A Sea Of Red

Some of you guys may remember the discussion about a golf course up on the mountain. But nobody mentioned ski slopes. I'm not sure if this is strictly daydreams or what? But check out this doozy of a story from the fishwrap:

Could this be Falwell's Pigeon Forge?

By Ron Brown
rbrown@newsadvance.com
June 24, 2006

Liberty University officials are considering plans that could turn Candlers Mountain into a multi-use recreational complex including a 100-acre lake, a golf course, a snow ski slope, a horse center, riding trails and a water park.

The Rev. Jerry Falwell, LU’s chancellor, said the “Liberty Mountain Development Plan” is in its infancy stage.

Falwell is looking for outside developers to serve as partners on the project, with the land being LU’s key contribution.

“We have a general master plan that is very flexible,” he said. “We are hopeful that pros that do this full time will help us create the best plan we can possibly create for this property.”

With 4,627 acres in hand, Falwell is setting aside about 1,200 acres for LU’s present and projected campus.

That means the school has 3,400 acres at its disposal for off-campus residential communities, shopping centers and a variety of recreational facilities.

Falwell envisions LU becoming “a cutting-edge university” where families, alumni, interested friends and supporters spend a few days every year with a variety of wholesome entertainment options available.

“It is my goal, if God gives me strength, to take the 4,600 acres we have and create something akin to Gatlinburg or Pigeon Forge, where Christian families come to relax in an atmosphere without alcohol, drugs and violence and where family-oriented entertainment is on every corner,” Falwell said.

Falwell said, with the opening of the new $20 million Thomas Road Baptist Church on the LU campus, the focal point of his future building plans will be on the mountain.

“We are committing ourselves now to long-term construction of student housing on Liberty Mountain,” he said. “We don’t see a time that we won’t be building there.”

Falwell has put his son, Jerry Falwell Jr., in charge of forging the development plan.

“He and his staff will be responsible to meet any and all interested parties to develop a master plan for mountain,” he said. “They are to turn the 3,400 acres into something special. We’re still tweaking. We’re talking to a lot of people.”

Falwell Jr., LU’s vice chancellor, said he is approaching the task with all options on the table.

Much of the mountain’s development will be dictated by the lay of the land.

The linchpin of several proposed projects is the expansion of a lake at Camp Hydaway, a summer camp owned by Falwell’s church.

Currently the lake is about seven acres. The university is acquiring surrounding land that would allow the lake to be expanded to 100 acres. The construction of the new lake will require the building of a new 60-foot-high dam.

The expanded lake would allow the ministry to build a water park, which could be a key amenity to an expanded Camp Hydaway.

“Right now we can have 250 to 300 kids up here on a given week,” said Jonathan Falwell, the executive pastor of Thomas Road Baptist Church. “We hope to expand to get between 500 and 600 kids.”

Just this week, a new 150-foot water slide was completed at the camp.

“We’ll invite kids from all over to come,” Jonathan Falwell said. “We want to reach out outside the church.”

The expanded lake would also allow LU to possibly field a college water skiing team, Falwell Jr. said.

The lake would also be crucial if the ministry were to build a ski slope from the top of Candlers Mountain heading north toward the city.

In the winter, the water of the lake could help in the production of man-made snow on a new ½-mile ski slope, which could also be used for snow tubing, Falwell Jr. said.

“The new lake would have a watershed of about 1,500 acres,” he said. “There should be plenty of water for snow making.”

If man-made snow won’t work, the university is also looking into a synthetic surface for the ski slope.

Preliminary engineering reports say Lynchburg’s winter climate could support a slope of man-made snow.

“The slope that we have has about a 500-foot vertical drop,” Falwell Jr. said. “Some of Wintergreen’s slopes don’t have that kind of drop. Our ski resort would be similar to what the Homestead has near Hot Springs.”

While preliminary planning goes forward for the lake and ski slope, timbering has begun to clear the way for horse-riding trails.

“Some schools in the state already have places where students can keep their horses,” Falwell Jr. said.

While he’s not committing to that, he said some type of horse center is a distinct possibility.

A trail cut across the ridge of the mountain would provide a spectacular view for riders, joggers and hikers, he said.

The church is also planning to build a mountaintop pavilion, which can be used for picnics or gatherings or simply as a quiet retreat for college students.

The pavilion will be shaped as an octagon similar to the current Thomas Road Baptist Church.

“The top of the mountain is a real asset,” Falwell Jr. said.

Last week, former professional golfer Larry Nelson was in town and expressed interest in building a golf course on the mountain.

“He’s got a development team that has built several golf courses,” Falwell Jr. said. “He heard about what we were trying to do up here at Liberty.”

