinity department to world class status. Apparently that has been a pipe dream. And it’s sad

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/201 ... ty-faculty
#578849
Here's where I land after reading that:

1) This is data confirming some people who want ministry training don't want to be associated with Liberty because of the Trump connections.

2) Liberty is adapting to a changing environment (ie requiring business classes for ministry degrees, realizing bi-vocational ministry is on the rise, etc).
#578856
That’s not my point. My point is that if LU wants to be what it claims to be it needs to be on the forefront of Evangelical and Christian thought. It needs to be a destination for Christian Scholars and thinkers. It’s faculty should be world renown for their thoughts on Evangelical World view. They have the resources to make that happen. I get focusing on the emerging segment of lay church leaders. That is certainly an unmet area. But saying you want your graduates to be PT Barnum is just head scratching. If we are going with initials he could have gone with CS Lewis. Billy Sunday would be another good example. DL Moody? Instead I fear it’s moving more towards Elmer Gantry
#578857
I think those issues are all connected. My guess is that many (not all) top theologians don't want to be at Liberty due to a variety of leadership issues, including Jr.'s focus on politics over the school's mission.

I know that the SOR, now Divinity has been working on working business curriculum into their programs for awhile. I've had some great discussions with some of the leaders over there and it's a great area to focus on.

I also know that for years they've been talking about how more students prefer to pursue their religious studies online while working with their local church instead of through a resident program. Through that they are easily able to both accomplish their educational goals, while engaging in practical experience in the field.

One of the things that stood out to me was the comical exchange about enrollment numbers. No surprise there, but I just found it funny. I also found the giant drop off of Freshman applicants to be interesting. I'm not in the industry, but selecting a residential school is a big decision. Would a student not apply just because it has an application fee? I believe there would be some drop off but I assume it would be smaller and also wouldn't grow year over year after an application fee was introduced.
#578858
The article did state other schools were not having the drop off LU has had
And I’ll push back a little on the Theologians issue. It’s not just about attracting them it’s about them becoming great Theologians while at LU. While it’s a different field Jordan Peterson became who he is where he is. Why can’t LU produce something similar? I get the whole “We are a teaching institution “ thing. But you can have both. Tearing down and rebuilding a FOC that’s less than 15 years old while firing people in your core mission isn’t a good look. IMO that should bexpanded not contracted
#578861
Purple Haize wrote: June 17th, 2019, 11:15 am That’s not my point. My point is that if LU wants to be what it claims to be it needs to be on the forefront of Evangelical and Christian thought. It needs to be a destination for Christian Scholars and thinkers. It’s faculty should be world renown for their thoughts on Evangelical World view. They have the resources to make that happen.
I think the two are more connected than you would like them to be. Jerry's alliance with Trump and his public statements regarding politics and Christianity over the last 3-4 years has turned off a lot of pastors or pastor types from Liberty. I have pastor friends who are Liberty grads who don't tell people where they went to school because of it. I know others who were pursuing a graduate degree while working in their church (like has been mentioned here) who decided to move their studies to a different school because of the political baggage.

My point being: you cannot be the institution you're talking about while also leading the way Jerry has chosen to lead. Most modern church leaders don't ascribe to the idea that Republicanism and the Gospel are tied together. There's a more moderate view understanding the Gospel is bigger than the two party governmental system we live under. When you sell out completely to Republicanism, you're not going to be able to attract the top theologians because those theologians disagree with your worldview.
#578863
Purple Haize wrote: June 17th, 2019, 12:49 pm The article did state other schools were not having the drop off LU has had
And I’ll push back a little on the Theologians issue. It’s not just about attracting them it’s about them becoming great Theologians while at LU. While it’s a different field Jordan Peterson became who he is where he is. Why can’t LU produce something similar? I get the whole “We are a teaching institution “ thing. But you can have both. Tearing down and rebuilding a FOC that’s less than 15 years old while firing people in your core mission isn’t a good look. IMO that should bexpanded not contracted
I think it’s a combination of bringing up top thinkers and attracting top talent. I think part of building a robust institution is to have a diversity of experience that would come from thinkers who didn’t cut their teeth within the LU bubble. That’s just what I would look for. But that’s just my opinion on what I would want in any program.
#578865
Yacht Rock wrote: June 17th, 2019, 1:12 pm
Purple Haize wrote: June 17th, 2019, 12:49 pm The article did state other schools were not having the drop off LU has had
And I’ll push back a little on the Theologians issue. It’s not just about attracting them it’s about them becoming great Theologians while at LU. While it’s a different field Jordan Peterson became who he is where he is. Why can’t LU produce something similar? I get the whole “We are a teaching institution “ thing. But you can have both. Tearing down and rebuilding a FOC that’s less than 15 years old while firing people in your core mission isn’t a good look. IMO that should bexpanded not contracted
I think it’s a combination of bringing up top thinkers and attracting top talent. I think part of building a robust institution is to have a diversity of experience that would come from thinkers who didn’t cut their teeth within the LU bubble. That’s just what I would look for. But that’s just my opinion on what I would want in any program.
We are probably pretty close in our thinking. I do believe there are those out there that could be convinced to come. It doesn’t have to be many. 2-3. And growing them organically should be relatively easy given the built in platforms.
The key rub would be “free thinkers” :D
#578866
Jonathan Carone wrote: June 17th, 2019, 1:08 pm
Purple Haize wrote: June 17th, 2019, 11:15 am That’s not my point. My point is that if LU wants to be what it claims to be it needs to be on the forefront of Evangelical and Christian thought. It needs to be a destination for Christian Scholars and thinkers. It’s faculty should be world renown for their thoughts on Evangelical World view. They have the resources to make that happen.
I think the two are more connected than you would like them to be. Jerry's alliance with Trump and his public statements regarding politics and Christianity over the last 3-4 years has turned off a lot of pastors or pastor types from Liberty. I have pastor friends who are Liberty grads who don't tell people where they went to school because of it. I know others who were pursuing a graduate degree while working in their church (like has been mentioned here) who decided to move their studies to a different school because of the political baggage.