In his 33-year PGA career, Nelson won 10 times, including two PGA Championships and the 1983 U.S. Open. He was the player of the year in 2000 on the senior tour.

“A golf course is something that would benefit Liberty, but it would not be something we would want to do ourselves,” Falwell Jr. said.

“We do have a golf team and that is something that would assist us in developing the rest of the property. All these things will give Liberty University something most schools don’t have.

“We feel we can become something unique in the whole country.”

http://www.newsadvance.com/servlet/Sate ... 1967&path=

Do you guys realize how rich I'd be if that happened? I JUST bought a house up right off of Candler's Mt. Rd. New contruction, about 3 minutes down the road from where Liberty Village is supposed to be. Man, I thought LU's growth would raise the property value signifcantly in a few years but if this happened it would just be unbelievable.

You are wise indeed regardless of what happens with these dreams. I have thought since I was in school back in the Late '80s that property on the other side of the mountain was among the most attractive in the area because of proximity and topography. I'm shocked that it hasn't taken off up to this point.

Hey, it worked out pretty well for Jim and Tammy

Brokeback Flamer wrote:Hey, it worked out pretty well for Jim and Tammy

Easy now, that was a water/amusement park with condos attached to a "mall". And this doesn't appear to be using donor money like the Bakkers. Its taking our resources as an enticement to investors. Big difference.

Golf course- great

Snow Skiing- insane. Will lose tons of money (Not to be a pessamist)

ski resorts up HERE take a bath in the winter if we don't get at least 2' total accumulation of natural snow; I can't imagine how expensive it would be to make it ALL winter long. YIKES

The church is also planning to build a mountaintop pavilion, which can be used for picnics or gatherings or simply as a quiet retreat for college students.

The pavilion will be shaped as an octagon similar to the current Thomas Road Baptist Church.

One idea would be to build an octagonal lighthouse as the pavilion with a surrounding grotto/park to be Lynchburg's answer to the Roanoke Star as a landmark (with public access.) (Mentioned this in another thread.) They could also play on the "Liberty Means Freedom" theme and put smaller patriotic memorials around (different plaques on stone or around the lighthouse honoring the different branches etc.; they could have a place for MIA/KIA LU service alumni) and have an American Flag flying also.

Someone also suggested to me that a clock tower with the Liberty Bell on top of it would be an interesting touch on the main campus, like many of the older established institutions.

funny thing is, a lady wrote in to the N/A the other week (letter to the editor section) about "saving Candler's Mountain from being renamed Liberty Mountain" and how glad she was that the city beat Jerry on this one, etc etc.

The usual rants from "townies"

She oughta be LOVING this right about now

I think it's funny how all of the higher ups were like "we have no intention of changing the name. We never even said we wanted to." But everyime big J mentions the mountain in the paper, which is very often, he calls it Liberty Mountain. It's his little way of sticking it to the Lynchburgers. ("But you are a Lynchburger. Yeah. So you're sticking to yourself. A little.")

I really don't like this idea, but I'm going to chalk it up to big dreaming right now. I hope nothing comes of it.

Sly Fox wrote:

Brokeback Flamer wrote:Hey, it worked out pretty well for Jim and Tammy

Easy now, that was a water/amusement park with condos attached to a "mall". And this doesn't appear to be using donor money like the Bakkers. Its taking our resources as an enticement to investors. Big difference.

Well this is the 21st century version
And YES I did own time in one of those condo's!! As for the money, past performance does not make me feel warm and fuzzy inside about ANY ministry doing these types of things. Didn't you see Fletch Lives?????

Has anyone who is still a student or lives in Lynchburg, heard anything about when they are going to finish the 3rd and 4th floors of DeMoss. New dorms are still being built which is good. I have nothing against growth, but it sounds like we need SMART growth. IMO, academics is more important then recreation. I have nothing against recreation but kids come to college for an education.

absturgill wrote:Has anyone who is still a student or lives in Lynchburg, heard anything about when they are going to finish the 3rd and 4th floors of DeMoss. New dorms are still being built which is good. I have nothing against growth, but it sounds like we need SMART growth. IMO, academics is more important then recreation. I have nothing against recreation but kids come to college for an education.

Once again, they'll finish the third and fourth floors of DeMoss when they finish the reonnovations at Campus North. Acquiring an extra 960,000 square feet for $1 kind of has a way of changing your plans. It's low on the priority list since things in that building are somewhat stable while everything else on campus is under construction. Additionally, it's cheaper to rennovate CN than it is to do new construction, which the third and fourth floors of DeMoss would technically be. When CN is finished, and they run out of room for new construction, expect to see DeMoss finished. Until we absolutely have no other space to use, there's just no point in throwing the middle of main campus into construction mode again.