My point being: you cannot be the institution you're talking about while also leading the way Jerry has chosen to lead. Most modern church leaders don't ascribe to the idea that Republicanism and the Gospel are tied together. There's a more moderate view understanding the Gospel is bigger than the two party governmental system we live under. When you sell out completely to Republicanism, you're not going to be able to attract the top theologians because those theologians disagree with your worldview.
His dad did and put LU on the map. Now if you are talking about Juniors Leadership style then that’s a different story
#578876
If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
#578878
ballcoach15 wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:35 pm If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
So no Christians can be Democrats?
#578879
ballcoach15 wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:35 pm If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
Please back statements like this with statistical data or just leave them unsaid. It doesn't add to this discussion.
#578880
thepostman wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:53 pm
ballcoach15 wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:35 pm If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
Please back statements like this with statistical data or just leave them unsaid. It doesn't add to this discussion.
By definition ballcoach’s words are statistical data.
#578886
ballcoach15 wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:35 pm If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
So by that logic, Republicans have 3 platforms: Excusing the grabbing of women by the genitals, having multiple adulterous affairs, and writing love letters to murderous dictators?

Just stop. This type of Fox News/MSNBC nonsense is what is causing all of the problems. Take a step back.
#578887
01LUGrad wrote: June 17th, 2019, 7:44 pm
ballcoach15 wrote: June 17th, 2019, 4:35 pm If church leaders are at a bible preaching church, they are certainly not Democrats.

Democrats have 3 platforms: homosexuals, killing unborn babies and flooding the nation with illegal immigrants.
So by that logic, Republicans have 3 platforms: Excusing the grabbing of women by the genitals, having multiple adulterous affairs, and writing love letters to murderous dictators?

Just stop. This type of Fox News/MSNBC nonsense is what is causing all of the problems. Take a step back.
As bad as ballcoach’s summation of Democrats was yours was worse.
#578889
That's the point. Picking 3 things that either party does and saying that's all they stand for is stupid and exactly what the crazies on both the left and the right want you to do.
#578891
01LUGrad wrote: June 17th, 2019, 8:28 pm That's the point. Picking 3 things that either party does and saying that's all they stand for is stupid and exactly what the crazies on both the left and the right want you to do.
The things you listed are not Part of the Party Platform. ballcoach at least picked platform issues. How he extrapolated them is incorrect but they are Party Platform issues
#578895
Class of 20Something wrote: June 17th, 2019, 9:18 pm I think a more fair representation is

Christian Democrats believe that the government should step in to care for people when the community(read Church) fails to do so. They believe their vote allows them to vote for compassion.
I think that’s good. I don’t agree with that train of thought necessarily but I think it’s a fair representation
#578898
Purple Haize wrote: June 17th, 2019, 9:02 pm
01LUGrad wrote: June 17th, 2019, 8:28 pm That's the point. Picking 3 things that either party does and saying that's all they stand for is stupid and exactly what the crazies on both the left and the right want you to do.
The things you listed are not Part of the Party Platform. ballcoach at least picked platform issues. How he extrapolated them is incorrect but they are Party Platform issues
Nonsense. The Republican platform is whatever Trump says today, knowing full well he'll come up with some nonsensical position and state it at a 3rd grade reading level tomorrow. Everyone will pretend that it's normal and will fall in line to avoid being named in a tweet.
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