LUconn wrote: ("But you are a Lynchburger. Yeah. So you're sticking to yourself. A little.")

one of the greatest commercials of all time.

I think this would be smart growth. It would make me wealthy. No, but seriously, this wouldn't be an LU theme park. It would be part of the LU/LCA/TRBC entity. So it shouldnt take away from the school too much (obviously given the proximity it would affect the school in some form or another). There's no reason JFjr or jonF can't work on this while LU's president continues LU's growth. When the project is complete, however, it would obvioulsy be a benefit to the school.

Pigeon Freaking Forge? Umpteen stoplights, outlet malls, and tourist traps. All we need now is a bunch of over-priced log cabin rentals. That ain't a dream, that is a bleeping NIGHTMARE!

AG - I was thinking the same thing. What they forgot to mention was JerryWood to compete with Dollywood. Not sure that was the best analogy to use on this. It DOES make it sound like a new Heritage USA but with a school and University!!
As for DeMoss, it has several structural and fire issues that need to be addressed and are quite costly before they will be able to finish that. Just be happy with the beautiful shell!!! Plus, you have more then enough room at the "North" campus.

PH. I, for one, have NO INTEREST in seeing JERRYsWOOD!

Insert Brokeback Reference Here

SuperJon wrote:Insert Brokeback Reference Here

Well they don't want to name it after his some then it would be Jerry-JuniorWood. Now who would want THAT name. I don't know, this is sounding more and more like a miniature Heritage USA to me. Lake, water park, golf, ski, tennis, next they will put some cabins up around the lake, then a "lodge" and start selling time share!!!

First....can you imagine the traffic and i don't really see a way to even expand the road up past Liberty Village to more than 2 lanes? This would be a nightmare. It would be a true "Fumble on the Mountain" - and i am not referring to Gus Condon.

LuConn - i will say though if this does get the go ahead....good for you and also someone you would think would have to purchase liberty village and do something with it, if all these "attractions" were added.

I was thinking about that too. That is a legal disaster. I wonder what is happening with all those folks who already laid cash down for "The Village"? Doesn't bode well for any other real estate they want to sell. I would guess they would just roll "The Village" up with the rest of Jerry USA. Of course if there were already PEOPLE in the VILLAGE you would have a built in musical group!

Brokeback Flamer wrote: I wonder what is happening with all those folks who already laid cash down for "The Village"? Doesn't bode well for any other real estate they want to sell. I would guess they would just roll "The Village" up with the rest of Jerry USA.

It's very important that everybody realize that Liberty Village is not associated with LU or JFM. Jerry OK'd them to use the name which was very dumb in retrospect, but how was he to know that would happen. And there are actually like 3 people that live in LV. Their houses were the only ones completed. The bank needs to accept the fact that they can't make their money back and just sell that place to someone who will build it. The entrance is so nice but then you get to the fountain with 5 ft tall grass growing out of it and it's all downhill from there.

LUconn wrote:

Brokeback Flamer wrote: I wonder what is happening with all those folks who already laid cash down for "The Village"? Doesn't bode well for any other real estate they want to sell. I would guess they would just roll "The Village" up with the rest of Jerry USA.

It's very important that everybody realize that Liberty Village is not associated with LU or JFM. Jerry OK'd them to use the name which was very dumb in retrospect, but how was he to know that would happen. And there are actually like 3 people that live in LV. Their houses were the only ones completed. The bank needs to accept the fact that they can't make their money back and just sell that place to someone who will build it. The entrance is so nice but then you get to the fountain with 5 ft tall grass growing out of it and it's all downhill from there.

Thank you, LUConn, for actually bringing fact to the discussion.

As for DeMoss, it has several structural and fire issues that need to be addressed and are quite costly before they will be able to finish that. Just be happy with the beautiful shell!!!

All right, Haize (Hayes), I'll bite. What are the issues? Give me specifics or I'll just assume you've been talking to Spearin again.

I find it amusing to find so many provincialist snobs on this board ("Oooh, the traffic! Oooh, the tourists!"). It's a good thing you all didn't live in the Burg 30 years ago or LU might never have been built.

seriously, you guys sound like Lynchburg City Counsel. Or worse yet, Rachel Flynn. Are guys also against signs being in the air as opposed to on the ground? Development and progress are not bad things. Weren't you guys dogging on this town for saying they didn't want a Toyota plant?

None of you are ever allowed to complain about there being nothing to do in this town ever again.